Edmonton Construction 13 (November 2015)

[feepa]

Originally Posted by SHOFEAR

yeah, I like living downtown There are aspects of it that are very convenient and aspects that are a complete pain in the —. As my lifestyle changes I'm finding the pain in the — parts start to outweigh the positives.

It's easy to be a champion of urbanism when your in your 20's. Unfortunately it's a lifestyle that for the vast majority of people eventually expires.

Some of us seem stuck in their 20's well into their 30s... Yes, you all know who exactly I'm referring to.

[feepa]

Originally Posted by mintzilla

^ but why can't we have our cake and eat it too?

Everyone loves suburbs. So why can't we build the best suburbs possible? Ones that include the best of all worlds. I seriously doubt anyone would be against a nice suburbs that is also pedestrian friendly with good links to transportations.

#ambleside !

seriously. Good transit connections to downtown and just off the henday for everywhere else, lots of walkable amenities in the local neighbourhood with direct walking paths and still parking for when you need bigger/large items than one can reasonable carry, close to the river valley... No pent up frustrations pretending something is something else.

[GreenSPACE]

TGIF!

[itom 987]

Originally Posted by feepa

Some of us seem stuck in their 20's well into their 30s... Yes, you all know who exactly I'm referring to.Some of us seem stuck in their 20's well into their 30s... Yes, you all know who exactly I'm referring to.

It shouldn't have to be that way Shofear, I still believe that we are forced to move to the suburbs when we start raising a family - just to maintain a decent quality of life. Some people want to make downtown living possible for families yet they are shooting down the very people that are trying to prevent a large bar from going into a new residential area. That large bar will keep families away. The amount of hypocrisy in that debate is ridiculous.

And Medwards, I think you create arguments just to bug other people.

It makes me wonder what battle you will start next.

[feepa]

Just because I have a different opinion than others doesn't mean I'm looking to do battle. I'm sharing my opinion just like everyone else.

Thanks,

[itom 987]

You are always looking to do battle, you LOVE battles!

[feepa]

[seamusmcduff]

Originally Posted by Albicaulis

As a resident of the very very suburban Summerside neighbourhood, I would tend to agree.

The housing options there (half-decent mix of SFH, townhomes, duplex and condo) coupled with the large amount of high quality office space (i.e. the Moasic building) is pretty good.

What I have found lacking is the overall execution. The road are confusing mess of cul de sac's and crescents and the offices have been far too segregated, like the nearby commercial. Effort on retaining a more grid-like pattern to allow increase flow-through traffic, then orienting the offices along such streets in a more centralised neighbourhood location would go a long long way without (I think) altering the over livability of such development.

Yeah it's super frustrating looking at places like Summerside. The density is definitely there for urbanity, but the design doesn't allow for it. The thing is with places like that is if developers really cared they could easily fix it.

Edmonton still can't move past nodal design for some reason.

Every subdivision now has medium/high density condo developments, but they're always inward facing. Instead of having the whole subdivision inward facing, place the condos on the major arteries and get rid of the massively unnecessary right of ways, and depending on the subdivision, they might even be able to support shops on ground. Now along with this you will need increased accessibility/ parking(it's a subdivision people are going to need to drive still). Improve the access points by making the road network more gridlike instead of having one or two entries into a neighbourhood. This would allow access to the condos for backlot/underground parking. The argument is always the grids will make too much traffic through the neighbourhood, but honestly from my experience it doesn't seem to make a difference. And even if it did traffic through grids if the road is narrow enough traffic drives slow enough that you hardly notice.

Planned right, and you should able to place people a lot closer to where they do things and decrease the need for driving. It should also make a more attractive area where people might want to walk just because.

One issue I'm not sure how to solve is our love of Power Centres, other than making them outward facing. They are pretty ingrained in our culture at this point, but they are extremely innefficient. I guess the hope would be that the diffusion of shops throughout the neighbourhoods would decrease the popularity and necessity of them.

That's my take on things anyway.

[Albicaulis]

^
Yup, anyone who says grids don't work have not spent 45 min in a traffic jam outside Michael Strembitsky school.

[kcantor]

Originally Posted by seamusmcduff

...

Planned right, and you should able to place people a lot closer to where they do things and decrease the need for driving. It should also make a more attractive area where people might want to walk just because.

One issue I'm not sure how to solve is our love of Power Centres, other than making them outward facing. They are pretty ingrained in our culture at this point, but they are extremely innefficient. I guess the hope would be that the diffusion of shops throughout the neighbourhoods would decrease the popularity and necessity of them.

That's my take on things anyway.

emphasis added...

didn't work very well in mill woods or other areas where that's been forced into the neighborhoods. the problem is they all end up being too small to offer a decent range of services and options although maybe the return to more traditional grids and encouraging more mixed use development instead of forced nodes would be more successful.

[Daveography]

This was a really good read:

David Staples: Fight over housing density is generational warfare, Vancouver's former mayor says
The battle over densification just got a lot more interesting.

It seems this fight is not just folks who want lot splitting and highrise apartments pitted against those who oppose such developments.

Former Vancouver mayor Sam Sullivan, now an MLA with the British Columbia Liberal party, says the densification fight is both class and generational warfare. It pits haves against have-nots, old against young, wealthy baby boom homeowners against millennials, poorer young people who hope to live in the city core, rather than commute from sprawling suburbs, but can’t afford to buy into these established areas.

“It’s a great financial strategy to grab the land when it’s cheap and when you’re the only one around and lock it in, and then circle the wagons. Because the city will grow and if you can restrict supply, the only thing that can happen is the price will go up. So there’s a great wealth transfer from young people who are trying to find a way to live without pretty long commutes and living in a way that is more environmentally sustainable, and the older generation that is sitting on this land and stopping everything that would make the lives of the young people easier … (Young people) either pay it in money or they pay it in time. They will live off in a distant suburb and pay it in the time that they have to get to work, get to the things they want to go to.”

Full Story:
http://edmontonjournal.com/news/politics...nal-warfare-vancouvers-former-mayor-says

[s211]

On an entirely different note, walking past the new casino being built in downtown Vancouver, and upon seeing the new gold/burgundy-ish glazing going up, I couldn't help thinking about Edmonton's Scotia Place. In the latter instance, the building is going with a generic glazing replacement, or so we're told. Frankly, if I were the owner of Scotia, I'd be finding a special glazing like that being used for the Vancouver casino and use that as a means to differentiate an otherwise underperforming, nondescript property into something that catches peoples' eyes and sets it apart from the rest of the crowd.

I'm not saying that going casino garish is the answer, but surely they could find a new gold-like glazing to replace the old, and continue to set Scotia apart from the pack that way? Otherwise, you're underselling the property's marketing potential.

Happy to hear all thoughts.

[Hallsy's Toupee]

new Global story on the Southpark redevelopment on Whyte Ave
http://globalnews.ca/news/2881345/new-development-in-the-works-for-whyte-avenue/

The Wheaton family, which owns the land where the Southpark Pontiac Buick GMC dealership used to be, is now looking at developing the site.

Located on the south side of Whyte Avenue, on both sides of 106 Street, the parcel of land would be broken up into four areas.

The development, which is in its early stages, would be mixed use – with commercial and residential space.

The housing tower would feature walkable townhouses, according to the developer’s website.

“The auto-oriented, weak urban design of these sites is reminiscent of a different time in the history of Whyte Avenue, when vehicular access was the focus. As the surrounding properties have redeveloped into vibrant, pedestrian-oriented spaces, these sites have become a hole in the urban experience and a barrier to connection between the university area to the west and the iconic historical developments further east on Whyte Avenue.”

The developer is currently seeking re-zoning of the land, as well as amendments to both the Garneau and Strathcona area redevelopment plans.

Stantec has been hired to do consulting work on the project, including planning and architectural drawings.

Letters were first mailed to neighbourhood property owners on Oct. 14, 2015. A community open house was held on Oct. 28, 2015 to give an overview of the process and timelines.

On Saturday, Southpark on Whyte is hosting a community engagement session from 2-5 p.m. at a tent on the site.

[CMD UW]

Originally Posted by ciudad_del_norte

In all sincerity, I do hope everybody that finds the city so terrible moves. I don't mean that in a spiteful way. I've lived other places (apparently really desirable places in Canada...) that I wasn't fond of and it really — living somewhere that you don't like.

I don't particularily care if people want to live a certain lifestyle or another - but if the one you want isn't here - and you have given up trying to work towards it, really isn't moving somewhere else the best option? Does Edmonton have more work to do than other "Big" canadian cities, yeah, for sure (I do also think we romaticize other cities here a bit much, though). I get feeling frustrated, and trying to find the balance between pushing for the lifestyle you want and doing what is easiest in the city. I just don't quite understand the attitude of "I used to think it could be better, but now I don't think so, so I'm just going to sit around and be grumpy about it". At some point maybe the place just isn't right for you, and that's okay. But that doesn't mean people have to come around and get pissy and condescending at the people that see something different in it.

I absolutely agree with you here. Amen.

[CMD UW]

Originally Posted by s211

It's all about balance, I guess, and where the problem lies could be with our respective definitions of what balance comprises. Well, anyhow, back to real estate. How about that Whyte Avenue development!

Speaking of Whyte Avenue developments - we don't have any parking at our Crawford Block development, there's only one measly stall at our Beljan Block development and we have two other buildings under contract (one on Whyte and one downtown) that we're planning to redevelop and not providing any parking. So I'd say that this is taking Edmonton in the right direction contrary to the recent comments on this forum.

People can talk and complain, but in our case we choose action over words because we love this city and aspire to see it change.

[CMD UW]

Originally Posted by Albicaulis

As a resident of the very very suburban Summerside neighbourhood, I would tend to agree.

The housing options there (half-decent mix of SFH, townhomes, duplex and condo) coupled with the large amount of high quality office space (i.e. the Moasic building) is pretty good.

What I have found lacking is the overall execution. The road are confusing mess of cul de sac's and crescents and the offices have been far too segregated, like the nearby commercial. Effort on retaining a more grid-like pattern to allow increase flow-through traffic, then orienting the offices along such streets in a more centralised neighbourhood location would go a long long way without (I think) altering the over livability of such development.

You nailed it. The BIGGEST issue with many of our suburban neighbourhoods is the arrangement and location of land uses and its roadway network. Many roadway networks are poorly planned. I've never understood why the City, who ultimately becomes the owner of this infrastructure, does not have a heavier influence on how these roadway are designed.

[Coldrsx]

Excellent news and much better approach.

http://edmontonjournal.com/news/local-ne...g-the-deck-at-city-hall-will-pay-off-big

[Daveography]

^ Good move; for all the follies and failures under Iveson, I think a lot of the reshuffling and reorganization will have a very positive and very long-term effect.

Attended the Southpark on Whyte open house yesterday; see renders and notes here:
http://skyrisecities.com/community/threa...pment-gbl-architects.25081/#post-1141174

[240glt]

We heard about this at our last development committee meeting. Hopefully that yields some better results. There've been some good positive steps over the past ~9 months or so, planning seems a little more organized but still lots of work to do.

We look forward to working directly with the new committees directly rather than the somewhat disjointed way we communicate now

[Jasper and one o nin]

Originally Posted by feepa

Some of us seem stuck in their 20's well into their 30s... Yes, you all know who exactly I'm referring to.

A friend of mine is doing his thesis on urban preferences of people in Edmonton working in creative occupations. He was saying Edmonton is quit unique compared to other places