Sports in Canadian culture

[esquire]

For what it's worth I could live without the over the top approach to university athletics they embrace down in the US. I just think that having at least some support and enthusiasm for university sports could a) increase opportunities generally for student athletes, b) enhance the campus experience for students generally, and c) cement the bonds between campus and community.

I can tell you that one CWUAA football game is televised each week on Shaw, but the viewership is limited given that it's only on one carrier which shuts out everyone in western Canada who uses any other provider, as well as the fact that it's relegated to the non-HD channel ghetto. If I'm channel surfing on a Saturday afternoon, I can tell you I'm more likely to catch a bit of RSEQ action in HD on Radio-Canada than I am to remember to check for CWUAA on Shaw.

[dtown]

Originally Posted by Nathan

Sportsnet hasn't broadcast other games throughout the season like the agreement indicated would happen. Instead, we overall have more NCAA broadcast and less Usports.

Rogers actually does have a weekly U Sports football game of the week televised on City. I only found out about that on the last week of the regular season, and by the sounds of it, I was not the only one to be unaware. I can't recall seeing a commercial for it on Sportsnet all season.

It seems they clearly are not doing a very good job of promoting their product when it comes to U sport football. Also, I live in Waterloo and had no idea the Vanier cup was in Hamilton (45 minutes away) until Friday. Not to say that is the reason it didn't do well there, I mean I am just a casual fan and likely wouldn't have bought tickets anyway, but it certainly doesn't help the cause.

[Ramako]

Originally Posted by Dr Awesomesauce

Perhaps we ought to work backwards.

Is one of the major issues, from a media perspective, not the fact that Toronto is an absolute dead-zone for Canadian football? The Argos, the Blues and York are non-entities. If nobody's watching in Toronto (or the GTA) will this situation ever improve?

Is Toronto a dead zone for Canadian football or just football generally? I know they don't shut up about the NFL on local sports radio but I've never gotten the impression that the NFL is hugely popular in Toronto either. I think the Bills in Toronto series showed that.

And it makes sense. So many of the immigrants coming to Toronto are already familiar with soccer and basketball, which are sports showing a lot of growth in Toronto. Football would be totally alien to a lot of these newcomers.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by esquire

For what it's worth I could live without the over the top approach to university athletics they embrace down in the US. I just think that having at least some support and enthusiasm for university sports could a) increase opportunities generally for student athletes, b) enhance the campus experience for students generally, and c) cement the bonds between campus and community.

I think it was Carleton's Dave Smart who said college athletics is way overdone in the US and not done enough in Canada, fair statement I think.

I lived around much of the country and in my experience many universities are disconnected from their communities. They're like little ghettos where people in the community don't go or would feel uncomfortable going because they've usually had no reason to go there. And in my jobs I've had reason to go there, often.

I definitely will say that has been my experience only and others may disagree as obviously some places have a tradition of local folks attending football games, art galleries etc but I just don't think it is a common place for people to go.

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Anecdote time

I had a lot of people in my house tonight for the Grey Cup.

About half of the pre-game chat among the guys was about the Laval Rouge et Or and the Vanier Cup. There is a lot of interest in CIS (ok U Sport) in Quebec and not just in Quebec City.

It's a major *complement* to the CFL.

I say this and yet only a minority of guys at my party are die-hard football fans. So CIS football still gets interest from casual football fans.

FWIW, there's a pretty good awareness of AUS football in the Maritimes. This is especially true in the central areas of NS and southeastern NB where the teams at SMU, MTA, ACA & SFX are located.

With no professional football for competition, the games are reasonably well attended, and the scores are prominently mentioned on local CBC Sports and coverage is extensive in local papers. The games are broadcast live on FIBE cable from Bell Aliant.

I know that the AUS is the "weak sister" of U Sports, but its the best we have around here and the games are enjoyable.

I think the problem with Canadian football in Toronto is:
1) - the oversaturated sports market.
2) - the large immigrant population that has no clue about traditional Canadian sports
3) - Toronto snobbishness, where they view sporting contests with Regina poorly in comparison to games played with teams from proper cities like New York or Chicago.

There is a blue collar market in TO for the CFL. It's just a matter of figuring out how to tap into that.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by Ramako

Is Toronto a dead zone for Canadian football or just football generally? I know they don't shut up about the NFL on local sports radio but I've never gotten the impression that the NFL is hugely popular in Toronto either. I think the Bills in Toronto series showed that.

And it makes sense. So many of the immigrants coming to Toronto are already familiar with soccer and basketball, which are sports showing a lot of growth in Toronto. Football would be totally alien to a lot of these newcomers.

I think football fandom in Toronto is a mile wide and an inch deep. NFL games are on TV so people watch, but by and large I never got the impression that Toronto was a real football town.

Football suffers a bit from the fact that it's not an easy game to figure out... you generally need someone to explain it to you unlike soccer or hockey which you can figure out the basics of just by watching a bit on TV. Without a critical mass of fans to build that culture, football fandom just doesn't take root.

Case in point: I'm a second generation Canadian, my parents didn't give two craps about football, it was never on TV at home. If my friends didn't take me to a Bomber game and explain the rules to me when I was in junior high, I probably never would have played the game or become a fan in the first place.

[Acajack]

A few people have mentioned Canadian sports radio and I must say I am quite puzzled by the state of this medium.

I mean, English language sports radio in Canada is now almost totally controlled by TSN, is it not?

So why would TSN sports radio's national programming not reflect and support the fact that TSN's most important TV property at the moment is probably the CFL?

To be honest, local TSN sports radio in Ottawa covers the Redblacks a lot. In Montreal the local TSN station also gives decent coverage to the Als, even if they are Habs-obsessed.

But every time I tune in and it's a national program it's heavily US-focused, delving as deep as early season midweek NCAA basketball scores.

Sometimes I've actually thought I was listening to an American show (some of which they also carry of course), with the hosts reminiscing about Joe Paterno, Bo Schembechler, or Jerry Tarkanian and Bobby Knight... and then the hosts drop a subtle cue that they're in Canada.

[esquire]

^ The local TSN in Winnipeg is top-notch with the local content, they don't have Bombers' radio rights but their coverage is really good with plenty of pre-game, post-game and mid-week analysis. Obviously as the Jets' radio rightsholder they have extremely comprehensive Jets coverage.

I don't really listen to their "filler" hours (e.g. weekday afternoons) so I'm not sure what's on then... virtually no one I have ever met in Winnipeg follows NCAA sports closely except for football bowl season, March madness and maybe the hockey finals. Even then it's more about "the event" (brackets, killing time on Boxing Day, that sort of thing) than about rooting for a specific team. That's it. I doubt anyone would be listening to a discussion about random midweek NCAA basketball games involving Baylor vs. Appalachian State or what have you. It's a far cry from my family in North Carolina that lives and dies with UNC basketball... my 96 year old aunt still puts on her blue scarf and pours a stiff shot of Jim Beam on ice and settles in to watch Tar Heels basketball on TV every Saturday. I have never heard of anything like this in Winnipeg.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by Acajack

I mean, English language sports radio in Canada is now almost totally controlled by TSN, is it not?

The big market in T.O. has Sportsnet590 The Fan (Rogers) which I think is the biggest game in town. They also have SN960 The Fan in Calgary.

[Ramako]

Between Roger's Sportsnet Fan590 and Bell's TSN1050 in Toronto, the latter spends far more time talking about football generally, though it's usually NFL, and in fact they broadcast NFL games.

[esquire]

^ I guess it's an example of that corporate synergy at work. In addition to TSN radio broadcasting Argo and NFL games, TSN (the TV network) does CFL and NFL games, and corporate sibling CTV has NFL games, so naturally they talk a lot of football on TSN radio.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by esquire

^ I guess it's an example of that corporate synergy at work.

These days unfortunately that is all it's about. That's why you see Rogers either tearing down or ignoring the CFL, they don't have a stake in it and their rival does.

[Brizzy82]

Originally Posted by esquire

^ The local TSN in Winnipeg is top-notch with the local content, they don't have Bombers' radio rights but their coverage is really good with plenty of pre-game, post-game and mid-week analysis. Obviously as the Jets' radio rightsholder they have extremely comprehensive Jets coverage.

I don't really listen to their "filler" hours (e.g. weekday afternoons) so I'm not sure what's on then... virtually no one I have ever met in Winnipeg follows NCAA sports closely except for football bowl season, March madness and maybe the hockey finals. Even then it's more about "the event" (brackets, killing time on Boxing Day, that sort of thing) than about rooting for a specific team. That's it. I doubt anyone would be listening to a discussion about random midweek NCAA basketball games involving Baylor vs. Appalachian State or what have you. It's a far cry from my family in North Carolina that lives and dies with UNC basketball... my 96 year old aunt still puts on her blue scarf and pours a stiff shot of Jim Beam on ice and settles in to watch Tar Heels basketball on TV every Saturday. I have never heard of anything like this in Winnipeg.

I know one guy with huge basement/bar that is a total shrine to Ohio State. It's actually very impressive. Multiple TV screens and a giant HD projector, tons of memorbilia on the walls. But yeah, not really common to find die-hards like that in Winnipeg by any means.

[esquire]

^ That's wild, and definitely unusual.

I've known plenty of NFL diehards who make annual trips to see their favourite teams, a couple even have season tickets. Apart from a couple of guys I know who have declared favourite NCAA football teams (and could probably even answer some basic trivia questions about those teams), though, interest in NCAA is fairly minimal apart from those with an interest in certain prospects relevant to their preferred NFL teams. So, to Acajack's point, I don't know who all that indepth NCAA coverage around here is really intended for...

[Nathan]

^Conditioning for future fandom. It's infinitely cheaper to just buy the finished product from American media than for Canadian media to invest and build up a Canadian product.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by Nathan

^Conditioning for future fandom. It's infinitely cheaper to just buy the finished product from American media than for Canadian media to invest and build up a Canadian product.

And that's how stupid these guys are because they could build an industry providing jobs for thousands more like we did in music. It's why our feature film industry is almost non existent.

Does this post get deleted as well?

[GreaterMontréal]

Originally Posted by elly63

And that's how stupid these guys are because they could build an industry providing jobs for thousands more like we did in music. It's why our feature film industry is almost non existent.

Does this post get deleted as well?

the Quebec film industry is in good shape.

[BretttheRiderFan]

I think the argument that Toronto's diversity works against the Argos is a bit weak when you consider the Leafs and Jays demographics are both overwhelmingly what you'd call "old stock Canadians".

In the early 2000s when the Argos actually drew decently (around 30k a game) they were known in Toronto for being really involved in the community and reaching out to people who weren't necessarily traditional football fans. Do they still have this reputation? What changed?

[BretttheRiderFan]

Here in Edmonton I think exposure for the Golden Bears football team is about equal to or maybe less than the Huskies and Wildcast junior teams. I'm sure a lot of that has to do with the U of A's futility in football.

I've been meaning to attend a game at Foote Field for the two years I've lived here, but still haven't actually gotten around to it.

[Dr Awesomesauce]

Originally Posted by BretttheRiderFan

I think the argument that Toronto's diversity works against the Argos is a bit weak when you consider the Leafs and Jays demographics are both overwhelmingly what you'd call "old stock Canadians".

In the early 2000s when the Argos actually drew decently (around 30k a game) they were known in Toronto for being really involved in the community and reaching out to people who weren't necessarily traditional football fans. Do they still have this reputation? What changed?

Pinball?