YVR Airport & Sea Island Developments Discussion

[Gordon]

I can't find any info on Acs yvr psp service on its website what dates does the flight operate & what type of plane are they using. theyt could use an
a 321

[CareerShow]

Originally Posted by Gordon

I can't find any info on Acs yvr psp service on its website what dates does the flight operate & what type of plane are they using. theyt could use an
a 321

Day 3 and 7 on a Rouge 767, last year was 6 weekly on a Rouge a319, and the year before that was a 3 weekly Rouge a319.

[Gordon]

That seems to be alot of plane for the route

West Jet fluctuates between daily & 3 times daily between now & mid Feb.

source yvr.ca\flight schedules.

West Jet should use a 767 on it's YVR HNL route.

[Johnny Aussie]

AC increases PHX to 4 weekly and PSP to 3 weekly in February.

PHX ops days 1,2,4,6 and PSP 3,5,7.

[CareerShow]

Originally Posted by Johnny Aussie

AC increases PHX to 4 weekly and PSP to 3 weekly in February.

PHX ops days 1,2,4,6 and PSP 3,5,7.

Why wouldn't AC rotate a smaller aircraft say a319 Rouge through PSP and PHX with Toronto and increase frequency. I wouldn't be surprised to see these two routes mainlined in the next few years. 763 Rouge are probably better served flying elsewhere.

[Johnny Aussie]

Originally Posted by CareerShow

Why wouldn't AC rotate a smaller aircraft say a319 Rouge through PSP and PHX with Toronto and increase frequency. I wouldn't be surprised to see these two routes mainlined in the next few years. 763 Rouge are probably better served flying elsewhere.

There are three rouge 763s based in YVR during the winter:

1) rotates daily through LAS and HNL/KOA
2) rotates daily through PHX/PSP and OGG
3) rotates daily (6 weekly) to Mexico (CUN PVR SJD or ZIH)

They need to send the 763s somewhere during the day after they arrive from Hawaii so I suppose PHX and PSP were the most likely candidates based on timing and pax volume.

The only rouge 319 YVR sees in the winter is the second daily LAS.

[CareerShow]

Originally Posted by Johnny Aussie

There are three rouge 763s based in YVR during the winter:

1) rotates daily through LAS and HNL/KOA
2) rotates daily through PHX/PSP and OGG
3) rotates daily (6 weekly) to Mexico (CUN PVR SJD or ZIH)

They need to send the 763s somewhere during the day after they arrive from Hawaii so I suppose PHX and PSP were the most likely candidates based on timing and pax volume.

The only rouge 319 YVR sees in the winter is the second daily LAS.

That explains the rotation but I would still like to see both routes with a higher frequency on a smaller aircraft. More frequency with smaller aircrafts is typically more desirable in my opinion.

[Johnny Aussie]

Originally Posted by CareerShow

That explains the rotation but I would still like to see both routes with a higher frequency on a smaller aircraft. More frequency with smaller aircrafts is typically more desirable in my opinion.

I think the issue is they can't rotate too many aircraft to cover western routes. Airlines open and close bases all the time. When more a/c are transferred to rouge, including 321s, perhaps they may base a couple in YVR. For now it's all 763s.

[Gordon]

Rouge has at least 1 A321 based @ yvr i saw it a coup;e of weeks ago.

[Cage]

Originally Posted by Gordon

Rouge has at least 1 A321 based @ yvr i saw it a coup;e of weeks ago.

The aircraft and crew is based in YYZ for the A321 you saw in YVR. From a workforce scheduling perspective. AC routinely gets into a bind where there are more planes or crews in one bucket and a shortage in another bucket. The solution is to tail swap where possible to resolve the operational issues. A321 get swapped for 763s at both mainline and rouge. At rouge the 321 can also get swapped for 319.

[Gordon]

I think that 321 was headed for vegas

[Cage]

Originally Posted by CareerShow

(1) Why wouldn't AC rotate a smaller aircraft say a319 Rouge through PSP and PHX with Toronto and increase frequency.

(2) I wouldn't be surprised to see these two routes mainlined in the next few years. 763 Rouge are probably better served flying elsewhere.

(1) AC has tried routing rouge 319s on the YYZ-SAN-YVR run before, the departure and arrival times inorder to make the schedule route are not optimal and barely commercially viable on the YVR end. Additionally the crew pairings out of YYZ are brutal or completely inefficient (coin toss as to which of the two options is least favourable).

(2) to get maximum flying time with maximum schedule efficiency its best to schedule your widebody aircraft on split between longhaul and shorthaul and then back to longhaul. The alternative is to schedule two longhaul segments with a 5-6 hour dwell time in the middle.

Longhaul to longhaul with little turnaround time is what got WS into trouble with their 763 operation. Where other airlines differ is that they schedule enough downtime to maintain schedule cohesion.

It is for this reason that you will continue to see Rouge 763 doing longhaul international paired with short haul Western North America flying.

[rxp]

Originally Posted by Johnny Aussie

OK. I'm saying there WILL be more announcements...

What I was saying above is WHAT IF there weren't any more announcements to come in the near future... Would that be such a horrible thing?

Smile people the future is rosy despite those focussed on the negative.

how big is it then? give us a comparison...

[Johnny Aussie]

Just saw on airlineroute.net tweet that YVR-DUB is reverting back to 3 weekly only.

This now puts YVR-NGO and YVR-DUB on a combined daily footing.
YVR-DUB will op 135 and YVR-NGO will op 2467.

Based on my calcs there is still one unallcoated 763 next summer.. will it get based in YYZ, YUL or YVR?

[stiffdeadman]

i see today eurowings is going to start summer seasonal service from cologne to seattle 3 times a week. wonder if vancouver is on their radar?

[teriyaki]

Originally Posted by stiffdeadman

i see today eurowings is going to start summer seasonal service from cologne to seattle 3 times a week. wonder if vancouver is on their radar?

Considering LH already flies to YVR from 2 cities with AC also joining in the action, don't think they'll in too much of a hurry to jeopardize their golden goose.

[YVR Bruce]

I see an inbound from Everett at 07:00 tomorrow.
Is that how deliveries of new 789s show up?

[excel]

Yes that is Paine Field. Home to the Boeing Everett Factory. The largest building in the world




https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_Everett_Factory

[Klazu]

Originally Posted by excel

Yes that is Paine Field. Home to the Boeing Everett Factory. The largest building in the world

It's largest by volume and one of the biggest by floor space. We did the Boeing factory tour two years ago and I would highly recommend it. Staying in a hotel next to the factory was also really nice as there are brand new planes taking off the whole evening. Feeling the rumble of spanking-new 747-8 taking off is amazing.





There are also some really exotic tails to spot on the airfield.







They assemble all Boeing's wide-body aircrafts in Everett: 747, 767, 777 and 787. All 737's are assembled in Renton, south of Seattle.



I have some more photos in here, but unfortunately photography inside the factory is forbidden.

Here's also a nice video of Boeing's centennial celebrations few weeks ago with some cool 3D projections.

• Video Link

[Alpine]

I just found out that AC56/57 (YYZ-DXB) has been upgauged from a 789 to a 77W through the end of February 2017.

With this increase in capacity, I'm really cheesed that AC and the Trudeau government are not willing to re-negotiate bilaterals with the UAE or Turkey and that Vancouver still doesn't have a direct flight to a Gulf destination or Istanbul, which is a few hours' flight time to most of the world's population. This is even considering:

• The return of nonstop YVR-DEL
• The state fuel subsidies that the ME3 get
• The lack of O/D (or even business travel) traffic between Vancouver and the UAE--in aviation terms, Vancouver is the northern hemisphere's New Zealand; far away from everywhere else. At least SEA-DXB is justified because the flights ship cargo parts for a Boeing fleet based at Dubai International Airport.
• How the ME3 massacred QF's longhaul market share
• The political unrest in Turkey making a YVR-IST flight more of a can of worms
• The AC/AS codeshare for YVR-SEA-DXB routings

Moreover, why isn't connecting traffic considered in bilateral negotiations? A bit of protectionism isn't bad sometimes but this reminds me of the previous Conservative government keeping Verizon out of the country way back when. I think there is protectionism going on not only in favour of AC, but of its *A partners, since YVR is an *A hub, and (I don't have hard numbers for this but this is just my hunch) MENASA is a popular onward destination for LH493 and CA992 pax. A thrice weekly 789 or 343 to DXB (or DOH or even AUH) isn't going to trigger the bottom dropping out of the market.

In fact, if AC72/73 becomes a permanent route (and not just a seasonal one), it will actually soak up a lot of YVR-MENASA demand (even from CZ/LH/KL/CX or newcomers like AF) and the more recent additions like AF) since most on hypothetical YVR-Gulf/Turkey flights would be heading to the subcontinent. TK is a *A partner and has a local partner in Air Canada. A 3-4x weekly 333 to IST and one 3x weekly route to a Gulf destination (either DXB, AUH or DOH) on a 789 (EY/QR) or a 343 (QR) would be a reasonable complement to a year-round YVR-DEL, to cover other destinations in MENASA and Sub-Saharan Africa like BOM, CAI, ADD, BAH, JNB, TLV, BEY, CPT, LOS, CMN, etc. An EK 77W would be dicey, they're really high-density.

Alas, I've heard that the ME3 want multiple A380s to YVR a day, or nothing, if they're even going to bring up the idea of bilaterals. I don't know if it's true, but I wouldn't doubt it.

I would like to know where I can find hard numbers (if they're available) on what the most popular MENASA onward destinations are on direct longhaul flights leaving YVR. It would be very interesting to see. If they're locked away behind academic journal paywalls, that's okay because I have access to university library databases.