General Updates and News

[Drybrain]

Originally Posted by Ziobrop

yah - the message is confusing, and i think activists of all sorts are coming out to bring their own related but off point message.

Yep. It's the bring-your-own-placard approach to protesting. Everyone has their own hobbyhorse. I was at a meeting at the EAC about this a month ago, and some EAC staff mentioned the seven-storey passive house project planned for Agricola Street as an example of a good development (as opposed to the parking lot).

Some people nonetheless grumbled about that too, even though the EAC people were excited about it.

[Keith P.]

EAC is really good at spending other people's money.

[ns_kid]

The province today issued a call for proposals to redevelop the Dennis Building (1740 Granville Street) and the adjacent Hansard Building (1724 Granville Street), including the parking lot in between.

In a news release, Transportation and Infrastructure Renewal says it's looking for "innovative and creative ideas" to "develop a prime piece of downtown Halifax real estate". It specifies that proposals must preserve the historic facade.

It describes the Dennis as being "beyond repair" while the Hansard needs "significant repairs".

It asks private sector respondents to "prepare a vision" for the site that will retain the facades of both buildings into any new development.

The deadline for submissions is July 28.

The Request for Information is located on the province's tenders website.

If the proposals have any merit, we may soon need a unique thread for a Dennis project.

[ns_kid]

Hansard Building:




Dennis Building:

[Drybrain]

The Dennis being "beyond repair" is nonsense, based only on Kassner Goodspeed's inadequate assessment, which was clearly conducted with a pre-ordained conclusion in mind.

Anyway, it'll be interesting to see what developers come up with. I'm worried we're going to get some glass slab with the granite facade of the Dennis plastered awkwardly onto the first four storeys. For that matter, I'm worried the same will happen to the Hansard. Just one big monolithic building, constructed to achieve maximum lot coverage, with the two old facades stuck on the front like wallpaper.

I really hope I'm wrong and something better gets proposed.

[OldDartmouthMark]

Originally Posted by Drybrain

The Dennis being "beyond repair" is nonsense, based only on Kassner Goodspeed's inadequate assessment, which was clearly conducted with a pre-ordained conclusion in mind.

Anyway, it'll be interesting to see what developers come up with. I'm worried we're going to get some glass slab with the granite facade of the Dennis plastered awkwardly onto the first four storeys. For that matter, I'm worried the same will happen to the Hansard. Just one big monolithic building, constructed to achieve maximum lot coverage, with the two old facades stuck on the front like wallpaper.

I really hope I'm wrong and something better gets proposed.

[worldlyhaligonian]

Originally Posted by Drybrain

The Dennis being "beyond repair" is nonsense, based only on Kassner Goodspeed's inadequate assessment, which was clearly conducted with a pre-ordained conclusion in mind.

Anyway, it'll be interesting to see what developers come up with. I'm worried we're going to get some glass slab with the granite facade of the Dennis plastered awkwardly onto the first four storeys. For that matter, I'm worried the same will happen to the Hansard. Just one big monolithic building, constructed to achieve maximum lot coverage, with the two old facades stuck on the front like wallpaper.

I really hope I'm wrong and something better gets proposed.

I agree as well and hope that it can be a glass tower in what is currently the parking lot and on the Hansard side, a stone entrance for the tower in behind (which should not go all the way into the Dennis building so as to not make the Dennis look like wallpaper).

In fact, a giant glass box in the current parking lot space would be cool if done like this with the exposed stone walls inside:

Credit: Lovingnewyork.co.uk

[Drybrain]

I wonder how much weight the RFP will place on the cost-effectiveness to government. Hopefully they don't just go with the lowest bidder.

[eastcoastal]

Originally Posted by Drybrain

I wonder how much weight the RFP will place on the cost-effectiveness to government. Hopefully they don't just go with the lowest bidder.

I think you'd be hard-pressed to find a government RFP that didn't go to the lowest bidder. Too risky and complex to define value as anything other than cheapest.

*sigh*

[Keith P.]

Years ago I saw a render that took the gray granite exterior of One Government Place and applied it to a "bridge" structure of a couple floors in height over the Hansard Building to attach OGP to a new similarly-styled building on the parking lot and Dennis site. I don't recall if it kept the facade of the Dennis or not on the Granville side but certainly the back side was all OGP-style.

This CBC article suggests several possibilities:

Some development ideas that surfaced during informal talks include:

-Turning the Dennis Building into a boutique hotel.
-Using the entire site for a mixed-use building with office space and apartments.
-Constructing a building with ground-floor businesses and offices above, and installing above-ground parking in the shell of the Dennis Building.


"Every developer had a different vision for the Dennis Building and that is why we left this RFI open to the developers coming forward and bringing us their ideas," Kousoulis said.

"Whichever one ties in the best with the legislature, and with the area there, and whichever one is the most cost-effective to government would be the proponent going forward," he said.

That last option is certainly different.

[someone123]

It's not clear yet how this will turn out but I think this is about the best we could have hoped for. Further delays without upkeep would put the buildings at greater risk.

A good development on this lot would be a huge boost for the downtown area. This lot and the NFB building were the two worst properties along Barrington. If all goes well the street will be enormously improved in a few years.

[Drybrain]

Originally Posted by Keith P.

That last option is certainly different.

Oh, man. That would be a pretty ignominious fate for the Dennis.

[someone123]

Looks like the new blue building on Gottingen is nearly finished:


Source

I wonder what's up with the Housing Trust of NS and former Gottingen Terrace projects.

[counterfactual]

Originally Posted by someone123

It's not clear yet how this will turn out but I think this is about the best we could have hoped for. Further delays without upkeep would put the buildings at greater risk.

A good development on this lot would be a huge boost for the downtown area. This lot and the NFB building were the two worst properties along Barrington. If all goes well the street will be enormously improved in a few years.

I agree -- I think it's excellent that the facades, at least, will be retained, and that it won't be just bulldozed to create another parking lot for lazy and useless provincial politicians.

[OldDartmouthMark]

Originally Posted by Keith P.

Years ago I saw a render that took the gray granite exterior of One Government Place and applied it to a "bridge" structure of a couple floors in height over the Hansard Building to attach OGP to a new similarly-styled building on the parking lot and Dennis site. I don't recall if it kept the facade of the Dennis or not on the Granville side but certainly the back side was all OGP-style.

This CBC article suggests several possibilities:




That last option is certainly different.

To me, the first option of a boutique hotel seems like the best choice. I'm not sure what is left of the internal structure of the building, but I'm imagining that if they could do something like what is being done with The Dillon at the moment, retaining and making visible the internal beams/structure as a feature of the building, it could be a great, well-known landmark for Halifax - a place where people would want to stay to be in the center of the downtown and soak up the history of the building/location.

The second option sounds good as well, with less hope of retaining internal structure of the building, as practicality would likely trump the ability to make it more whimsical, such as the nature of a boutique hotel. If handled properly, though, it too could be a very good use of the buildings.

The third option is, well, bizarre...

[JET]

Originally Posted by OldDartmouthMark

To me, the first option of a boutique hotel seems like the best choice. I'm not sure what is left of the internal structure of the building, but I'm imagining that if they could do something like what is being done with The Dillon at the moment, retaining and making visible the internal beams/structure as a feature of the building, it could be a great, well-known landmark for Halifax - a place where people would want to stay to be in the center of the downtown and soak up the history of the building/location.

The second option sounds good as well, with less hope of retaining internal structure of the building, as practicality would likely trump the ability to make it more whimsical, such as the nature of a boutique hotel. If handled properly, though, it too could be a very good use of the buildings.

The third option is, well, bizarre...

It would make a nice boutique Hotel: http://murraypremiseshotel.com/rooms.html

[OldDartmouthMark]

Originally Posted by JET

It would make a nice boutique Hotel: http://murraypremiseshotel.com/rooms.html

Thanks for posting that link - very interesting!

History

Built in 1846, the Murray Premises, a National Historic Site, is the oldest collection of mercantile buildings related to the fishing industry in Newfoundland and Labrador.

The Murray Premises, which survived the Great Fires, was named after Andrew H. Murray, a 19th century merchant of salt, coal, and general supplies. These buildings have been used as warehouses, offices, and machine shops and for more than one hundred years, the Murray Premises has been a major highlight of the St. John's waterfront.

The buildings were originally built on pilings sunk into the harbour floor. Most were constructed with masonry walls, wood floors, and wood interior supports. Some feature brick infill interior walls of timber frame not unlike the half-timber construction of the European middle ages.

In the 1970s the Newfoundland Historic Trust and the St. John's Heritage Foundation saved the Premises from destruction and helped begin the preservation of the structures. The restoration plan allowed for as much of the original character of the buildings to be maintained while converting the buildings into a modern commercial complex. Within approximately eight months after the restoration began, 70 percent of the commercial space was leased. The official Grand Re-opening of the Premises was held on November 30, 1979.

During the 1980s and 1990s, ownership of the Murray Premises changed several times. In 1996, a local businessman, William Mahoney, purchased the property and is still the owner.

The story of Murray Premises Hotel began in early 2000 when the third and fourth floors were renovated and developed into hotel guest rooms. Guests began staying at St. John's first boutique hotel in May 2001, at which time the hotel had 28 rooms.

The success of Murray Premises Hotel was instant and the realization for additional guest rooms was imminent. In July of 2006, the property continued its growth with the addition of the second floor Executive Suites, bringing the total number of rooms to 47. The last major expansion was completed in early 2010, with 20 new rooms in the east wing bringing the total to 67 guestrooms.

Last but not least, addition meeting space was added along with two business suites off the main lobby, completed in August 2013. Today, Murray Premises Hotel, with 69 guestrooms, continues to welcome visitors to this beautiful historic building to experience old world charm with new world comfort.

[Drybrain]

Originally Posted by OldDartmouthMark

To me, the first option of a boutique hotel seems like the best choice. I'm not sure what is left of the internal structure of the building, but I'm imagining that if they could do something like what is being done with The Dillon at the moment, retaining and making visible the internal beams/structure as a feature of the building, it could be a great, well-known landmark for Halifax - a place where people would want to stay to be in the center of the downtown and soak up the history of the building/location.

I don't think much is left of the interior. Bad renovations in previous decades pretty much eliminated anything historically valuable, and the government recently removed even that. There aren't even any interior walls; it's just the empty shell.

But, that does provide the unique chance to create a thoroughly modern interior inside.

Of course at least some in our local development community don't see it that way. Peter Polley, the head of Polycorp developments, told the site that shall not be named yesterday that restoring it will be too expensive and irresponsible to taxpayers, so the province should just tear it down and make a park. This is the kind of thinking that leads me to fear that the low-bid option, regardless of how crappy it is, will win out in the end and the building will be ruined.

The sagging floors in the Hansard building also pose a rehab option that's pricier than simply a TD-tower-style facade, which would be a real insult to the building, but entirely possible.

[RoshanMcG]

Dal's SUB is beginning to look really nice.

[OldDartmouthMark]

Originally Posted by Drybrain

I don't think much is left of the interior. Bad renovations in previous decades pretty much eliminated anything historically valuable, and the government recently removed even that. There aren't even any interior walls; it's just the empty shell.

But, that does provide the unique chance to create a thoroughly modern interior inside.

Of course at least some in our local development community don't see it that way. Peter Polley, the head of Polycorp developments, told the site that shall not be named yesterday that restoring it will be too expensive and irresponsible to taxpayers, so the province should just tear it down and make a park. This is the kind of thinking that leads me to fear that the low-bid option, regardless of how crappy it is, will win out in the end and the building will be ruined.

The sagging floors in the Hansard building also pose a rehab option that's pricier than simply a TD-tower-style facade, which would be a real insult to the building, but entirely possible.

Ugh. Your thoughts, though realistic, are very discouraging.

I'm trying to be optimistic and hope that somebody the provincial government will have at least a glimmer of a clue as to how important it is to save as much of these buildings as possible.

Surely there must be some sense of historical importance among the politicians from one of the areas that basically founded Canada...