Calgary International Airport II

[Cage]

Originally Posted by Acey

I'm assuming bookings will reflect this notion in July and August, because they certainly don't in June.

Not like it's overly difficult to be the CASM of a geriatric 763, a widebody that is inherently inefficient.

From what I have been told , premium cabin loads are very good on both 850 and 844 with the larger J cabin well worth the investment, PE has very good loads. There is some minor weakness in economy, especially on the slower mon/tues/wed days. Overall June will be better profit wise with the larger aircraft.

The CASM difference between a 763 in high density 256-275 seat configuration and the 788 is about 3-5% in favour of the 788. This assumes lower capital cost burden for the 763. The 789 is better at CASM but as with all larger airplanes, the extra seats must be filled 80% of the time.

[thenoflyzone]

Originally Posted by Acey

I forget what the stage length is, but I recall there being some distance up to which even the 333 and 77E would be competitive or better than the 77L assuming they could lift the required payload; I'm guessing YYC-FRA would be under said length.

I'm not sure. Costs of aircraft acquisition aside, I've read on airliners that the 77L has a 3% better fuel burn/unit payload than the 77E at ranges beyond 2,000nm (3700 km). That's significantly less than YYC-FRA.

Originally Posted by MalcolmTucker

Need more cargo capacity on other routes?

That's what I'm thinking. Very few 77L operators push the plane to it's range limit. What people tend to forget is that it can do 4000-8000 km hauls with a huge payload (pax/cargo) very efficiently, unmatched by the 77E or A333. So if the cargo supply and revenue is there, you want a 77L on the route, not a 77E.

The only reason why more 77Ls weren't sold is because of the 77W. Nothing else.

[B-side]

For the uninformed, what does a ton of aviation fuel go for these days?

[CrossedTheTracks]

Originally Posted by B-side

For the uninformed, what does a ton of aviation fuel go for these days?

$498 per metric ton, says http://www.iata.org/publications/economics/fuel-monitor/Pages/price-analysis.aspx

[YYCguys]

Thank you Tobuz and MalcolmTucker! From the Airport Trail side it looks like a hanger! Haha! I will have to go around the front one of these days when I'm not in a rush.

[casper]

Originally Posted by Acey

Yeah you can approximate and say the 77L costs about $10k more in fuel. But with rough math, its extra J and W seats could net anywhere from $60k to $80k additional revenue vs a full 789, assuming you can fill the seats. Of course, given that the additional revenue capability is so large, you don't even need to fill them all. Theoretically, the advantage would swing back in favour for the 789 on days where ~30 or less J seats are sold. There are enough of these days for this to be a somewhat interesting discussion from our armchairs, is all.

The other factor is likely that if you own 6 77L and only absolutely need 4, do you park the other 2 or deploy them on other routes. YYZ-Europe is going to be a shorter route that YYC-Europe. Perhaps given the front cabins sell and on some days you have the potential to see a few more seats this is the best place for them.

I think some time back I flew on one of the 77L between Toronto and Germany. That was some time ago.

[MalcolmTucker]

Nm

[hoboman27]

http://calgaryherald.com/business/local-...ess-tourist-traffic-to-yyc-say-officials

Sartor said there are a number of other new destinations the airport authority is currently pursuing, including another Asian route, one more to Europe, and a new U.S. destination. He said Calgary-based WestJet’s plans to start flying wide-body jets internationally also bodes well for the future connectivity of YYC.

“One way or another, we will get some amazing routes for our city over the next three or four years,” he said. “Of that I’m certain.”

[holhm22]

Originally Posted by hoboman27

http://calgaryherald.com/business/local-...ess-tourist-traffic-to-yyc-say-officials

Sartor said there are a number of other new destinations the airport authority is currently pursuing, including another Asian route, one more to Europe, and a new U.S. destination. He said Calgary-based WestJet’s plans to start flying wide-body jets internationally also bodes well for the future connectivity of YYC.

“One way or another, we will get some amazing routes for our city over the next three or four years,” he said. “Of that I’m certain.”

Good news. Hoping for non stop to HKG myself.

[Canadian74]

including another Asian route, one more to Europe,

HKG and MUC?

[The Chemist]

Originally Posted by holhm22

Good news. Hoping for non stop to HKG myself.

Please, please, please be PVG!!

[jmt18325]

Originally Posted by Canadian74

HKG and MUC?

I thought it was CDG that had been mentioned before?

[boeing767300]

Can someone explain why the fare on the route 300 bus departing the airport is now up to $10.00. For all other CTS busses departing the terminal the fare is the usual $3.25. Who is pocketing the difference and why?

[CTrainDude]

Originally Posted by boeing767300

Can someone explain why the fare on the route 300 bus departing the airport is now up to $10.00. For all other CTS busses departing the terminal the fare is the usual $3.25. Who is pocketing the difference and why?

This fare difference was setup to help fund the service - in theory it's because it's an "express" service to downtown, but also because there's no way the ridership would be able to cover the costs at a regular fare. For employees at the airport they can avoid that fare difference by buying a monthly pass or transferring from another bus. The $10 would mainly be targeting visitors or occasional users.

[Fuzz]

Doesn't the airport take a $5 cut too?

[thenoflyzone]

Originally Posted by Canadian74

HKG and MUC?

Several possibilities come to mind in Asia. PVG, HKG, Beijing or ICN. As for Europe, only CDG is sustainable, methinks.

The fact that Sartor is so certain about these routes leads me to believe they will be operated by AC. Sartor has probably been told by AC to wait a bit longer, the routes are coming.

[YYCspotter]

Originally Posted by thenoflyzone

Several possibilities come to mind in Asia. PVG, HKG, Beijing or ICN. As for Europe, only CDG is sustainable, methinks.

The fact that Sartor is so certain about these routes leads me to believe they will be operated by AC. Sartor has probably been told by AC to wait a bit longer, the routes are coming.

My guess would be seasonal 3-4x weekly YYC-CDG on AC rouge and 4x weekly YYC-PEK on AC. Very outside shot at 3-4x weekly CX YYC-HKG using an A359.

[Johnny Aussie]

Originally Posted by YYCspotter

My guess would be seasonal 3-4x weekly YYC-CDG on AC rouge and 4x weekly YYC-PEK on AC. Very outside shot at 3-4x weekly CX YYC-HKG using an A359.

Not sure about CDG. TS just dropped it and moved the one weekly flight (which originated in YVR) to just YVR-CDG. Struggling to sell seats on a shared service only to move it to YVR means they feel they can fill more seats on another nonstop flight elsewhere.

Just remember every airport in the world is pursuing new routes... he had to say something in the Aeromexico press conference.

[thenoflyzone]

Originally Posted by Johnny Aussie

Not sure about CDG. TS just dropped it and moved the one weekly flight (which originated in YVR) to just YVR-CDG. Struggling to sell seats on a shared service only to move it to YVR means they feel they can fill more seats on another nonstop flight elsewhere.

Just remember every airport in the world is pursuing new routes... he had to say something in the Aeromexico press conference.

Just because TS can't make something work doesn't mean AC can't. TS couldn't make BUD work. AC seems to be doing fine on the route. TS pulled out of IST a few years ago, but that didn't stop AC from launching it soon after. (Now granted IST has been canceled, but that is entirely due to political/economical reasons out of AC's control.)

AC interlines with AF at CDG. That opens up connection possibilities for the route, a privilege TS didn't have.

I agree with you that Sartor could have simply been blowing hot air, but assuming he wasn't, the only logical conclusion is AC. His timeframe of 3-4 years pretty much guarantees it. That's too close to the B789 deliveries for WS to be it.

[The Chemist]

Originally Posted by YYCspotter

My guess would be seasonal 3-4x weekly YYC-CDG on AC rouge and 4x weekly YYC-PEK on AC. Very outside shot at 3-4x weekly CX YYC-HKG using an A359.

Why would another airline add PEK when Hainan is already serving that route from Calgary? Seems to me the competition would be less fierce if they chose a route that nobody else was doing yet.

I'd hope that PVG is just as big a possibility as HKG, given that it's the busiest international airport in the country (second busiest overall).