Chinese Investors Driving Up Metro Housing Prices

[mezzanine]

It's valid to say "we should look at the issue of foreign capital inflows and real estate" or "what is driving housing unaffordability and what we can to do mitigate it", but one isn't careful emotions get the better of people:

Originally Posted by trofirhen

Excuse me, but I think this scenario breaks with the usual (and also engrained) "we're Canadians; we're tolerant; we accept everything without a whimper; never mind that we'll never be able to afford a place of our own due to the overbloated real-estate prices; we have to FAIR, and accept everybody and everything......"

I pride myself on being a Canadian, and this IS a land of immigrants, but this skewed, artificially maintained real-estate scene has gone far enough.

Peoples "tolerance" is beginning to wear thin. And I think I speak for many.

Excuse me for sounding acerbic, but everyone has their load limit.

http://skyscraperpage.com/forum/showthread.php?p=4814870#post4814870

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Why do you have such hate for China and Chinese people?

I don't have hate for Chinese people. Far from it. I'd say about 40% of my friends are descended from people who came from China. I find calling them "Chinese" as ridiculous as calling myself "German" because that's where my ancestors came from.

What I do hate is Canadians of all ethnic backgrounds forced to scrabble for housing because government at all levels decided to make it easy for Chinese citizens to come here and by homes unchecked for decades. If you have ever put forward the rationale that land supply is constrained in Vancouver then try to justify selling it off to foreign buyers.

As long as Canadian citizen/residents have to abide by Canadian labour and environmental laws, we should not allow those unconstrained by the same to compete for scarce resources.

[whatnext]

And to add: you really ask "why do you hate China"? Where do you want to start: unchecked polluting for quick growth, authoritarian, crony capitalism controlled by a party elite, no respect for copyright or intellectual property, oppression of minorities, military threats to its neighbours...how long a list do you want?

Why would you not dislike China?

[retro_orange]

Tough to argue against those points unless you ascribe 'alternative facts' to the argument.

[Hourglass]

Originally Posted by whatnext

And to add: you really ask "why do you hate China"? Where do you want to start: unchecked polluting for quick growth, authoritarian, crony capitalism controlled by a party elite, no respect for copyright or intellectual property, oppression of minorities, military threats to its neighbours...how long a list do you want?

Why would you not dislike China?

Huh. Intellectual property rights and copyright protection aside, it sounds a lot like the United States of America and the robber barons of the 19th century (and maybe the direction of Trump's America today?)...

Unfortunately most people do not differentiate between "China" and "ethnic Chinese". When you say "China", you're broad brushing 1.3 billion people. Or do you mean the CCP? Specificity is important. Otherwise it can and will be misconstrued. And a defense that says "Oh but I have a lot of ethnic Chinese friends" doesn't alter the fact that your statement creates an 'us versus them' mentality just like a certain demagogue south of the border. After all, how many people can differentiate between a HK Chinese, a Taiwanese Chinese or an overseas Chinese born in Canada, the US, Australia or Britain? If your problem is that foreign money is unfairly buying up property in Vancouver, say so. That it happens to be Mainland Chinese investors now (or Indian investors or Middke East investors in the future) is actually irrelevant.

For the record, I think the CCP is everything you describe above. On the other hand, under CCP rule, over 300 million people have been lifted out of abject poverty within a couple of generations.

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by Hourglass

Huh. Intellectual property rights and copyright protection aside, it sounds a lot like the United States of America and the robber barons of the 19th century (and maybe the direction of Trump's America today?)...

Unfortunately most people do not differentiate between "China" and "ethnic Chinese". When you say "China", you're broad brushing 1.3 billion people. Or do you mean the CCP? Specificity is important. Otherwise it can and will be misconstrued. And a defense that says "Oh but I have a lot of ethnic Chinese friends" doesn't alter the fact that your statement creates an 'us versus them' mentality just like a certain demagogue south of the border. After all, how many people can differentiate between a HK Chinese, a Taiwanese Chinese or an overseas Chinese born in Canada, the US, Australia or Britain? If your problem is that foreign money is unfairly buying up property in Vancouver, say so. That it happens to be Mainland Chinese investors now (or Indian investors or Middke East investors in the future) is actually irrelevant.

For the record, I think the CCP is everything you describe above. On the other hand, under CCP rule, over 300 million people have been lifted out of abject poverty within a couple of generations.

"Unfortunately most people do not differentiate between "China" and "ethnic Chinese".

There's an inherent racism in that statement. Can you tell the background of a Caucasian just from looking at them? Do you lump Korean and Japanese immigrants under the "looking like Chinese" label? Why is it that some posters find an attack on certain citizens of the Peoples Republic of China as an attack on all ethnically Chinese? Why is it acceptable to continue labeling visible minorities as "Hyphenated-Canadians"? What you seek is to wall off criticism of property purchases by citizens of the PRC under the guise that it's "racist". If it were Russians buying the property I doubt you or others would be seeking to shut down the criticism using a similar argument.

[SpongeG]

Vancouver's loss. Seattle's gain.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/for-chinese-home-buyers-seattle-is-the-new-vancouver-1486500393

[LeftCoaster]

Hmm, disagree on who is losing here...

Seattle is going to have to start building new homes fast or they are going to be in the same trouble Vancouver is.

[milomilo]

Lol Seattle can have that 'win'.

[Migrant_Coconut]

Let's see how long they last before people demand a foreign buyers' tax...

For some reason, I have a sinking feeling that all the various West Coast cities will end up playing Hot Potato with these "investors" for the next few decades.

[Pinion]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

Let's see how long they last before people demand a foreign buyers' tax...

For some reason, I have a sinking feeling that all the various West Coast cities will end up playing Hot Potato with these "investors" for the next few decades.

Yep, all while being accused of racism by people who either don't care about the local populations or are so blinded by their social justice warrior leanings that they don't consider that maybe this is all about trying to maintain a healthy, sustainable economy instead of xenophobia.

This is everyone vs multi-millionaire money launderers, not white vs Chinese.

[Metro-One]

Originally Posted by Pinion

Yep, all while being accused of racism by people who either don't care about the local populations or are so blinded by their social justice warrior leanings that they don't consider that maybe this is all about trying to maintain a healthy, sustainable economy instead of xenophobia.

This is everyone vs multi-millionaire money launderers, not white vs Chinese.

Exactly! And the local Chinese population born and riased in the area are also generally against such unbridaled foreign investment (and some of my Chinese Canadian friends have actually been the most vocal about this problem out of my friends).

The real joke is that letting it continue unchecked and having a further gap widen between these foreign investors and the local population will actual fuel potential xenophobia in the future. Doing something about it now will actually help prevent racism rising out of missdirecred anger.

But sadly SJW's, just like their tea bagging equivilants on the right, are fawning over it being the 1950s again. They need to create simple us vs. them racial divides to satisfy their need to rebel and demonstrate.

Such as calling Justin Tredeau (and I guess indirectly his Muslim appointed immigration minister) "white supremacists" at a black lives matter event in Toronto. Seriously, Yu can't make this shit up. Talk about trying to divide people and burning your bridges.

[Vin]

Originally Posted by Pinion

Yep, all while being accused of racism by people who either don't care about the local populations or are so blinded by their social justice warrior leanings that they don't consider that maybe this is all about trying to maintain a healthy, sustainable economy instead of xenophobia.

Ohh absolutely! It's like accusing Donald Trump of being a xenophobe and racist when he is merely trying to fix the economy of the heartland and "make America great again"! Or like throwing dirt at Hitler calling him a jew hater when he was only trying to make Germany rise from the ashes of economic doom after the Great War by getting rid of the "rodents" that hoarded all the money in Europe.

Nevermind the local history that brought the economy of Vancouver to a halt and a government that found an easy fix to this problem. Sure, why don't we keep blaming and hating the Chinese? Moderators should encourage such discussion threads to thrive: seems to be the new normal these days anyway. Justify all we want and keep spewing the hatred.

Oh while we're at it let's put another spin to this very delightful thread:

"White people bringing in Chinese investors drive up Metro Vancouver housing prices"

We lovin their money, but we sure hate those savages!

[Hourglass]

Originally Posted by whatnext

"Unfortunately most people do not differentiate between "China" and "ethnic Chinese".

There's an inherent racism in that statement. Can you tell the background of a Caucasian just from looking at them? Do you lump Korean and Japanese immigrants under the "looking like Chinese" label? Why is it that some posters find an attack on certain citizens of the Peoples Republic of China as an attack on all ethnically Chinese? Why is it acceptable to continue labeling visible minorities as "Hyphenated-Canadians"? What you seek is to wall off criticism of property purchases by citizens of the PRC under the guise that it's "racist". If it were Russians buying the property I doubt you or others would be seeking to shut down the criticism using a similar argument.

And here you prove my point. You might be 'attacking' certain PRC citizens but the vast majority of people cannot tell the difference between a PRC Chinese or Chinese from somewhere else. And that is a slippery slope. I don't give a rat's ass about walling off criticism of property purchase by PRC citizens -- I care about the fact that ALL ethnic Chinese will get tarred with this brush, regardless of where they're from. Heck, after 9/11 in the US, Sikhs were being attacked because people couldn't tell the difference between a turban and a Gutra. I reckon it's easier for most people to tell a Sikh from an Arab than to differentiate between a PRC Chinese and third generation Canadian of Chinese descent.

My broader point is that Mainland Chinese property buyers are a symptom of deeper problems within our immigration and legal system -- not the cause. Yes, they're the ones buying now, but in the future it might be people from Russia or India. This is about how to deal with property purchases by ALL foreign investors and how to ensure a sustainable economy and property ownership opportunities for local Canadians.

I actually like the Swiss model (and since adopted in Hong Kong as well as other cities) where certain developments are off limits to non-residents / non-citizens. Would likely never happen here though.

[Metro-One]

Originally Posted by Vin

Ohh absolutely! It's like accusing Donald Trump of being a xenophobe and racist when he is merely trying to fix the economy of the heartland and "make America great again"! Or like throwing dirt at Hitler calling him a jew hater when he was only trying to make Germany rise from the ashes of economic doom after the Great War by getting rid of the "rodents" that hoarded all the money in Europe.

Nevermind the local history that brought the economy of Vancouver to a halt and a government that found an easy fix to this problem. Sure, why don't we keep blaming and hating the Chinese? Moderators should encourage such discussion threads to thrive: seems to be the new normal these days anyway. Justify all we want and keep spewing the hatred.

Oh while we're at it let's put another spin to this very delightful thread:

"White people bringing in Chinese investors drive up Metro Vancouver housing prices"

We lovin their money, but we sure hate those savages!

It is amazing ironic how you completely proved him right through your distorted rambling of a rant that was obviously a failed attempt to twist his words into some kind of racist agenda.

Most people on here have no problem at all with Mainland Chinese moving to the Vancouver area and living their lives here in the property that they have purchased. if this were truly about racism then the problem would not be limiting foreign buyers, but stopping immigrants, which it hasn't.

The problem are those who are purchasing properties simply for investments. The unfortunate truth is that due to the size of the Mainland Chinese population and their new found wealth (coupled with a distrust towards their own government) foreign investment has been flooding in from Mainland China in many regions throughout the world (Australia, Japan, the US, and of course Canada). There is no other way to say it, and acknowledging this is not racist.

And yes, if things change and it becomes Russia flooding our market and increasing prices for the local population, I, and I am sure most others on here, would have no problem pointing out that the lion's share of the issue is coming from Russia. I doubt you would use the racist term then. In fact on a smaller scale decades ago I remember there being a similar concern about too many properties being bought up by Americans in BC.

And people have pointed their fingers at our own government's poor management in this situation, and those in the local industry aiding this problem. You really think that people on here believe it is some evil plan concocted by the Chinese and we are just innocent? No, everyone understands that it has been our lack of action earlier on that has lead to this problem. So you have kind of contradicted yourself in your own rant, you said we are to blame for allowing this situation to spin out of control, and now that we are trying to do something about it we are racist?? Which one is it?

Also, as far as I believe these laws and extra taxes being put in place are for all foreign investors, not just Chinese, so where is the racism there?

I guess all the Canadians with Chinese heritage whom I know who also want tighter restrictions on foreign investors are also racist A little self-hating I guess, haha.

Seriously sometimes you act like a plant simply trying to discredit members on here who have said and done nothing racist.

Also the blahblah-Canadian crap irks me as well, but I find it is actually the ultra PC / SJW type who insist on such titles and keeps them alive (identity politics and all).

[Pinion]

Originally Posted by Metro-One

It is amazing ironic how you completely proved him right through your distorted rambling of a rant that was obviously a failed attempt to twist his words into some kind of racist agenda.

Most people on here have no problem at all with Mainland Chinese moving to the Vancouver area and living their lives here in the property that they have purchased. if this were truly about racism then the problem would not be limiting foreign buyers, but stopping immigrants, which it hasn't.

The problem are those who are purchasing properties simply for investments. The unfortunate truth is that due to the size of the Mainland Chinese population and their new found wealth (coupled with a distrust towards their own government) foreign investment has been flooding in from Mainland China in many regions throughout the world (Australia, Japan, the US, and of course Canada). There is no other way to say it, and acknowledging this is not racist.

And yes, if things change and it becomes Russia flooding our market and increasing prices for the local population, I, and I am sure most others on here, would have no problem pointing out that the lion's share of the issue is coming from Russia. I doubt you would use the racist term then. In fact on a smaller scale decades ago I remember there being a similar concern about too many properties being bought up by Americans in BC.

And people have pointed their fingers at our own government's poor management in this situation, and those in the local industry aiding this problem. You really think that people on here believe it is some evil plan concocted by the Chinese and we are just innocent? No, everyone understands that it has been our lack of action earlier on that has lead to this problem. So you have kind of contradicted yourself in your own rant, you said we are to blame for allowing this situation to spin out of control, and now that we are trying to do something about it we are racist?? Which one is it?

Also, as far as I believe these laws and extra taxes being put in place are for all foreign investors, not just Chinese, so where is the racism there?

I guess all the Canadians with Chinese heritage whom I know who also want tighter restrictions on foreign investors are also racist A little self-hating I guess, haha.

Seriously sometimes you act like a plant simply trying to discredit members on here who have said and done nothing racist.

Also the blahblah-Canadian crap irks me as well, but I find it is actually the ultra PC / SJW type who insist on such titles and keeps them alive (identity politics and all).

Thank you for posting that so I didn't have to. Vin is wrong about nearly everything he posts so if we're arguing against him we must be right.

My Indian wife will be very disappointed to hear I'm a Trump/Hitler supporter.

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by Vin

Ohh absolutely! It's like accusing Donald Trump of being a xenophobe and racist when he is merely trying to fix the economy of the heartland and "make America great again"! Or like throwing dirt at Hitler calling him a jew hater when he was only trying to make Germany rise from the ashes of economic doom after the Great War by getting rid of the "rodents" that hoarded all the money in Europe.

Nevermind the local history that brought the economy of Vancouver to a halt and a government that found an easy fix to this problem. Sure, why don't we keep blaming and hating the Chinese? Moderators should encourage such discussion threads to thrive: seems to be the new normal these days anyway. Justify all we want and keep spewing the hatred.

Oh while we're at it let's put another spin to this very delightful thread:

"White people bringing in Chinese investors drive up Metro Vancouver housing prices"

We lovin their money, but we sure hate those savages!

You seem to be laboring under the delusion that Vancouver and BC were just some little backwater waiting to be rescued from economic oblivion by the PRC. Nothing can be further from the truth. Vancouver was a great place to live, expensive by Canadian standards because of its climate but within reach of the middle class.

After being hit by the recession of the early Eighties, as much of North America was the city had bounced back to build Skytrain and host Expo '86. At the time of the Worlds Fair a nice pre-war bungalow in East Van would set you back around $120k. Perfect for families looking to start out and not afraid to put some sweat equity into it.

And then the Socreds agreed to one of the worst property deals of all time, selling off the Expo lands for a ridiculously low price to Li Kai Shing. Stupid and greedy. But even with the influx of Hong Kong residents worried about being stuck under the tyranny of the PRC, prices remained relatively stable. Not until the Red China money train arrived, flush with cash from outsourced jobs taken from North America did Vancouver's property market become the distorted mess it is today, little more than a haven for PRC money laundering.

[csbvan]

Originally Posted by milomilo

Lol Seattle can have that 'win'.

We will trade our foreign money and empty homes for their tech companies and tech jobs. I think it's a fair trade

[Metro-One]

Originally Posted by Pinion

Thank you for posting that so I didn't have to. Vin is wrong about nearly everything he posts so if we're arguing against him we must be right.

My Indian wife will be very disappointed to hear I'm a Trump/Hitler supporter.

No problem, us Trump loving racist Nazi Youth have to stick together

My Japanese wife, her family, and all my Asian friends will also be sad to learn how racist I am towards Asians.

It is honestly disgusting how capriciously people throw around the term racist these days. It is actually quite an insult to those who really have been the victims of true racism.

It is also a major reason why some people are gravitating towards blowhards like Trump sadly.

[Vin]

Originally Posted by whatnext

You seem to be laboring under the delusion that Vancouver and BC were just some little backwater waiting to be rescued from economic oblivion by the PRC. Nothing can be further from the truth. Vancouver was a great place to live, expensive by Canadian standards because of its climate but within reach of the middle class.

After being hit by the recession of the early Eighties, as much of North America was the city had bounced back to build Skytrain and host Expo '86. At the time of the Worlds Fair a nice pre-war bungalow in East Van would set you back around $120k. Perfect for families looking to start out and not afraid to put some sweat equity into it.

And then the Socreds agreed to one of the worst property deals of all time, selling off the Expo lands for a ridiculously low price to Li Kai Shing. Stupid and greedy. But even with the influx of Hong Kong residents worried about being stuck under the tyranny of the PRC, prices remained relatively stable. Not until the Red China money train arrived, flush with cash from outsourced jobs taken from North America did Vancouver's property market become the distorted mess it is today, little more than a haven for PRC money laundering.

Suddenly the huge financial bonanza announced during budget day isn't discussed here? Haha how ironic. I guess you want to believe that the locals and Li Ka-shing are the only ones who contributed to this financial bonanza that BC is enjoying I reckon? Yup, spill out all the negativities about the PRC Chinese, and then hush hush on the positive effects their money bring about. Truth is, BC's would probably be a bankrupt province by now if not for the succession of foreign money coming here.

https://www.pressreader.com/