PITTSBURGH | Development Rundown II

[GeneW]

The Cultural Trust has been pondering this for three years. In 2015, they'd been thinking about it for a year and they're only now sending out a survey about it? I'm thinking that this is never going to happen and we're much more likely to see the theaters built at the Kaufman's Building long before the Cultural Trust is done pondering.

[Minivan Werner]

Originally Posted by GeneW

Nice. That's the building that used to be the Gateway Theater until 1980 and before that was known as The J. P. Harris Theater and The Alvin before that.

What a cool building.

[eschaton]

New planning commission schedule. A light presentation this time, with two projects which are retreads.

1. Re-certification of the four permit parking zones in South Side Flats. I'm not sure the background of this, but I know many have concluded the permit zones have been a failure, insofar as they have choked off local business development in South Side.

2. Proposed signage for the new Hotel Indigo at the Pittsburgh Technology Center.

3. Exterior renovations of 301 Grant Street. The changes are pretty minor, and include a new soffit, removal of an existing fountain and sculpture, and the addition of more landscaping.

4. A revised presentation on the "Mill 19 Building" at the Almono site. The major change appears to be expanding Phase A (the building inside the old mill building fitout) from 313 feet to 450 feet.

[Bricktrimble]

Originally Posted by BrianTH

Done right, this could end up looking like a famous palace or such. Another courtyard picture:


That's an interesting idea. I keep thinking maybe you could do things like put gyms, courts, a pool, a theater, a ballroom/dining room, and so forth in the historic space, leaving it largely open. I also like the idea of maybe leaving an end section with the cells as a museum/monument--and it is not like you are hurting for space.

Then you could have wings, or maybe perpendicular detached structures with enclosed passageways, in the courtyard space. The historic building and wall are short enough that you could still have really nice views from most of the floors. An approach like that could easily be phased too, marching down the building as demand warranted.

Back to the prison for a minute. I don't know if anyone has seen the "reverse" demolition of a mental hospital in Parsippany, NJ called Greystone Castle: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=djzHvoqBRbo. The project must have been abandoned for years and they finally tore it down although it sounds like there was some opposition to it. The video is all drone video and has some great narrative. Could it be a precursor to this project??? Once you tear it down, you can't, or won't, rebuild it the same way.

A lot of great ideas on this board, but does anyone have any real impact on what happens?

[DKNewYork]

Originally Posted by eschaton

I wonder what happened to the five-story building next to it in that shot? It seems odd to think they'd purposefully demolish a mid-rise structure like that to make way for the sad row of one-story storefronts on that block now.

I have long had the same question. Maybe the building was demolished for parking and then the sad little storefronts were added...

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by DKNewYork

I have long had the same question. Maybe the building was demolished for parking and then the sad little storefronts were added...

Looking at old historic aerials, it looks like the one-story buildings were there by 1957. The next oldest shot is from 1939 - it's too low resolution to tell, but it appears there was a shorter building than the theater by that time as well. The old building (a hotel) definitely was still there in 1923 however, so it was probably lost some time between the two dates.

Edit: IIRC one guy owns all the storefronts, so establishing site control for suitably high infill at the point the market can bear it should be relatively easy.

[Private D]

^ No good reason for it, but cities all over the country did this to downtown blocks... Pittsburgh was fortunately not affected by it too much at all (likely because of lack of space). Mid-block multi-story buildings (old hotels seemed to be a common target) that were showing their age and without an owner/willingness to renovate were knocked down in epidemic fashion in the 50s and 60s in favor of emulating retail shopping plazas. Progress!

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by Private Dick

^ No good reason for it, but cities all over the country did this to downtown blocks... Pittsburgh was fortunately not affected by it too much at all (likely because of lack of space). Mid-block multi-story buildings (old hotels seemed to be a common target) that were showing their age and without an owner/willingness to renovate were knocked down in epidemic fashion in the 50s and 60s in favor of emulating retail shopping plazas. Progress!

There's a couple of absolutely horrible examples on Liberty Avenue like this. I find this one particularly awful because the party walls of the original midrise are still there, and you can tell it was a quite elegant old building, which was replaced by a single-story piece of junk which formerly held an optician (and is now mostly vacant).

[qwho]

Park 7 / Empire has a crane up today. Been out of the office two days so not sure when it actually went up. I'd walk down and snag some pictures but it is too cold.

[Private D]

Originally Posted by eschaton

There's a couple of absolutely horrible examples on Liberty Avenue like this. I find this one particularly awful because the party walls of the original midrise are still there, and you can tell it was a quite elegant old building, which was replaced by a single-story piece of junk which formerly held an optician (and is now mostly vacant).

Oh wow... I've noticed that gap before, but never took into account what are now those two vertical columns with the great brickwork -- never even noticed them as part of what used to be there. Thanks for pointing the destruction out... I think.

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by Private Dick

Oh wow... I've noticed that gap before, but never took into account what are now those two vertical columns with the great brickwork -- never even noticed them as part of what used to be there. Thanks for pointing the destruction out... I think.

I'm hopeful in that case that whenever the market warrants infill they can integrate the old party walls into the design - although my guess is they'll just cover them up with some godawful metal paneling or something.

Here's another example of "ghost" party walls, only with surface parking lot rather than a single-story piece of garbage.

[photoLith]

^
I really hope that gap gets filled in with something at some point. It's the only break on the street wall.

[Austinlee]

Originally Posted by themaguffin

So SF... Pittsburgh - I assume Boston.... wonder what the others are?

For sure Tokyo.

[photoLith]

Just drove by the former Sacs 5th Avenue site downtown tonight and the crane is finally being assembled, at least the first rung was in place tonight.

[WillyC]

Originally Posted by eschaton

The Cultural Trust is considering opening up a 4-6 screen first-run movie theater on 6th Street downtown.

If two, or at least one, of the screens aren't IMAX size then this thing is dead within a decade. I live on the edge of Oakland/Hill and will continue to drive to the Waterfront to see movies in IMAX if they just have small screens downtown. I don't feel my friends and I are representative of everyone since I am sure we go to the theater two to three times a month, but my friends will similarly skip it to go to Waterfront if no giant screens. They all live scattered across the North Shore, downtown, South Side, Oakland, and Shadyside and if you can't attract these Millennials to your theater then it's the kiss of death as far as I am concerned.

[themaguffin]

IMAX is a niche thing. I wouldn't expect that there. What I do expect is a modern movie going experience with reclining chairs, maybe alcohol etc.

[WillyC]

Originally Posted by themaguffin

IMAX is a niche thing. I wouldn't expect that there. What I do expect is a modern movie going experience with reclining chairs, maybe alcohol etc.

It no doubt is a niche thing, but it's a niche thing that Millennials dig. I do one of two things, I either watch the movie on my phone or go to see it on a supersize screen. If it's not on the IMAX, I don't go see it unless it's a film like Sicario or Hell or High Water (my pick for Best Pic eventho I know won't win), which wouldn't likely be on the downtown theater if their goal is mass audiences. So once again, without an IMAX like screen, I see it being dead within a decade because a good number people my age will have very little interest in going.

[GeneW]

Originally Posted by themaguffin

IMAX is a niche thing. I wouldn't expect that there. What I do expect is a modern movie going experience with reclining chairs, maybe alcohol etc.

I actively avoid IMAX as they play the sound way too loud and charge 1.5 times the normal price for it.

I'd assume that this theater would be more like the Manor in Squirrel Hill than one of the big multiplexes. Going more for the Hidden Figures, Moonlight crowd than for the big flashy blockbuster fans.

[photoLith]

I've only seen movies on IMAX maybe 2 times ever. It's too expensive. It's impressive yes, but I'd much rather save ten dollars. I think a smaller theater that only airs indie films and actual good films (not — like — Return of Xander Cage) would do really good there.

[BrianTH]

There's a few movies I seek out in IMAX, mostly no, though.

I would imagine this is all about the alcohol and food, both in terms of attracting a Downtown market and in terms of profits.