Hwy 99 Fraser River Tunnel (George Massey Replacement) | Proposed

[twoNeurons]

Originally Posted by Trainguy

The NDP campaigned on NO MORE TOLLS. I guess if you don't build any new bridges, you can say you kept your promise. But wait, they campaigned on building a new Patullo bridge. That is a Translink bridge. Just how are they going to pay for that with no tolls? Money doesn't grow on trees. I wonder which pocket of Peter's they will rob to pay Paul? Stay tuned....

Tolling Surrey essentially do the same thing. They rob Wally, so George's taxes aren't used for something George, Mr Burns, and Newt West won't use as often.

Spreading out the cost over the entire region can be done by tolling all the crossings or using general revenue. That's what governments do. I really don't see why the Patullo should be tolled. It's the replacement of an 80-year old piece of failing infrastructure.

The Port Mann was a significant enhancement, but if the Patullo is tolled, we have to toll the Lion's Gate as well. After all, there was a $150,000,000 upgrade on that bridge that wasn't tolled.

[flipper316]

Originally Posted by Zassk

I fear you are right.

Yesterday, a single afternoon truck stall at the GMT approach paralyzed all of eastern Richmond and neighbouring areas in Delta and Vancouver for hours.

• Hwy 99 was backed up from GMT over the OSB into Vancouver (and eventually there was an accident on the OSB).
• Hwy 91 could not provide relief and was backed up to Knight (and eventually there was an accident at Nordel).
• Hwy 91A gridlocked in both directions from 91 across the QBB and along Marine Way.
• Knight backed up from 91 to Vancouver and along Marine, in both directions.
• All Richmond roads between No. 4 Road and No. 6 Road were gridlocked in all directions. Eventually a crash occurred at a key intersection. No buses were getting through.

As a local resident just trying to get through this area without taking any bridge of highway, it took me 75 minutes to travel what is usually a 15 minute drive. All started by one truck at GMT.

But no, we don't need a new bridge, we don't need 10 lanes, haven't you heard that traffic is down in the tunnel?

I wish the damn hippies would read this.

[AForce]

Originally Posted by flipper316

I wish the damn hippies would read this.

They would say more buses and bike lanes will fix the problem

[p78hub]

Originally Posted by AForce

They would say more buses and bike lanes will fix the problem

No no, clearly the solution is no more trucks, and also a time machine to take us back to 1957.

[dharper]

I find it completely ridiculous the way 5 lanes have to merge down into one lane. I am glad I never have to take the tunnel and the closest I have to get to it watching Global News show the traffic conditions before a commercial break.

[Trainguy]

Originally Posted by flipper316

I wish the damn hippies would read this.

( VANCOUVER (NEWS 1130) – The BC NDP is focusing on its promise to replace the aging Pattullo Bridge immediately if the party wins May’s election.

Party Leader John Horgan says one of his first transit priorities will be to work with the mayor’s council to start construction on a replacement.

“By 2023, drivers won’t be able to use (the Pattullo Bridge),” Horgan says. “Replacing the bridge is a key part of phase two of the mayors’ plan and if we don’t get working on it now, it’ll be too late.”

He says the money would be included in his promise to provide $300 million a year for 10 years to complete the mayors’ transit plan, but wouldn’t estimate on the exact cost to replace the bridge.

The Pattullo replacement has been pegged at $1 billion, according to New Westminster Mayor and TransLink Mayors Council’s funding-strategy committee chair Jonathan Côté. )

So let me get this straight... Big John is gun ho on spending a Billion on the Pattullo bridge with NO tolls but says NO to the Liberal's GMB.... hhhhhhmmm sounds political to me. Since Pattullo is a Translink project, it would make him look like he supports transit 100% but screw the people using the tunnel because it is not needed according to him. By the way, I use the PMB daily and love the 10 lanes. Time to take politics out of transportation decisions.

[CanSpice]

Originally Posted by Trainguy

So let me get this straight... Big John is gun ho on spending a Billion on the Pattullo bridge with NO tolls but says NO to the Liberal's GMB.... hhhhhhmmm sounds political to me. Since Pattullo is a Translink project, it would make him look like he supports transit 100% but screw the people using the tunnel because it is not needed according to him. By the way, I use the PMB daily and love the 10 lanes. Time to take politics out of transportation decisions.

The Pattullo Bridge is in much worse shape than the GMT. If they don't get started on the Pattullo Bridge this fall, they're going to have to close it in five years because it's unsafe. The GMT suffers from traffic, yes, but it's not in imminent danger of collapsing.

Trying to play those two off each other shows you don't really have a grasp of what's going on.

[p78hub]

Well, both crossings are in need of replacement, just for different reasons.

I would say that the Pattullo replacement is more pressing - it could probably catch fire again tomorrow and I wouldn't be surprised. And the GMT at least has somewhat wide lanes, but the Pattullo is way too narrow for 4 lanes, no centre barrier, and no shoulders, especially with truck traffic and new cars continuing to get wider with every generation.

[Trainguy]

Originally Posted by CanSpice

The Pattullo Bridge is in much worse shape than the GMT. If they don't get started on the Pattullo Bridge this fall, they're going to have to close it in five years because it's unsafe. The GMT suffers from traffic, yes, but it's not in imminent danger of collapsing.

Trying to play those two off each other shows you don't really have a grasp of what's going on.

I think you are missing the point... The Pattullo Bridge is NOT a government responsibility. It is a Translink bridge just like the GEB. They are responsible for it's cost and replacement. The proposed GMB is a government bridge and that is why it was going to be government funded. The lines are very clear and yes I do have a grasp of what's going on... The NDP don't.. just more political games!!

[Trainguy]

Originally Posted by CanSpice

The Pattullo Bridge is in much worse shape than the GMT. If they don't get started on the Pattullo Bridge this fall, they're going to have to close it in five years because it's unsafe. The GMT suffers from traffic, yes, but it's not in imminent danger of collapsing.

Trying to play those two off each other shows you don't really have a grasp of what's going on.

There is a way to extend the life of the Pattullo... just ban all vehicles with more than 2 axles. They can use the AFB or PMB. Problem is the government doesn't have the balls to do it.

[CanSpice]

Originally Posted by Trainguy

There is a way to extend the life of the Pattullo... just ban all vehicles with more than 2 axles. They can use the AFB or PMB. Problem is the government doesn't have the balls to do it.

No you're wrong. There is extensive scouring at the pillars in the Fraser River. The problem isn't with the deck, it's with the supports. Banning large trucks isn't going to change that.

And saying that the Pattullo isn't a government responsibility because it's TransLink's responsibility is crazy. TransLink is a body entirely created by the government. It may as well be a Crown corporation like Hydro or ICBC. It's not like they're a private company.

[aberdeen5698]

Originally Posted by Trainguy

I think you are missing the point... The Pattullo Bridge is NOT a government responsibility. It is a Translink bridge just like the GEB. They are responsible for it's cost and replacement.

HAH! Of course it's a provincial government responsibility. First of all, it was the Province that downloaded the bridge onto Translink in the first place. And secondly, it's the Province that for that past several years has been throwing up roadblocks against every attempt to secure funding so Translink can afford to deal with that downloaded responsibility.

My beef with the Massey Tunnel replacement isn't so much against the building of the bridge (although I'm skeptical of the need for 10 lanes given the botched forecasting of our other bridges), it's that the government has been showering money on it's own pet road projects while at the same time starving Translink.

The Provincial government needs to step up to the plate, both for funding the Patullo as well as other much-needed transit projects around the city.

[Stingray2004]

Originally Posted by CanSpice

The Pattullo Bridge is in much worse shape than the GMT. If they don't get started on the Pattullo Bridge this fall, they're going to have to close it in five years because it's unsafe. The GMT suffers from traffic, yes, but it's not in imminent danger of collapsing.

Trying to play those two off each other shows you don't really have a grasp of what's going on.

Both the GMT & Pattullo Bridge would likely face catastrophic collapse with a localized ~7 quake. Ergo, these two Metro Van crossings I attempt to avoid like the plague - albeit I am required to take GMT, at times, over the AFB.

Regarding the proposed Pattullo Bridge, too much intra-regional political turmoil between New West and Surrey over size and scope over the years. Another example why regional highway/road infrastructure should be within MoTI's jurisdiction - not Translink's.

BTW, I understand that the province has always had their CAPEX portion financially "committed" to the Pattullo Bridge replacement. Not so with either the feds or Translink AFIAK.

[osirisboy]

Originally Posted by p78hub

Well, both crossings are in need of replacement, just for different reasons.

I would say that the Pattullo replacement is more pressing - it could probably catch fire again tomorrow and I wouldn't be surprised. And the GMT at least has somewhat wide lanes, but the Pattullo is way too narrow for 4 lanes, no centre barrier, and no shoulders, especially with truck traffic and new cars continuing to get wider with every generation.

Weren't Cars in the 70s were huge?! They somehow managed with the 4 lanes

[Stingray2004]

Originally Posted by osirisboy

Weren't Cars in the 70s were huge?!

"Land yachts". There. Fixed it for ya!

[VancouverOfTheFuture]

cars in with 1950s and 1960s were the biggest by far, and yes they did manage that bridge. people are just worse drivers now; and that is a fact. we wont get into why because i am sure some SJW will yell racism.

also, both do need to be replaced but the Pattullo is under TransLink compared to BCMoTI. so there is a jurisdictional issue. then there is the constant fighting between New Westminster and Surrey over what should be built, how it should be connected, and where exactly it should be built.

also, lets not forget that the bridges being downloaded onto TransLink was an NDP endeavour in the late 1990s. it is nice to see they want to fix their mistake.

[Pinion]

Originally Posted by osirisboy

Weren't Cars in the 70s were huge?! They somehow managed with the 4 lanes

The most popular car for young white men (especially in port jobs/rural eras) these days are giant pick ups. They dwarf anything.



Note the other cars in the back. And of course there's way more container truck traffic now that we let asia manufacture everything.

[CanSpice]

Originally Posted by VancouverOfTheFuture

then there is the constant fighting between New Westminster and Surrey over what should be built, how it should be connected, and where exactly it should be built.

Except they've been in agreement for how large the bridge should be and where the bridge should be for well over a year now. The "where" was decided a few years ago, even.

[libtard]

I find it funny that every riding in Richmond went to a Liberal and this is a major project proposed by the Liberals. Richmond residents understand how crucial this link is. What a joke that it's not being built. The bridge has the potential to be a game changer. I can see it actually generating a decent amount of money and not running at a huge deficit. Ask all the drivers stuck on 99 southbound waiting to get through the tunnel every day after work. Ask all the drivers stuck on Steveston highway trying to get onto 99 ANY direction. The whole corridor needs a rework and it HAS the ROW already in place. People will pay a premium for an unobstructed route home to Delta, South Surrey, etc. The fact that the highway has already been dug up and site prep starting and now it's going to be cancelled only because of politics is pathetic.

[Pinion]

Richmond always goes BC Liberal/Conservative because its population doesn't want pay taxes, has nothing to do with the bridge.

White Rock/South Surrey going liberal might have, especially since those in Surrey already served by a big new bridge seemingly wanted to get rid of tolls instead.