[Dartmouth] King's Wharf (16 Kings Wharf Place) | 85 & 49 m | 27 & 15 fl | U/C

[Colin May]

Originally Posted by musicman

Hearing rumblings that the rest of this development is in serious trouble of being delayed or cancelled except for the iconic tower, which rumour has it may be changed to hotel/residential.

Too many unsold condo units and the metro rental market is overbuilt.
Poor place for a hotel, people want to be in Halifax.

[someone123]

I was under the impression that they have a lot of deposits already for units in the main tower. It must be kind of hard to sell small building #4 when the possibility of a nicer building is on the horizon and there aren't yet a whole lot more amenities than there were in downtown Dartmouth a few years ago. On top of that it looks like the future phases will detract a bit from the skyline views of some of the units in the original buildings. Maybe something like a major grocery store would make the area a bit more attractive. That's a chicken and egg problem though. Maybe there's enough of a population base now?

From the beginning I think they said it would be a 10-15 year build-out. Halifax is not like Toronto and Vancouver where bubbly prices, flipping, and "investment" dollars cause buildings to sell out in minutes. That'll probably be a good thing in the long run though.

[OldDartmouthMark]

I'm not in the development, planning or business professions, but to me it almost seems like this project is being developed in a backwards fashion.

Trying to sell smaller, stubbier buildings first to support the more desirable tall tower seems like you would run the risk of the major attraction to this complex not being built because the less-desirable (and slower-selling) aspects are expected to fund it.

Wouldn't it be better to build the main attraction first with the effect of making the smaller buildings more desirable by association?

Perhaps that type of investment might attract merchants to set up shop based on the more upscale impression that the towers would give to the area?

Like I said, I'm not a businessman...

[Jonovision]

Originally Posted by OldDartmouthMark

I'm not in the development, planning or business professions, but to me it almost seems like this project is being developed in a backwards fashion.

Trying to sell smaller, stubbier buildings first to support the more desirable tall tower seems like you would run the risk of the major attraction to this complex not being built because the less-desirable (and slower-selling) aspects are expected to fund it.

Wouldn't it be better to build the main attraction first with the effect of making the smaller buildings more desirable by association?

Perhaps that type of investment might attract merchants to set up shop based on the more upscale impression that the towers would give to the area?

Like I said, I'm not a businessman...

That is the same sort of thing I have been thinking for the past few years. Even had they not built the iconic tower first, but had built out the centre blocks and created a desirable place for people to congregate. A real city square instead of a long line of buildings on a cul-de-sac. The place needed a draw not just for residents but for locals to come and enjoy the space, make it something exciting and full of life.

[Drybrain]

Originally Posted by Jonovision

That is the same sort of thing I have been thinking for the past few years. Even had they not built the iconic tower first, but had built out the centre blocks and created a desirable place for people to congregate. A real city square instead of a long line of buildings on a cul-de-sac. The place needed a draw not just for residents but for locals to come and enjoy the space, make it something exciting and full of life.

Agreed. I was recently house-hunting and considering a condo, but there's no way I would've bought at King's Wharf. Most importantly I wanted to be in Halifax, but eve if I'd considered Dartmouth, King's Wharf is just kinda...stuck out there, without a lot immediately around it.

[worldlyhaligonian]

Yeah... why wouldn't they have built the iconic tower first and then attracted people to the rest of the development!

We want iconic towers!!!!!!!!

[grbrki]

And the crane is down...for now...

[Jonovision]

[Jonovision]

20160626_074806_HDR by Jonovision23, on Flickr

[alps]

Lovely pic!

[Jonovision]

Originally Posted by alps

Lovely pic!

Thank you

The Iconic Tower is the next building coming apparently.

They will also need to get that second access up and running before this 5th building can open.

http://www.condonova.ca/blog/kings-wharf-proceeding-iconic-condo-tower

King's Wharf Proceeding With "Iconic" Condo Tower

—June 26, 2016
The Dartmouth waterfront is poised for further revitalization, as King’s Wharf developer Francis Fares announced this week his plans for constructing the development’s signature building—the 33-storey, $120 million, 177 condo unit “Iconic Tower.” Fares plans to begin marketing condo units in the planned building in September, and, based on demand, begin construction next summer.

The news comes on the heels of rumors that Fares plans to sell the complex’s fourth residential building, The Killick, to a real estate investment trust. The Killick was originally marketed as a condo building, but with lagging condo demand last summer, Fares shifted the building to apartment rentals....

[Colin May]

Originally Posted by Jonovision

Thank you

The Iconic Tower is the next building coming apparently.

They will also need to get that second access up and running before this 5th building can open.

http://www.condonova.ca/blog/kings-wharf-proceeding-iconic-condo-tower

King's Wharf Proceeding With "Iconic" Condo Tower

—June 26, 2016
The Dartmouth waterfront is poised for further revitalization, as King’s Wharf developer Francis Fares announced this week his plans for constructing the development’s signature building—the 33-storey, $120 million, 177 condo unit “Iconic Tower.” Fares plans to begin marketing condo units in the planned building in September, and, based on demand, begin construction next summer.

The news comes on the heels of rumors that Fares plans to sell the complex’s fourth residential building, The Killick, to a real estate investment trust. The Killick was originally marketed as a condo building, but with lagging condo demand last summer, Fares shifted the building to apartment rentals....

PVSC shows 14 unsold units in the 77 unit Aqua Vista with an assessed value of $6.8 million. Only 7 units have sold in the past 6 months.
An 11th floor unit sold for $120,000 below the assessed value and a 9th floor unit sold for $90,000 below assessed value; and a 3rd floor unit sold for $172,000 below assessed value in June 2015
An $881,000 unit on the 11th floor sold for $1 on June 20 2016.

[portapetey]

I'm a little confused. If they couldn't sell the units in the Killick, why would they go ahead and build the 33 story tower as condos? Are they betting that people will buy there because of the height? Also, I hoe they find a good name for it. I'm so tired of the word "iconic" in this business, especially when applied to bland designs.

[IanWatson]

Originally Posted by portapetey

I'm a little confused. If they couldn't sell the units in the Killick, why would they go ahead and build the 33 story tower as condos? Are they betting that people will buy there because of the height? Also, I hoe they find a good name for it. I'm so tired of the word "iconic" in this business, especially when applied to bland designs.

When Kings Wharf launched a lot of people put down deposits to reserve a unit in the Iconic Tower. Maybe those deposits are still valid and Fares thinks they can convert them into actual sales?

[hockey157]

Does anyone know when or if the iconic tower is scheduled to be built? can't find anything about it

[Colin May]

Originally Posted by IanWatson

When Kings Wharf launched a lot of people put down deposits to reserve a unit in the Iconic Tower. Maybe those deposits are still valid and Fares thinks they can convert them into actual sales?

I have heard that people put down deposits but i have never heard the name/s of such persons. Perhaps an enterprising journalist can make a phone call and ascertain the number of deposits and determine if the money has been held in a trust account for the past several years.

[Jonovision]

My understanding was that they actually got so much interest that they could have filled the building and that's why in the revised plan there were two towers. Still not sure if that will go ahead or not.

I think the issue with King's Wharf overall was the phasing. They showed this amazing place with lots of great buildings and this big iconic tower at the end. Everyone wanted those spaces and that big tower and instead they started by selling the least appealing of all the buildings. In my opinion they should have started with the larger tower as well as creating a destination, a place with a buzz that people want to come to, whether they live there or not. A line of 4 buildings on half a street does little to entice the outsider to come visit.

[hockey157]

Yeah, I agree they should've built the big tower first, I think it really would've attracted more people Than the smaller ones they have know

[portapetey]

I don't know how these sort of things work, but I'd assume they used the sales of the smaller units to generate funding for the larger tower. Then again, they don't seem to have trouble building stuff all over the place.

[Colin May]

Originally Posted by Jonovision

My understanding was that they actually got so much interest that they could have filled the building and that's why in the revised plan there were two towers. Still not sure if that will go ahead or not.

I think the issue with King's Wharf overall was the phasing. They showed this amazing place with lots of great buildings and this big iconic tower at the end. Everyone wanted those spaces and that big tower and instead they started by selling the least appealing of all the buildings. In my opinion they should have started with the larger tower as well as creating a destination, a place with a buzz that people want to come to, whether they live there or not. A line of 4 buildings on half a street does little to entice the outsider to come visit.

If the big tower had been the first building he would have have needed a very substantial number of deposits before any bank would provide construction financing, construction would have taken longer and cash flow would have been an issue. The construction financing for the buildings to date has not been cheap. When he put mortgages on the unsold units of the Anchorage the loan approval signatures at CIBC went through 3 levels of risk analysis right up to a senior VP.
Francis Fares has taken a risk that no others were willing to take and I hope he reaps the rewards.