SLC: Performing Arts Center and 111 Tower

[s.p.hansen]

It seems counter intuitive to shield the pouring and mixing of alcoholic beverages if the intent is to dissuade those under the age of 21 of an interest in consumption. And here's why; a zion curtain or ceiling takes something uninteresting and surrounds it in mystery. Kind of like how craftsmen created secret societies to make things like stone masonry more prestigious and exciting. Constructing a veil or holy of holies around the craft of bartending not only makes it secret, it also makes it sacred. And if young people start thinking of bartending as sacred and drinking as a form of initiation, then it becomes even more irresistible as a right of passage into the mystery of adulthood.

[Future Mayor]

Originally Posted by s.p.hansen

It seems counter intuitive to shield the pouring and mixing of alcoholic beverages if the intent is to dissuade those under the age of 21 of an interest in consumption. And here's why; a zion curtain or ceiling takes something uninteresting and surrounds it in mystery. Kind of like how craftsmen created secret societies to make things like stone masonry more prestigious and exciting. Constructing a veil or holy of holies around the craft of bartending not only makes it secret, it also makes it sacred. And if young people start thinking of bartending as sacred and drinking as a form of initiation, then it becomes even more irresistible as a right of passage into the mystery of adulthood.

I agree 100% that it has the negative effect. I'm not sure I agree with the Holy of Hollies reference though. I've been saying similar things for years. It's makes something normal into something taboo, which then doesn't need to be talked about between parents and children because it's shielded and creates no need for education or dialogue, which results in it being even more taboo. When a child then hits a rebellious phase they are apt to rebel in ways that seem taboo to them.

[s.p.hansen]

Originally Posted by Future Mayor

I agree 100% that it has the negative effect. I'm not sure I agree with the Holy of Hollies reference though.

It's a play on the purpose of a Temple.

You're setting it apart and only those initiated can pour or witness the pouring.

[Orlando]

Some of you are making a huge stink over this than it really should be. It's a lid over the tiny bar in the lobby. Done.

[scottharding]

Originally Posted by Orlando

Some of you are making a huge stink over this than it really should be. It's a lid over the tiny bar in the lobby. Done.

Physically, yes. But it represents so much more.

[Old&New]

Why don't we just educate kids about alcohol (and marijuana) and teach them that it's not a great idea to imbibe until their brains have fully developed (mid-20's). And then let them make their own decisions. Why do we have to hide the consumption of alcohol by adults from them? Why are children in Utah purposefully starved of facts?

[justiny]

Originally Posted by Orlando

Some of you are making a huge stink over this than it really should be. It's a lid over the tiny bar in the lobby. Done.

I disagree.

It is a ridiculous law which is religiously based and has no scientific evidence to support it's own intent (which is actually masked, cleverly, to not offend a certain demographic by legislative means).

Architects and designers have spent countless hours in creating a beautiful, brand new theater foyer, only to have a state ordinance mandate something absurd like putting a Speedo on the David.

Once again, a very vocal minority manages to influence and scar a public, tax-payer dollars project in a way so that something perfectly legal does not offend them.

You call it a lid on a tiny bar in the lobby. I call it a lid on common-🞵🞵🞵🞵🞵🞵🞵 sense.

[Orlando]

Originally Posted by justiny

I disagree.

It is a ridiculous law which is religiously based and has no scientific evidence to support it's own intent (which is actually masked, cleverly, to not offend a certain demographic by legislative means). '
Architects and designers have spent countless hours in creating a beautiful, brand new theater foyer, only to have a state ordinance mandate something absurd like putting a Speedo on the David.

Once again, a very vocal minority manages to influence and scar a public, tax-payer dollars project in a way so that something perfectly legal does not offend them.

You call it a lid on a tiny bar in the lobby. I call it a lid on common-🞵🞵🞵🞵🞵🞵🞵 sense.

Umm... the influences in this state are definitely not a minority. Hey man, I'm in the minority up here in Seattle. My coworkers go to bars all the time, and we have happy hour at our office every week. I occasionally will go to a bar with them. In Utah, it's a little more modest. But, compare that to living in the middle east. Just putting it into a larger perspective.

[Stenar]

Originally Posted by justiny

I disagree.

It is a ridiculous law which is religiously based and has no scientific evidence to support it's own intent (which is actually masked, cleverly, to not offend a certain demographic by legislative means).

Architects and designers have spent countless hours in creating a beautiful, brand new theater foyer, only to have a state ordinance mandate something absurd like putting a Speedo on the David.

Once again, a very vocal minority manages to influence and scar a public, tax-payer dollars project in a way so that something perfectly legal does not offend them.

You call it a lid on a tiny bar in the lobby. I call it a lid on common-🞵🞵🞵🞵🞵🞵🞵 sense.

AMEN brother.

[Stenar]

Originally Posted by Orlando

Umm... the influences in this state are definitely not a minority. Hey man, I'm in the minority up here in Seattle. My coworkers go to bars all the time, and we have happy hour at our office every week. I occasionally will go to a bar with them. In Utah, it's a little more modest. But, compare that to living in the middle east. Just putting it into a larger perspective.

I took his 'vocal minority' reference as this: The people who run DABC and support their arcane rules are a minority. Polls of general Mormons think things like the Zion Curtain are pointless and unnecessary. So, while Mormonism as a monolith is not a minority, the few legislators, employees, and few citizens who support these bizarre contraptions are a vocal minority within the local power structure.

[ThePusherMan]

Originally Posted by Orlando

Umm... the influences in this state are definitely not a minority. Hey man, I'm in the minority up here in Seattle. My coworkers go to bars all the time, and we have happy hour at our office every week. I occasionally will go to a bar with them. In Utah, it's a little more modest. But, compare that to living in the middle east. Just putting it into a larger perspective.

The mormon population in SLC is absolutely a minority and although the Zion Curtain is a state law, it is the most unpopular law on the books. Last legislative session it polled at 80% support for getting rid of the law state wide. THAT is a minority! The bottom line is that it's got to go. It's about 4 years over due. If SLARA or some other org got the money together to make it a ballot initiative it would be gone in a heartbeat. Legislators just don't want to look silly for nixing a law that they put into place less than a decade ago.

[wrendog]

As an active mormon myself, I haven't met a single mormon (family, friends or otherwise) who think the alcohol laws are even remotely reasonable in Utah.

They are dumb. Plain and simple.

[Comrade]

Originally Posted by Orlando

Some of you are making a huge stink over this than it really should be. It's a lid over the tiny bar in the lobby. Done.

It's not just a lid over a tiny bar. It represents everything wrong with Utah's liquor laws and why the state has such a bad rap nationally.

[ToysNoiz]

Seeing as how the tower is complete and open, I suppose that this thread can now be about our liquor laws.

[Liberty Wellsian]

I see it as an additional cost that hurts our restaurants. It's just one more thing that makes investing in an already risky business that more risky. Liberalization of our liquor laws will give us more gastronomical choices. I'm certain of it.

[TonyAnderson]

Originally Posted by Old&New

Why don't we just educate kids about alcohol (and marijuana) and teach them that it's not a great idea to imbibe until their brains have fully developed (mid-20's). And then let them make their own decisions. Why do we have to hide the consumption of alcohol by adults from them? Why are children in Utah purposefully starved of facts?

Exactly. Alcohol is very, very bad for you. Until you're 21 when it becomes very, very good for you. It's science.

[i-215]

Originally Posted by Comrade

It's not just a lid over a tiny bar. It represents everything wrong with Utah's liquor laws and why the state has such a bad rap nationally.

Agreed. I don't even drink and I feel embarrassed about our liquor laws. It must be very frustrating to watch an out-of-state client/colleague jump through hoops just to have a glass of beer with their nachos.

[goldcntry]

And in other related news, I get to perform on the Eccles stage in a couple of weeks!

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/86566...adcast-live-from-new-Eccles-Theater.html

[EPdesign]

Originally Posted by Comrade

It's not just a lid over a tiny bar. It represents everything wrong with Utah's liquor laws and why the state has such a bad rap nationally.

I agree with Comrade.

[Old&New]

Originally Posted by TonyAnderson

Exactly. Alcohol is very, very bad for you. Until you're 21 when it becomes very, very good for you. It's science.

It sure gives you an appreciation for the brain and how easily it is manipulated, which may also help you recognize other manipulative forces in your life. I think this is why some manipulative organizations are so prohibition against it.

Sometimes, if I'm concerned that I have eaten some food that may have contained micro organisms, I will have a shot of Vodka or Tequila as a preventative measure against illness. Or sometimes a glass or two of wine at a dinner party or dinner date can not only enhance the flavor of your meal, but can also enhance conversation and break down social barriers.

Getting buzzed is something people should experience at least once in their lives. Same with getting high on vaporized marijuana, which is not addictive and not unhealthy. But stay away from cigarettes, those are just stinky, dirty, and gross.