Winnipeg Construction IX

[biguc]

Originally Posted by esquire

^ RRC has undoubtedly had some spinoff effects in the area, but hardly any of it can be noticed more than about 100m west of Princess Street. It's like there's an invisible red line which can't be crossed.

I realize the main point of RRC's expansion isn't to improve the neighbourhood, but man it would be nice to see at least some sort of revitalization take place in the area between Princess and Isabel as a result of all this activity.

Between Ross and Pacific lies an unbroken spread of some of the bleakest public housing in the city. South of William, the area between the Exchange and HSC has a great upside, and Isabel has been humbly thriving. I expect it to be an up and coming neighborhood in ten years, but it's going to take a lot of inertia--or Manitoba Housing rethinking the area--for improvement to break through north of Ross.

[Urban recluse]

Definitely a collaborative effort involving many.

[trueviking]

Originally Posted by lilwayne

Is that the factory of the future

red river

factory of the future has not been designed and is not downtown.

[DavefromSt.Vital]

Originally Posted by Urban recluse

For anyone who has not been down that way in 5 years, that is basically nothing.

15 years ago, I thought by now, this:

https://www.google.ca/maps/@49.8998167,-...26AZSjfSqeWcw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!6m1!1e1

would perhaps look a little more like this:

https://www.google.ca/maps/@42.983789,-8...bZY30bVmpjGBA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!6m1!1e1

This is not exactly an apples to apples comparison. William and Adelaide in Winnipeg is a minor intersection on the far fringe of downtown. Dundas (a major east/west transit route) and Richmond (the main access road to downtown from the north) in London is one of their main intersections and is actually somewhat seedy. One of the easiest places to buy street-level drugs in London is under the Market Tower sign and on the block to the south. While the area picks up quite nicely to the north, to the south not so much. On Dundas itself, while Heroes is a kick-— comic book store and many facades have now been painted, many buildings are partially or totally empty.

I realize this example was intended as a simple comparison. However, the conditions will never be the same.

[Urban recluse]

I did not mean to imply the area should be that developed, but to not have even a slight resemblance is annoying. Hell, I would argue no streets downtown have such vibrancy, with such a mixture of so many business concerns.

I think when a significantly smaller city has a downtown so developed, it deserves dialogue.

If you go block by block using Princess, Portage, Main, Logan, and back to Princess as a border, there really is not much in terms of retail and F&B, whereas in London, and even downtown Saskatoon, enterprise is everywhere.

I would love to know what (if anything) Artis has planned for Fort Street. We cannot rely on Artis to redevelop the entire downtown. I wish more business leaders in the city would stand up and invest in the downtown. I would love to see more companies leave the suburbs for downtown.

[GreyGarden]

I agree that the exchange still has a long long way to go. However if you go block by block using McDermott, princess, William/bannatyne and waterfront as borders (obviously a much smaller space which is problematic) it seems like there is a ton of retail and little restaurants and bars, that being said they seem to be all independent and not chains. (I personally like the independence of the businesses in the exchange and I would argue that the exchange has the hottest food/beverage scene in the city, although I do understand the value of larger businesses in an area).
I too am extremely interested to find out if there is a plan for Fort st. I have total confidence that the exchange is going to continue to improve and turn into a great urban neighbourhood. I'm much more concerned about the greater downtown area.

[robertocarlos]

Originally Posted by Urban recluse

I would love to know what (if anything) Artis has planned for Fort Street. We cannot rely on Artis to redevelop the entire downtown. I wish more business leaders in the city would stand up and invest in the downtown. I would love to see more companies leave the suburbs for downtown.

Artis will continue to mop up the pools of blood that somehow wind up on their sidewalk due to the business across the street.

[Urban recluse]

Originally Posted by GreyGarden

I agree that the exchange still has a long long way to go. However if you go block by block using McDermott, princess, William/bannatyne and waterfront as borders (obviously a much smaller space which is problematic) it seems like there is a ton of retail and little restaurants and bars, that being said they seem to be all independent and not chains. (I personally like the independence of the businesses in the exchange and I would argue that the exchange has the hottest food/beverage scene in the city, although I do understand the value of larger businesses in an area).
I too am extremely interested to find out if there is a plan for Fort st. I have total confidence that the exchange is going to continue to improve and turn into a great urban neighbourhood. I'm much more concerned about the greater downtown area.

Waterfront has one boutique, and some non-retail businesses occupying storefronts, no?

Arthur Street has one retail store, Toad Hall?

McDermot has maybe three stores?

Bannatyne has no retail, correct?

Princess has the children's furniture store and Interior Illusions?

In terms of restaurants, really, not that many.

If one looks at Water Street and many of the cross streets in downtown Halifax, the contrast is night and day. Here we have a city with very little population growth over the last decades, yet its downtown is thriving. Winnipeg, with almost twice as many people, has a downtown that still struggles. I think this is frustrating, and intriguing.

[jmt18325]

There are a lot of restaurants in downtown and the exchange. A good portion of my dining when in the city takes place there.

[OTA in Winnipeg]

Originally Posted by Urban recluse

Waterfront has one boutique, and some non-retail businesses occupying storefronts, no?

Arthur Street has one retail store, Toad Hall?

McDermot has maybe three stores?

Bannatyne has no retail, correct?

Princess has the children's furniture store and Interior Illusions?

In terms of restaurants, really, not that many.

If one looks at Water Street and many of the cross streets in downtown Halifax, the contrast is night and day. Here we have a city with very little population growth over the last decades, yet its downtown is thriving. Winnipeg, with almost twice as many people, has a downtown that still struggles. I think this is frustrating, and intriguing.

The problem is that Winnipeg has so many "downtowns". It's spread out over an enormous area. Hopefully as the population density increases we will see more of what people are hoping for.

[Urban recluse]

True, and there has been a lot of poor planning (ie: if the U of M had not only stayed downtown but expanded, etc).

[GreyGarden]

I also get very frustrated that our population is what it is and our downtown is still struggling. I agree that the size of our downtown makes turning it into a vibrant destination challenging, and agreed planning has definitely played a part in this.
Haha I took another look at my radius and it was too big. Most of the retail and a decent # of the restaurants are situated on McDermott and Albert (heading towards market square). There's really not a lot of retail off these streets, but a good # of quality restaurants on Bannatyne, King and Princess. Peg Beer Co is also a gem.

[h0twired]

Originally Posted by DavefromSt.Vital

Dundas (a major east/west transit route) and Richmond (the main access road to downtown from the north) in London is one of their main intersections and is actually somewhat seedy. One of the easiest places to buy street-level drugs in London is under the Market Tower sign and on the block to the south. .

Exactly. Turn about 180 degrees and you get this view.

Not exactly the most appealing area IMO.

https://www.google.ca/maps/@42.983789,-8...-sPi4ugAbZY30bVmpjGBA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

[esquire]

Originally Posted by h0twired

Exactly. Turn about 180 degrees and you get this view.

Not exactly the most appealing area IMO.

https://www.google.ca/maps/@42.983789,-8...-sPi4ugAbZY30bVmpjGBA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

Kind of looks like a down at the heels version of McDermot west of Main.

I think OTA got it right... downtown Winnipeg is huge for a city of our size. There are many distinct subneighbourhoods and it's hard for them to all have the full range of amenities. Think about it... we have Bro-—, "regular downtown" (i.e. the box between Ellice, Main, Broadway and Memorial), the Exchange District, and what one might call "old downtown" north of the Exchange up to the CP tracks where downtown was centred before Eaton's and HBC moved the focus area southwest.

[1ajs]

instead of complaining what can you do to boost the economy for wpg and manitoba? what can we all do to build our city to a new lvl its slowly happening. inovation ally is part of this.

[esquire]

Further to my last point, here is downtown Winnipeg (from U of W to the Forks, CP tracks to Assiniboine River) overlaid on other larger cities. As you can see, downtown Winnipeg has a lot more space to fill relative to our population.

[Tacheguy]

Originally Posted by esquire

Further to my last point, here is downtown Winnipeg (from U of W to the Forks, CP tracks to Assiniboine River) overlaid on other larger cities. As you can see, downtown Winnipeg has a lot more space to fill relative to our population.

yes this is Winnipeg's challenge and has been for many years. I don't know if it is true or not but have been told downtown Winnipeg is about half the size of Manhatten. but we all get the point. that is why infill housing and development is the long game for Winnipeg. do it right and these areas could become a source of great strength.

[Urban recluse]

Originally Posted by h0twired

Exactly. Turn about 180 degrees and you get this view.

Not exactly the most appealing area IMO.

https://www.google.ca/maps/@42.983789,-8...-sPi4ugAbZY30bVmpjGBA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

At least they are occupied, and generate pedestrian activity, unlike:

https://www.google.ca/maps/@49.9023917,-...sshOmDnVSBgQA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!6m1!1e1

[Urban recluse]

Originally Posted by esquire

Further to my last point, here is downtown Winnipeg (from U of W to the Forks, CP tracks to Assiniboine River) overlaid on other larger cities. As you can see, downtown Winnipeg has a lot more space to fill relative to our population.

Yes, no doubt part of the problem, BUT, as we have discussed in the past, there is not one intersection that is the "perfect intersection", or one block with both sides brimming.

https://www.google.ca/maps/@44.6451732,-...wC4uQdyaiAaKw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!6m1!1e1

https://www.google.ca/maps/@44.6469815,-...aPxyP6VqPDUXQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!6m1!1e1

[BigG]

Last week I was driving east on Notre Dame from Arlington and noticed that the new Manitoba Clinic is massive. I thought to myself that it would have been nice if they had slimmed down the building to gain more height. Anyway, the buildings' coming along now. Maybe someone can take some photos of the view I'm talking about.