Hwy 99 Fraser River Tunnel (George Massey Replacement) | Proposed - Page 107

milomilo · #**2121** Posted **Feb 11, 2017, 11:45 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pinion

The only reason roads are clogged is because people are controlling cars (badly) with their primitive monkey brains. Once automated driving is safe and fully adopted, road speed can be increased exponentially. Traffic jams will cease to exist. It'll start with one dedicated lane and eventually people in urban areas just won't learn to drive because they won't need to. Children and aging seniors will be able to transport themselves. It's closer than you think - at least close enough that the Massey crossing plans should be considering it.

Transit will never be preferable to private cars for most people.

This is utter fantasy but keeps being repeated blindly with no regard to reality. Firstly, you don't know what exponential means.

Automated cars won't increase capacity on roads by a whole lot. Vancouver is lucky enough to have a perfect example of automated vehicles - Skytrain. Notice how the trains still have to maintain a full braking distance + safety barrier between them, not following closely together as I imagine you think driverless cars could. And this is on a perfectly controlled system with no intrusion, not a chaotic road with pedestrians. If anything, with automated vehicles the distance between cars will go up, as human drivers often drive at unsafe following distances, while a machine will be required to drive very safely.

I guess you expect something like this:

Which is of course not in the slightest bit realistic. The slightest mishap in that sort of scenario would cause catastrophe. Just look at how railways operate to see how automated roads would have to function to be safe.

Migrant_Coconut · #**2122** Posted **Feb 12, 2017, 4:26 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pinion

And you still refuse to understand how autonomous cars work, because it hurts your agenda, but - AGAIN - this is not the place.

"My agenda?" Again, if you'll kindly scroll back a couple pages, you'll find me agreeing that a 10-lane GMB would be better to have and not need... or on the Viaduct thread, expressing concern that the City understated the numbers and we're headed for Carmageddon.
But hey, I disagree that AI vehicles will magically solve gridlock, so clearly I hate cars. I can work with that.

Computers eliminate human error and distraction, which causes 81% of all accidents. They also smooth out traffic flow, since they don't need to hesitate or drive cautiously. That's good.

Computers do NOT make the cars take up less space, or cause everybody to carpool, or do anything other than drive without manual input. It'll take a lot longer than with regular cars, yes, but you're going to reach a point somewhere down the line where roadspace gets so over-saturated that there isn't any more room for self-driving taxis. Just ask anybody who's played Tetris.

VancouverOfTheFuture · #**2123** Posted **Feb 12, 2017, 5:07 AM**

does anything think the new bridge will be renamed? will it be the George Massey Bridge? or will they name it the Deas Island Bridge. George Massey was big on getting a tunnel, not exactly a bridge so it wouldn't necessarily be correct to name a bridge after him. although for ease it would make sense to name it the George Massey Bridge.

WarrenC12 · #**2124** Posted **Feb 12, 2017, 5:17 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by VancouverOfTheFuture

does anything think the new bridge will be renamed? will it be the George Massey Bridge? or will they name it the Deas Island Bridge. George Massey was big on getting a tunnel, not exactly a bridge so it wouldn't necessarily be correct to name a bridge after him. although for ease it would make sense to name it the George Massey Bridge.

I thought for sure the PMB would get a new name... oh well. Bridges can be renamed at any time.

Migrant_Coconut · #**2125** Posted **Feb 12, 2017, 5:36 AM**

"George Massey" works just fine IMO; named after a politician loved by the Delta residents who use the road, and has brand recognition across the Metro.

And really, who else would you name it after?

cganuelas1995 · #**2126** Posted **Feb 12, 2017, 7:03 AM**

Saw a post on facebook from a news outlet regarding the bridge getting environmental approval or something. In the comments were a couple of people complaining about the renderings lacking 2 lanes reserved for light rail. I wanted to educate them on the fact that light rail would suck and to just have bus lanes instead. I resisted.

CanSpice · #**2127** Posted **Feb 14, 2017, 4:49 PM**

Nathan Pachal wrote another blog post showing that the new Massey Bridge will just push traffic to the Alex Fraser Bridge while at the same time reducing traffic over Massey to levels last seen in 1984. Remind me again why we need 10 lanes to accommodate 1984's traffic levels?

osirisboy · #**2128** Posted **Feb 14, 2017, 4:54 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by CanSpice

Nathan Pachal wrote another blog post showing that the new Massey Bridge will just push traffic to the Alex Fraser Bridge while at the same time reducing traffic over Massey to levels last seen in 1984. Remind me again why we need 10 lanes to accommodate 1984's traffic levels?

Why do we need to remind you? Just go reread this thread. All of this has already been discussed to death

CanSpice · #**2129** Posted **Feb 14, 2017, 5:00 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by osirisboy

Why do we need to remind you? Just go reread this thread. All of this has already been discussed to death

Is it because this is a pet project of Christy Clark's and there's an election coming up?

officedweller · #**2130** Posted **Feb 14, 2017, 9:26 PM**

It's in the technical reports
- you need "climbing lanes" for trucks each way, then add HOV lanes each way
- that's 4 more than the 6 required to equal current rush hour direction flow.

makr3trkr · #**2131** Posted **Feb 16, 2017, 8:38 PM**

New project renders
http://www.flickr.com/photos/tranbc/

whatnext · #**2132** Posted **Feb 16, 2017, 8:51 PM**

WRT that last image, will suck to be in that townhouse complex in Ladner just west of the bridge, sell now while you can!

Genauso · #**2133** Posted **Feb 16, 2017, 9:11 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by whatnext

WRT that last image, will suck to be in that townhouse complex in Ladner just west of the bridge, sell now while you can!

The Toigos will be building a casino just to the east of it, I don't know the current status.

The bridge is big because the ALR, in Richmond and Delta, will be developed just like Provincial land in Coquitlam was. Hopefully the Canada Line is extended straight to the ferry terminal in Tsawassen as part of the same round of development.

Actually, that makes me wonder about a high speed passenger ferry route to Seattle. I'd love a high speed rail route, but that's not happening without a cheaper way to build underground or elevated.