Stadiums and Arenas of Canada part 2

[SaskScraper]

deleted.. double post

[VANRIDERFAN]

Originally Posted by Oilkountry

is it? how credible is this article when this stadium makes the list but BC place and IGF don't? (also 20 other NFL stadiums)

I think the poll was for stadiums being completed or opened last year.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by esquire

I don't see off hand why Sask couldn't do it. Yeah, outbidding someone from a potentially more lucrative market for a team would be tough and for that reason I think it's a real longshot, but if Sask ever got its hands on a franchise I think they could sustain it. Much of what is being said about Sask was said about Winnipeg before.

I also think Sask could likely make it work. As could Halifax. But they'll never get the chance to prove it.

[speedog]

What is CSEG? I know if CSEC which is the abbreviated form of 'Calgary Sports and Entertainment Corporation' but CSEG doesn't seem to translate to anything.

[Hackslack]

http://calgaryherald.com/sports/hockey/n...-urges-calgary-to-work-towards-new-arena

Bettman againlobbying for a new arena in Calgary. He even met with the mayor... my take on this, while I don't agree with using tax payer dollars for professional sports, especially for multi-millionaire owner and players, I even moreso don't agree with using tax payer money to fund things like bike lanes that only a few hundred people use every year (there are are streets where I haven't ever seen bikers on the, shaganappi/Northland drive), art projects like the blue ring in airport trail, peace bridge, etc. So if the city is willing to spend millions of dollars on things like those example, that'll be used by only a fraction of the hundreds of thousand of spectators the would use the new rink, then id rather that money be allocated to a new rink rather than those other money pits... it's either they spend wasteful money on those wasteful amenities that so few people use, or spend it on something the entire city c can use, for more than just hockey, like concerts.

[Horus]

Originally Posted by SaskScraper

^^
If the same number of people that go see a Riders game in Regina, were to see two NHL games in Saskatoon that would make up the difference in CFL & NHL teams attendance, not particularly hard to believe.

It's not the same thing, however. It's easier to travel 2+ hours to go to a Riders game when the games are usually on weekends when the weather is good. This year, the Riders have 7 of their 9 home games on weekends, with the other 2 on Friday nights. So, if you live in S'toon, you cut out of work early on Friday and head down to Regina for the game.

It's quite a different thing to expect people to regularly make the trip to see an NHL game, on a weekday, in the dead of winter. Weekend night games would probably be ok. Weeknights would be a VERY hard sell to get people in from out of town. Add in that probably more than 50% of the home games would be on weeknights, and it is a tough situation.

[FFX-ME]

I'm just going to drop this here:
http://www.ctvnews.ca/canada-could-support-12-nhl-teams-new-report-says-1.630431

Neither Saskatoon nor Halifax were considered viable but up to 5 more NHL teams could be added elsewhere in the country.

[SaskScraper]

Originally Posted by Horus

It's not the same thing, however. It's easier to travel 2+ hours to go to a Riders game when the games are usually on weekends when the weather is good. This year, the Riders have 7 of their 9 home games on weekends, with the other 2 on Friday nights. So, if you live in S'toon, you cut out of work early on Friday and head down to Regina for the game.

It's quite a different thing to expect people to regularly make the trip to see an NHL game, on a weekday, in the dead of winter. Weekend night games would probably be ok. Weeknights would be a VERY hard sell to get people in from out of town. Add in that probably more than 50% of the home games would be on weeknights, and it is a tough situation.

People outside of Regina & Saskatoon often travel more than 2+hours for day trips any given weekday to go to appointments or shopping or conventions during the week such as the SARM convention this week in Saskatoon. Highway driving is a lot more common place in the province than probably else where considering Saskatchewan has more roads per capita than anywhere else in Canada.

Also Winter driving probably isn't as bad in Saskatchewan as what people in Ontario that get twice as much snow or Quebec that gets 3X as much snow as Saskatchewan any given year on average.

[Rollerstud98]

Originally Posted by SaskScraper

People outside of Regina & Saskatoon often travel more than 2+hours for day trips any given weekday to go to appointments or shopping or conventions during the week such as the SARM convention this week in Saskatoon. Highway driving is a lot more common place in the province than probably else where considering Saskatchewan has more roads per capita than anywhere else in Canada.

Also Winter driving probably isn't as bad in Saskatchewan as what people in Ontario that get twice as much snow or Quebec that gets 3X as much snow as Saskatchewan any given year on average.

Games are at night. Day trip is a lot different than going somewhere after work 20 nights a winter. NHL season tickets cost thousands more than cfl even for the cheapest. Going to a riders game you can make a weekend out of it usually.

[SaskScraper]

Originally Posted by Rollerstud98

Games are at night. Day trip is a lot different than going somewhere after work 20 nights a winter. NHL season tickets cost thousands more than cfl even for the cheapest. Going to a riders game you can make a weekend out of it usually.

3/4 of Saskatchewan's population lives within ~2hrs of Saskatoon, Season tickets sales would be heavily concentrated within that evening driving zone. Good thing Saskatchewan has highest provincial average household income in Canada outside of Alberta.

http://www.statcan.gc.ca/tables-tableaux/sum-som/l01/cst01/famil108a-eng.htm

[Berklon]

The comparison between support a CFL team and an NHL team is ridiculous. It takes a lot more money and effort to support an NHL team. As already mentioned, the price difference is big and so is the level of commitment required for the amount of games and when they're scheduled.

Plus with the NHL you need to sell a lot more tickets throughout a season. Assuming 35,000 seats for a Riders game and 16,000 for an NHL team (on the low side) - the difference is 315,000 versus 656,000 regular season tickets respectively. Plus if you include the playoffs, the maximum playoffs games a CFL team will host is 1 (sometimes none)... add 1 more if your city happens to be hosting the Grey Cup. With the NHL it'll be at the very least 2 per round. If you make it to the Stanley Cup finals, you'll be hosting a minimum 8 home games.

Big difference between the two.

[SaskScraper]

^^ that would probably take Hamilton out of the running for an NHL team then because TigerCats can't even get >25,000 to their home games..
Saskatoon & Saskatchewan seem to be able to fit your suggestion better though

[HomeInMyShoes]

^Zing.

Although none of this explains the Maple Leafs.

I think we're missing how support for the Riders might drop given another pro sports option in our equations here.

If I have $200 to spend on sports, I might go to two NHL games instead of 5 CFL games. I might go to 1 and 3. The two things are not mutually exclusive.

[milomilo]

Originally Posted by Hackslack

http://calgaryherald.com/sports/hockey/n...-urges-calgary-to-work-towards-new-arena

Bettman againlobbying for a new arena in Calgary. He even met with the mayor... my take on this, while I don't agree with using tax payer dollars for professional sports, especially for multi-millionaire owner and players, I even moreso don't agree with using tax payer money to fund things like bike lanes that only a few hundred people use every year (there are are streets where I haven't ever seen bikers on the, shaganappi/Northland drive), art projects like the blue ring in airport trail, peace bridge, etc. So if the city is willing to spend millions of dollars on things like those example, that'll be used by only a fraction of the hundreds of thousand of spectators the would use the new rink, then id rather that money be allocated to a new rink rather than those other money pits... it's either they spend wasteful money on those wasteful amenities that so few people use, or spend it on something the entire city c can use, for more than just hockey, like concerts.

No, those actually aren't the only two options. Obviously.

[HomeInMyShoes]

There are lots of options obviously. But then there are the options which are advertised by the parties with vested interests.

[Berklon]

Originally Posted by SaskScraper

^^ that would probably take Hamilton out of the running for an NHL team then because TigerCats can't even get >25,000 to their home games..
Saskatoon & Saskatchewan seem to be able to fit your suggestion better though

That's an issue with lack of demand, not lack of ability. Otherwise your point would mean the Leafs would have the worst attendance in the NHL based on how poorly Argos tickets sell.

Hamilton would have an easier time filling seats for 41 home dates simply because of there's a population of 2-3 million people within a 1 hour drive, and a lot of corporate support within that area as well. Not that I think Hamilton will be getting an NHL team any time soon (if ever).

[SaskScraper]

^^ I don't think Saskatoon or Saskatchewan will get a NHL team anytime soon either but you can't over look a market based on preconceived misconceptions either.

Originally Posted by HomeInMyShoes

^Zing.

Although none of this explains the Maple Leafs.

I think we're missing how support for the Riders might drop given another pro sports option in our equations here.

If I have $200 to spend on sports, I might go to two NHL games instead of 5 CFL games. I might go to 1 and 3. The two things are not mutually exclusive.

I think that was the initial fear when the Rush took residence in the same facility as the S'toon Blades, would a Rush fan go the next day to the same coliseum to see the Blades and visa versa.

https://johncairnsblog.wordpress.com/201...ps-edmonton-rush-moving-to-saskatchewan/

But much like the Winnipeg Jets & Manitoba Moose the Rush & Blades seem to make it work and can even play off each others success. With the NHL and CFL in different seasons, with minimal stager it sort of makes for a full year of Pro sports for Winnipeg residence along with Goldeyes baseball.

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by Oilkountry

Please drop the sask/NHL pipe dream

No, Sask could not support an NHL team. keep in mind their is less people in both major cities combined then Winnipeg. This isnt the CFL where you have to draw 30,000 people 9 times a year. This is 15,000-20,000 people 41 times a year. I don't beleive the respective cities have enough corporate support to carry the load they would need to nor they they have the population/building/nor perspective owners to make this happen. Not to mention players nor NHL would ever want to be there. Plus Canada has 3 markets that are more deserving and far more attractive on a financial level.

Are you counting the GTA and Hamilton separately?

[Dr Awesomesauce]

It's pretty clear that people outside southern Ontario don't understand the Hamilton market. As has been explained ad nauseam there are millions within the Greater Hamilton Area - Niagara, K-W, the western GTA (Burlington, Oakville, Milton, etc.) and so on. Both personal and corporate wealth are in great abundance, so neither support nor money would be an issue. The ONLY reason it hasn't already happened (and likely won't) is politics. Full stop. But then we know that already, right?

On the other hand, I happen to think (based on nothing but my gut) that a second NHL team in the GTA, would be a total flop. Why would somebody in Mississauga or Brampton suddenly start rooting for the 'Ontario Hockey Pucks' or whatever they'd be called? Do Mississaugans and Bramptonians not identify as being from Toronto? Are they so desperate to disassociate themselves from the city of Toronto and the Maple Leafs that they'd be interested in rooting for some fledgling, no-name hockey team? I just don't see it.

Hamilton, on the other hand...

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Horus

It's not the same thing, however. It's easier to travel 2+ hours to go to a Riders game when the games are usually on weekends when the weather is good. This year, the Riders have 7 of their 9 home games on weekends, with the other 2 on Friday nights. So, if you live in S'toon, you cut out of work early on Friday and head down to Regina for the game.

It's quite a different thing to expect people to regularly make the trip to see an NHL game, on a weekday, in the dead of winter. Weekend night games would probably be ok. Weeknights would be a VERY hard sell to get people in from out of town. Add in that probably more than 50% of the home games would be on weeknights, and it is a tough situation.

It's true, but looking at most NHL clubs and their attendance, local passion for hockey is a big factor in attendance, regardless of whether those people come from half an hour away or five hours away. Smaller hockey-mad markets like Winnipeg, Calgary, Buffalo, Ottawa and Edmonton generally do better at the gate than significantly larger hockey-indifferent ones like Phoenix, Miami, Atlanta (back in the day), etc.