The Vancouver Business Thread

[Tfreder]

Originally Posted by whatnext

So you think building an economy on the inability of some workers to get visas into the USA is a great idea? Microsoft's Vancouver office is known internally as Ellis Island, ie. an immigration waiting area until the occupiers can get into their #1 choice.

Since when did 50 jobs equate building an economy?

Facebook's Vancouver office/ visa holding pen is the exception, not the standard. Let's wait before we jump to conclusions. From what I've heard, Boeing's current Vancouver operations hires quite a few locals, so I don't see why that would change.

[sunsetmountainland]

Originally Posted by Caliplanner1

I'm very busy and being no longer an active academic researcher (being retired etc.) it has taken me awhile to get back with you. So you are asking for "demonstrated" evidence. OK,..here goes. If I wanted veracity for my assertions I'd first look at average annual wage data in (preferably) Vancouver or B.C. (if that's the best available data). I'd then ascertain from bankers the minimum annual wages needed to to be able to get a minimum home loan in Vancouver. If the average wages in the city falls below the average wages required for the cheapest home loan then you have yourself an economic mismatch. The links provided below tell such a story in reflecting such mismatch where Vancouver (with a recent average annual disposable income of just $30,000) is chasing average home prices close to a million dollars which requires a higher average income all while having Canada's longest home buying savings period of over 11 years:

http://www.moneysense.ca/canadas-best-places-to-live-2014-full-ranking/

http://www.statcan.gc.ca/tables-tableaux/sum-som/l01/cst01/famil108a-eng.htm $77,000

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2014/03/29/detached-house-prices-canada_n_5051516.html

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2015/01/11/income-needed-to-buy-house-canada_n_6445932.html

I am very happy to understand that you have retired and find yourself very busy. Not many can say that from what I have heard.
Perhaps you are retired because you were not a very good academic researcher.

Your quote:

The hidden story with B.C.'s great national economic/employment numbers though is the local rate of (imported) inflation vis-a-vis slow/low domestic/provincial wage growth.

Now you had made an effort which I would like to congratulate you on.

You have too understand demographics with growth in the province because of jobs, people tend too look to purchase houses.

Location it is very important especially being located close too the growing economies of Asia.

Now equity do you know what that is? Most people whom have houses in Vancouver have this asset.
I have always thought that it is not how much money you make but what you do with this money you make!

[Caliplanner1]

Originally Posted by sunsetmountainland

I am very happy to understand that you have retired and find yourself very busy. Not many can say that from what I have heard.
Perhaps you are retired because you were not a very good academic researcher.

Your quote:

Now you had made an effort which I would like to congratulate you on.

You have too understand demographics with growth in the province because of jobs, people tend too look to purchase houses.

Location it is very important especially being located close too the growing economies of Asia.

Now equity do you know what that is? Most people whom have houses in Vancouver have this asset.
I have always thought that it is not how much money you make but what you do with this money you make!

I have reached retirement age and have no longer a need to work 9-5 (given my generous retirement benefits etc.)....so there for your groundless (obviously ignorant pro right wing influenced) assumption that I'm not a good academic researcher,....hence my retirement etc.. lol

As far as being "busy"....I'm busy taking care of family/personal (hobby) interests, part-time teaching and business investments. I'm thus not tied to this forum as some here might be.

As for your rambling above.....you make no sense. BTW,...many Vancouverites with high house equity are retired and living on relatively low fixed incomes. If these retirees were to sell their homes they would have to move away from Vancouver being unable to find affordable housing.

[LeftCoaster]

Originally Posted by whatnext

So you think building an economy on the inability of some workers to get visas into the USA is a great idea? Microsoft's Vancouver office is known internally as Ellis Island, ie. an immigration waiting area until the occupiers can get into their #1 choice.

Where anywhere did it say this was a visa play?

The answer is nowhere because this isn't. This is a homegrown company that Boeing bought because it was well run and now they are expanding on its expertise. This is a good news story no matter how you want to spin it with your endless negativity.

[officedweller]

The Duke of Westminster's influence in Metro Vancouver: A look at Grosvenor
http://vancouversun.com/business/local-b...e-in-metro-vancouver-a-look-at-grosvenor

*************

Coast Hotel chain to change hands for $210 million
http://vancouversun.com/business/local-business/coast-hotel-chain-to-change-hands-for-210-million

[sunsetmountainland]

Originally Posted by Caliplanner1

I have reached retirement age and have no longer a need to work 9-5 (given my generous retirement benefits etc.)....so there for your groundless (obviously ignorant pro right wing influenced) assumption that I'm not a good academic researcher,....hence my retirement etc.. lol

As far as being "busy"....I'm busy taking care of family/personal (hobby) interests, part-time teaching and business investments. I'm thus not tied to this forum as some here might be.

As for your rambling above.....you make no sense. BTW,...many Vancouverites with high house equity are retired and living on relatively low fixed incomes. If these retirees were to sell their homes they would have to move away from Vancouver being unable to find affordable housing.

Again, congratulations on your retirement! My assumptions on your research was based on your argument in this business Vancouver section. That at least shows fact at how poor your argument was.

I think your argument was based on Vancouver real estate which is fine since this is a business vancouver thread.

However the whole premise was about the whole province. Those that own real estate are really not the problem that you make it out too be. Even if on fixed income . If you own real estate in Vancouver you are not poor.

The real argument was about the fact that B.C. has had a very positive results in jobs both part time and full time. With a 3.7% year over year growth as well as real numbers of 84,700. Now that represents 40,000 full time as well as 44,800 part time jobs.

Zahav quote

The Stats Can labour report came out on Friday, and BC is so far ahead of the rest of Canada in all good measures. It has been for some time, but the gap seems to be widering, and BC is accounting for almost all the job growth in the country still. Last months Canada wide stats were horrible as unemployment rose considerably, and Ontario faultered. Of course Alberta is still struggling, their unemployment was to 8.6%, while BC dropped to 5.6%. 3 percentage points difference, I think that's probably close to a record, if not the record. See below for more. I hope things will keep going well, or if there is some slowdown, that it be mild. Right now, for probably the first time in decades or more, BC has the lowest unemployment rate, the highest employment growth, the highest labour force growth, and the highest GDP growth in Canada. Pretty crazy eh, not just a pretty face haha! Another interesting fact: For the first time in recorded history, Alberta has a higher unemployment rate than Nova Scotia! Pretty brutal...

Your reply

The hidden story with B.C.'s great national economic/employment numbers though is the local rate of (imported) inflation vis-a-vis slow/low domestic/provincial wage growth.

Your answer was a subjective argument that had no facts to back it up. You really had no answer other than real estate in Vancouver with using your argument with the economist which recently just named Vancouver the third most desirable city in the world to live in for the six year in a row.

In closing I would like to apologize for being personal. It was wrong I am sure you are a stand up gentleman. It think it is admiral that you focus on your family first.

As, far as your quote

(obviously ignorant pro right wing influenced)

I take that as a compliment. I have helped raised hundreds of thousands of dollars for the childrens hospital. I have personally donated thousands of dollars too the childrens hospital. I have raised thousands of dollars for the breakfast club of Canada to help feed children breakfast before school so they can learn better. More importantly I have volunteer to make children breakfast in the morning before school for over 6 years.

I think those are things that right wing influenced do without comment!

Since being left usually means you rely on the government for everything!
Especially

(given my generous retirement benefits etc.)

Your quote

I'm thus not tied to this forum as some here might be.

Thanks for your insight, I come on this forum once every two weeks and I find it interesting also. I am certainly not tided too it either but find it fun.

Your quote

many Vancouverites with high house equity are retired and living on relatively low fixed incomes. If these retirees were to sell their homes they would have to move away from Vancouver being unable to find affordable housing.

This is non sense again if you own a home in Vancouver you could buy a condo or townhouse when you sell or you could retire on Vancouver island on the ocean!

[Caliplanner1]

Originally Posted by sunsetmountainland

Again, congratulations on your retirement! My assumptions on your research was based on your argument in this business Vancouver section. That at least shows fact at how poor your argument was.

I think your argument was based on Vancouver real estate which is fine since this is a business vancouver thread.

However the whole premise was about the whole province. Those that own real estate are really not the problem that you make it out too be. Even if on fixed income . If you own real estate in Vancouver you are not poor.

The real argument was about the fact that B.C. has had a very positive results in jobs both part time and full time. With a 3.7% year over year growth as well as real numbers of 84,700. Now that represents 40,000 full time as well as 44,800 part time jobs.

Zahav quote


Your reply

Your answer was a subjective argument that had no facts to back it up. You really had no answer other than real estate in Vancouver with using your argument with the economist which recently just named Vancouver the third most desirable city in the world to live in for the six year in a row.

In closing I would like to apologize for being personal. It was wrong I am sure you are a stand up gentleman. It think it is admiral that you focus on your family first.

As, far as your quote
I take that as a compliment. I have helped raised hundreds of thousands of dollars for the childrens hospital. I have personally donated thousands of dollars too the childrens hospital. I have raised thousands of dollars for the breakfast club of Canada to help feed children breakfast before school so they can learn better. More importantly I have volunteer to make children breakfast in the morning before school for over 6 years.

I think those are things that right wing influenced do without comment!

Since being left usually means you rely on the government for everything!
Especially

Your quote Thanks for your insight, I come on this forum once every two weeks and I find it interesting also. I am certainly not tided too it either but find it fun.

Your quote

This is non sense again if you own a home in Vancouver you could buy a condo or townhouse when you sell or you could retire on Vancouver island on the ocean!

Your congratulations on retirement is questionable given that the context of your original comment was misguided in its assumption.

Housing cost is the largest single expenditure in the expenditure of ordinary workers EVERYWHERE. If housing costs are out of whack then it stands to reason that such reality puts undue pressure on the budgets of "average" individuals and families....of course this is really a problem in Vancouver (as opposed to the rest of B.C. per se.....my fault if I was being too geographically general since as an American I am really only aware of Vancouver's horrendous living costs).

Further, you miss the irony here that it is possible to be real estate rich but yet (cash poor) given that many retired SFH owners (on fixed incomes with spiraling living costs) can be either living in debt via reversed mortgages or unable to pay higher property taxes due to meteoric increases in said taxes.

As far as buying a condo after selling your SFH you assume that the new high condo costs (including those ridiculous fees) are sustainable on fixed retirement incomes locally.

I hope that you're paying attention to the current uproar among a large number of Vancouver residents (in the media etc.) who are unable to attain affordable housing here in metro Vancouver even with the supposedly great job market,...and as you're seeming to indicate here,... great pay checks!

Keep denying the obvious with the obfuscation of asserting that Vancouver is among the world's most "livable cities"....says who, and for whom!?

[sunsetmountainland]

Originally Posted by Caliplanner1

Your congratulations on retirement is questionable given that the context of your original comment was misguided in its assumption.

Housing cost is the largest single expenditure in the expenditure of ordinary workers EVERYWHERE. If housing costs are out of whack then it stands to reason that such reality puts undue pressure on the budgets of "average" individuals and families....of course this is really a problem in Vancouver (as opposed to the rest of B.C. per se.....my fault if I was being too geographically general since as an American I am really only aware of Vancouver's horrendous living costs).

Further, you miss the irony here that it is possible to be real estate rich but yet (cash poor) given that many retired SFH owners (on fixed incomes with spiraling living costs) can be either living in debt via reversed mortgages or unable to pay higher property taxes due to meteoric increases in said taxes.

As far as buying a condo after selling your SFH you assume that the new high condo costs (including those ridiculous fees) are sustainable on fixed retirement incomes locally.

I hope that you're paying attention to the current uproar among a large number of Vancouver residents (in the media etc.) who are unable to attain affordable housing here in metro Vancouver even with the supposedly great job market,...and as you're seeming to indicate here,... great pay checks!

Keep denying the obvious with the obfuscation of asserting that Vancouver is among the world's most "livable cities"....says who, and for whom!?

What would you like me too say? Thanks for nothing? Because all you have done is proven what I have said too be true! It's really is hard too be left, isn't it?


re read my post#826 "sigh"

The hidden story with B.C.'s great national economic/employment numbers though is the local rate of (imported) inflation vis-a-vis slow/low domestic/provincial wage growth.

This is your quote from august 7th 2016 post 807

My reply

Is this a subjective argument or do you have the actual facts to demonstrate your argument?

post 808

Still waiting..............


Sounds like you are not retired yet?

part-time teaching and business investments.

[Caliplanner1]

Originally Posted by sunsetmountainland

What would you like me too say? Thanks for nothing? Because all you have done is proven what I have said too be true! It's really is hard too be left, isn't it?


re read my post#826 "sigh"





This is your quote from august 7th 2016 post 807

My reply post 808

Still waiting..............


Sounds like you are not retired yet?

Total idiocy in reasoning. You must be very young, thus silly/naive in your arguments. My links clearly show that the ordinary local worker can hardly afford million dollar homes in Vancouver. Not only is there real estate data out there to substantiate my point which is a big part of your premier's 15% real estate tax policy (re: a political attempt to tackle the vexing problem of relatively weak local wages versus high housing costs which drive up the cost of living) but I see/hear it for myself by living here and talking with numerous local folks (from the doctors, nurses and and other health care professionals who have been taking care of me in hospital) to my American family members and neighbors who live here with "great jobs" but are frustrated by the dysfunctional high cost of housing which eats into annual income.

BTW,...I live extremely well (and within my means to boot) in a well-to-do suburb of Los Angeles, so I'm not worried about your city's housing crisis!

[sunsetmountainland]

Originally Posted by Caliplanner1

Total idiocy in reasoning. You must be very young, thus silly/naive in your arguments. My links clearly show that the ordinary local worker can hardly afford million dollar homes in Vancouver. Not only is there real estate data out there to substantiate my point which is a big part of your premier's 15% real estate tax policy (re: a political attempt to tackle the vexing problem of relatively weak local wages versus high housing costs which drive up the cost of living) but I see/hear it for myself by living here and talking with numerous local folks (from the doctors, nurses and and other health care professionals who have been taking care of me in hospital) to my American family members and neighbors who live here with "great jobs" but are frustrated by the dysfunctional high cost of housing which eats into annual income.

BTW,...I live extremely well (and within my means to boot) in a well-to-do suburb of Los Angeles, so I'm not worried about your city's housing crisis!

I am very happy for your residence in a well-to-do suburb of Los Angeles! Again I am also happy your not worried about my cities housing crisis. Neither am I for that matter!

What I am worried about is your total and lack of answering the original question. Which did not have anything too do with the Vancouver housing market.

I was and still am asking about your retort, to Zahav, this will be the third time it has been posted too you! First from Zahav then a quote from me:

The Stats Can labour report came out on Friday, and BC is so far ahead of the rest of Canada in all good measures. It has been for some time, but the gap seems to be widering, and BC is accounting for almost all the job growth in the country still. Last months Canada wide stats were horrible as unemployment rose considerably, and Ontario faultered. Of course Alberta is still struggling, their unemployment was to 8.6%, while BC dropped to 5.6%. 3 percentage points difference, I think that's probably close to a record, if not the record. See below for more. I hope things will keep going well, or if there is some slowdown, that it be mild. Right now, for probably the first time in decades or more, BC has the lowest unemployment rate, the highest employment growth, the highest labour force growth, and the highest GDP growth in Canada. Pretty crazy eh, not just a pretty face haha! Another interesting fact: For the first time in recorded history, Alberta has a higher unemployment rate than Nova Scotia! Pretty brutal...

To which you answered:

The hidden story with B.C.'s great national economic/employment numbers though is the local rate of (imported) inflation vis-a-vis slow/low domestic/provincial wage growth.

I think that a 3.7% year over year job growth is pretty good. That is 40,000 full time jobs as well as 44,700 part time jobs for a total of 84,700 jobs.

These numbers are for B.C. granted a large part of those numbers are related too Vancouver.

I think if you have job growth it is a good thing. You will have people from different jurisdictions moving too this area which in turn creates more wealth. These people will need food, shelter, entertainment etc......

If they do not make as much money as you would like them too make does not mean it is a bad thing for the economy.

What I was thinking you would provide was an answer too this question with regards too jobs, wage growth etc...

You stated that there was a hidden story. I still do not think you have provided a proper or articulate answer too your hidden story?

That is all.

[Caliplanner1]

Originally Posted by sunsetmountainland

I am very happy for your residence in a well-to-do suburb of Los Angeles! Again I am also happy your not worried about my cities housing crisis. Neither am I for that matter!

What I am worried about is your total and lack of answering the original question. Which did not have anything too do with the Vancouver housing market.

I was and still am asking about your retort, to Zahav, this will be the third time it has been posted too you! First from Zahav then a quote from me:



To which you answered:

I think that a 3.7% year over year job growth is pretty good. That is 40,000 full time jobs as well as 44,700 part time jobs for a total of 84,700 jobs.

These numbers are for B.C. granted a large part of those numbers are related too Vancouver.

I think if you have job growth it is a good thing. You will have people from different jurisdictions moving too this area which in turn creates more wealth. These people will need food, shelter, entertainment etc......

If they do not make as much money as you would like them too make does not mean it is a bad thing for the economy.

What I was thinking you would provide was an answer too this question with regards too jobs, wage growth etc...

You stated that there was a hidden story. I still do not think you have provided a proper or articulate answer too your hidden story?

That is all.

Job growth and real income/wage growth as a function of a particular market area's rate of inflation are two different factors to be considered. Mcjobs don't sustain affordable housing! My point again is simple....Vancouver's high house prices are largely driven by external (inflationary) forces to the detriment of an increasing number of locals (in search of such affordable accommodation).

The reason I mentioned my L.A. situation is to highlight that even in my "expensive" neighborhood (close to residences owned by wealthy entertainers etc.) I'm able to comfortably live on a relatively modest income (in large part due to RELATIVELY lower levels of CONCENTRATED "imported inflation"-where foreign real estate investors/speculators etc. don't pay income and other economy sustaining taxes at the same symbiotic rate as local ones with an organic stake in the local economy). End of discussion!

[retro_orange]

Second-last gas station to close in downtown Vancouver
FRANCES BULA

One of the last two remaining gas stations in downtown Vancouver is being put up for sale, as underused land in key city locations continues to spur redevelopment.

Chevron Canada Ltd. announced Tuesday it is “soliciting market interest” in three of its city locations, including the site at Georgia and Bidwell streets.

“It’s become apparent to Chevron that the sites have a high and better value” for a development that makes more use of it than as gas stations, company spokesman Adrien Byrne said.

Even though the Georgia site is a high-volume sales location and gas sales continue to increase throughout the province, the land is likely more valuable to a developer than it is to Chevron, he said.

The company is also looking for offers for its sites at 39th Avenue and Dunbar Street, in Vancouver’s much-desired west side, and at First Avenue and Clark Drive.

A new plan for the West End, approved in November, 2013, allows for much higher densities along Georgia and Burrard, which means the site of the station could become home to a tower as high as 385 feet.

“Land in the city is too valuable to be saved for a single use,” said Anne McMullin, president of the region’s Urban Development Institute. “It’s far more lucrative for development than as a gas station.”

David Taylor, a vice-president at the commercial brokerage Colliers, said: “There are so few sites downtown that anything that seems underbuilt is a target.”

The changes to the Georgia corridor have already prompted development proposals within a couple of blocks of the Chevron station for four high-end condo projects with striking designs.

The company’s decision to get rid of some properties is part of a local and national movement in which thousands of stations have disappeared over the past 25 years.

“There is an industrywide trend toward that divestment,” said Michael Ervin, whose company Kent Group Ltd., based in London, Ont., tracks the refining and retail sectors of the petroleum industry.

He said there were 20,000 stations in Canada in 1990. That’s down to 12,000.

Vancouver’s business-licence database indicates there are 77 gas stations left in the city, with notations in the files that 16 others closed recently.

Downtown has only one other station besides the Chevron outlet on Georgia: the Esso station at Burrard and Davie streets, which was acquired by 7-Eleven two years ago when Esso sold off all its stations in British Columbia and Alberta.

Mr. Ervin said that, in spite of the drastic reduction, there is no sign of complaint from consumers that stations are getting harder to find in cities.

And Mr. Byrne said the West End, where the station is located, is “increasingly transit-oriented and walkable.”

People who need gas as they’re heading north of the city will still have many stations on the North Shore to choose from, he said.

Vancouver’s downtown has experienced a remarkable building boom in the last 30 years. First, residential developers swarmed onto former industrial land around the edges of the downtown peninsula to build condos.

Then, after a long lull, commercial developers initiated a boom of office-tower building in the last several years.

As a result, vacant properties, former office plazas, and smaller buildings have all become prime sites for redevelopment.

Two sites downtown that have functioned as public plazas – one at Seymour and West Hastings streets, another at the key downtown Georgia and Granville streets intersection – have developments proposed.

Another site on West Pender Street at Richards Street that has been a parking lot for decades is being developed as a combined commercial and residential-rental building, as is another site on the same block.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/brit...e-in-downtown-vancouver/article31527178/

[osirisboy]

I wonder if 7 eleven has interest in selling the last downtown one. And what's going on with the former gas station across from esso on davie? The soil remediation must be finished by now

[sunsetmountainland]

Originally Posted by Caliplanner1

Job growth and real income/wage growth as a function of a particular market area's rate of inflation are two different factors to be considered. Mcjobs don't sustain affordable housing! My point again is simple....Vancouver's high house prices are largely driven by external (inflationary) forces to the detriment of an increasing number of locals (in search of such affordable accommodation).

The reason I mentioned my L.A. situation is to highlight that even in my "expensive" neighborhood (close to residences owned by wealthy entertainers etc.) I'm able to comfortably live on a relatively modest income (in large part due to RELATIVELY lower levels of CONCENTRATED "imported inflation"-where foreign real estate investors/speculators etc. don't pay income and other economy sustaining taxes at the same symbiotic rate as local ones with an organic stake in the local economy). End of discussion!

Yes again I agree with your thesis, Mcjobs don't sustain affordable housing. That does make sense. Again Vancouver's high house prices are largely driven by external(inflationary) forces to the detriment of an increasing number of locals.

So lets say you have the actual data that says B.C. that gained 3.7% in year over year job growth. That is 40,000 full time jobs as well as 44,700 part time jobs for a total of 84,700 jobs. How is that bad for B.C.?
Now again all I was asking is for some factual data that says all these jobs are Mcjobs and detriment to the economy of B.C.?


Also you live in L.A. Not Vancouver or San Francisco. End of discussion!

[Caliplanner1]

San Francisco/the Bay area generates its own wealth via the local high tech industry,...hence it's possible to earn mega salaries from top head office jobs locally there towards buying a high priced shack. Vancouver on the other hand is more so of a resort town where wealthy foreigners come to park their millions in real estate investment.....giving the local economy a distorted sense of prosperity (via imported inflation) which tends to leave local workers more so out in the cold as far as home ownership is concerned. As a Canadian permanent resident living here in Vancouver with my family (as well as in LA.) I am very well aware of this conundrum.

[retro_orange]

Originally Posted by osirisboy

I wonder if 7 eleven has interest in selling the last downtown one. And what's going on with the former gas station across from esso on davie? The soil remediation must be finished by now

Was that a gas station on the other side of Davie? I thought it was retail before. I can't remember now but I have been curious about that for awhile now. Anyone know whats going on with the small old grey building and retail at 1188-1190 Burrard & 937 Davie?

these:
http://www.collierscanada.com/18306#.V76d_pgrLIU

[osirisboy]

Yes it was a full gas station with some small retail on the spot where fountain has its smoking section. Think it got torn down around 2009

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by Caliplanner1

San Francisco/the Bay area generates its own wealth via the local high tech industry,...hence it's possible to earn mega salaries from top head office jobs locally there towards buying a high priced shack. Vancouver on the other hand is more so of a resort town where wealthy foreigners come to park their millions in real estate investment.....giving the local economy a distorted sense of prosperity (via imported inflation) which tends to leave local workers more so out in the cold as far as home ownership is concerned. As a Canadian permanent resident living here in Vancouver with my family (as well as in LA.) I am very well aware of this conundrum.

Thanks for that. In fact, in the long term, I fear for the city and its economic future, if companies won't locate here due to the disastrous $$$$real estate issue. What will the city become?
And for whom?

[officedweller]

This is the one in the SAP Building - where the teachers were picketing recently on Smithe St.

Abrupt Vancouver ESL school closure leaves students, staff, faculty in dark
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/brit...s-staff-faculty-in-dark/article31656769/

[officedweller]

Hanjin Shipping Line bankruptcy causes global shipping chaos, retail concerns
http://www.ctvnews.ca/business/hanjin-ba...shipping-chaos-retail-concerns-1.3055184