Highways in Canada

[Corndogger]

Originally Posted by Loco101

That would be great!

I think it would be great for the rest of the nation as well.

[scryer]

I think that an important element of the issues with the highways in Vancouver is that the city and the province put more of an emphasis on public transportation and walkability within the city thus taking more cars off the freeways/highways and encouraging people of the Lower Mainland to use public transportation. If the freeway system of the past was actually made, we would be complaining about the livability in Vancouver and how Vancouver is mostly car dependent (in my theory).

I think that rail makes more sense in BC for 2 reasons:

1. The topography of BC is very complicated. IMO I think that it's a better investment, if we need to cut up or tunnel through hills/mountains, to build a network that will carry more goods.

2. Trains can carry more goods to and from Vancouver and they can be more efficient if used correctly.

Vancouver ain't going anywhere people, when it comes to shipping and receiving on the west coast. We already have major infrastructure that is currently meeting Canada's needs to send and receive. And unless Prince Rupert, or somewhere more north, gets trillions of dollars invested in coastal infrastructure and the highways to support the infrastructure; Vancouver will remain the shipping and receiving city of the West.

No disrespect, Prince Rupert .

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by scryer

I think that an important element of the issues with the highways in Vancouver is that the city and the province put more of an emphasis on public transportation and walkability within the city thus taking more cars off the freeways/highways and encouraging people of the Lower Mainland to use public transportation. If the freeway system of the past was actually made, we would be complaining about the livability in Vancouver and how Vancouver is mostly car dependent (in my theory).

I think that rail makes more sense in BC for 2 reasons:

1. The topography of BC is very complicated. IMO I think that it's a better investment, if we need to cut up or tunnel through hills/mountains, to build a network that will carry more goods.

2. Trains can carry more goods to and from Vancouver and they can be more efficient if used correctly.

Vancouver ain't going anywhere people, when it comes to shipping and receiving on the west coast. We already have major infrastructure that is currently meeting Canada's needs to send and receive. And unless Prince Rupert, or somewhere more north, gets trillions of dollars invested in coastal infrastructure and the highways to support the infrastructure; Vancouver will remain the shipping and receiving city of the West.

No disrespect, Prince Rupert .

2 things this country needs:

1) An east west divided highway connecting all major cities. We are close, but still lack in Northern Ontario and BC.

2) Double track on CN and CP mainlines cross Canada. There is too much of a bottleneck throughout the route. Having double track means that they can run trains through better. They can also run Via on a more reliable timetable.

Till these are done, Canada is lacking a reliable transportation network. Proof? The bridge failure at Nipigon.

[craner]

Originally Posted by GreaterMontréal

A-85, the only controlled access highway link between the Maritime provinces and the rest of the country

• Video Link

Great highway video.
Is there a timeline on when A-85 will be fully complete to NB ?

[jmt18325]

Originally Posted by Loco101

Canada certainly has the population to support one East-West freeway.

Australia is wealthier than us and has an almost identical population density. They don't have one either.

Connecting areas that make sense I support. Spending money in the middle of nowhere for freeways we don't need isn't something I support.

[Corndogger]

Originally Posted by jmt18325

Australia is wealthier than us and has an almost identical population density. They don't have one either.

Connecting areas that make sense I support. Spending money in the middle of nowhere for freeways we don't need isn't something I support.

Australia's wealthier than Canada? Using population density figures for the entire country makes no sense. Using them period makes no sense. Should we spend essentially nothing on isolated areas because virtually no one lives in them? What are you going to advocate for next? We go back to the days where only a few cities get to have international flights at their airport because they have more people? Your type of thinking is dangerous and very outdated. We'll become the Burkina Faso of the western hemisphere if we follow your guidelines.

[jmt18325]

Originally Posted by Corndogger

Australia's wealthier than Canada?

Australia's per capita GDP is higher than Canada or the US.

Using population density figures for the entire country makes no sense. Using them period makes no sense. Should we spend essentially nothing on isolated areas because virtually no one lives in them? What are you going to advocate for next? We go back to the days where only a few cities get to have international flights at their airport because they have more people? Your type of thinking is dangerous and very outdated. We'll become the Burkina Faso of the western hemisphere if we follow your guidelines.

I'm not talking about using population density to determine where we have freeways, I'm talking about recognizing economic reality. Canada and Australia share that reality when it comes to money per meter.

We keep track of AADTS for a reason. Roads should be upgraded and built where warranted.

BTW - air traffic is getting more hub and spoke all the time - because it makes economic sense.

[Marshal]

Originally Posted by hipster duck

The problem isn't that Vancouver hasn't spent enough money or that there aren't enough grade-separation projects, it's that almost no highway projects result in a seamless, connected highway system.

For example, the SFPR isn't fully grade-separated, and at-grade intersections appear at the most annoying spots, such as the access to the Alex Fraser Bridge (aka: the Hwy 91 connector). If there should be a grade-separated interchange anywhere on the SFPR, this is it!

Then there's the 91 south from the Alex Fraser itself which hits a red light at 72nd Ave, backing up traffic. Then there's the Golden Ears bridge, where the road passes under Highway 1 without an exit forcing you to make a left turn from Pacific Highway. All of these are in greenfield sites where you don't have to do any costly expropriation or engineering work. What prevented them from building interchanges here in the first place?

What's ironic is that in most cities the bottlenecks are the bridges. In Vancouver, the bridges are often quite wide and built to highway standards and then, strangely, devolve into surface roads once you get to the ground.

Agreed. Remember the lights at Hwy1 & Lonsdale, and even worse, at the 91-91A intersection. When I first moved here from the east, I split my gut laughing at that one . . . freeways destroyed by traffic lights, and we are still doing it. SFPR is a decent road but a big disappointment in its half done form.

[Marshal]

Originally Posted by Metro-One

I agree with the link between major roads themselves need to be improved.

Luckily two ofthe examples you used are going tobe replaced with interchanges in the near future.

72nd on the 99 looks to have a finalized design now (recent press release from the province), finally replacing that traffic light with an interchange.

On the SFPR it has also recently been announced that an interchange is being designed for the 91 connector (which I agree, should have been built in the first place).

I didn't know about the 91 connector . . . great news! Though, its just a start: from the ferry to Langley they need about 7 more conversions/additions.

[Marshal]

Originally Posted by Corndogger

I might be wrong but are not all of the roads you mentioned being built by the province? Vancouver city council's hatred of cars is so strong that they're blind to the need for a good road system. After losing that transit referendum you guys had last year you'd think they'd wake up and realize that people still want to drive. That's not going to change until something a lot better comes along.

As for not designing roads properly in the first place that seems to be a Canadian political tradition. Always cheap out to look good to the people who are opposed to any capital spending (other than hospitals and possibly schools) and let a future administration deal with the fixes.

First, City of Vancouver does not finance or build arterial roads: that's Translink or the province. Second, city council changes all the time, and its not even true that they hate cars. The problem is that, similarly to the idiotic view cones, old policies have become stumbling blocks that the voting populace is equally accountable for. Its a serious and limiting problem that frustrates rational roadway improvements. That said, in the Lower Mainland, there are several municipalities which are virtually built out and to place large roads through them requires the destruction of valued urban fabric, or budgets that are still unaffordable/unacceptable. These include the usual suspects: the City of Vancouver, New Westminster, City of North Vancouver; but also places like Burnaby: outside the HWY1 corridor, good luck pushing a major road, let alone a freeway, through any other part of Burnaby (maybe an upgrade to Marine Way). And there are other places north of the Fraser that are similar. Better interchanges and separations are another matter.

[Innsertnamehere]

407 extension opens Monday.

[Horus]

Originally Posted by Innsertnamehere

407 extension opens Monday.

And it will be free to use for the remainder of 2016 (at least according to CityTV news on Friday evening)

[MTLskyline]

Originally Posted by craner

Great highway video.
Is there a timeline on when A-85 will be fully complete to NB ?

The remainder will gradually open from 2021 to 2025, with work beginning in 2017.

[manny_santos]

I've been in BC for the past week, and I've actually been surprised at the lack of walkability in Metro Vancouver outside of the City of Vancouver. I've been in Burnaby and Surrey and once you leave the Skytrain stations, I'm finding lack of sidewalks and areas where pedestrians are actually blocked from accessing streets where there's construction on private property nearby (while cars still get to pass). In one location there's a CN crossing I had to walk across to get to my destination and I had to walk on the road in traffic to get around the signal post which blocked any right-of-way for pedestrians.

I was surprised at the lack of respect for pedestrians in planning by both the City of Burnaby and City of Surrey. These were all urban areas right next to Skytrain stations.

[ssiguy]

You get real estate agents and politicians telling you how walkable these areas are but they are not. To advance their real estate holdngs they will tell you the areas are pedestrian friendly but they are not but rather transit-friendly.

The two often go together but certainly not always. Metrotown is said to be pedestrian friendly which is bunk. All it is a bunch of condos surrounding a mall and SkyTrain station. Don't get me wrong, I thinks it's far superior to sticking condos all over the place and malls and offices in transit-unfriendly areas. In terms of transit friendly development it has been a great success but it's as walkable as suburban Phoenix.

Contrary to what some believe, TOD and pedestrian friendly do not always go hand-in-hand.

[Marshal]

Originally Posted by ssiguy

You get real estate agents and politicians telling you how walkable these areas are but they are not. To advance their real estate holdngs they will tell you the areas are pedestrian friendly but they are not but rather transit-friendly.

The two often go together but certainly not always. Metrotown is said to be pedestrian friendly which is bunk. All it is a bunch of condos surrounding a mall and SkyTrain station. Don't get me wrong, I thinks it's far superior to sticking condos all over the place and malls and offices in transit-unfriendly areas. In terms of transit friendly development it has been a great success but it's as walkable as suburban Phoenix.

Contrary to what some believe, TOD and pedestrian friendly do not always go hand-in-hand.

I agree with you, except all the bull shit you put with it. Why bother?

As for the discussion: no matter what city you look at in Canada, no matter what successes it has accomplished, and no matter what things are worth praising or boasting about, the significant majority of that city (of the whole urban area) will still be a typical Canadian/North American form of urbanity including transport network.

West Island - Burnaby - Markham - Mill Woods - outer Calgary . . . some better, some worse, all more similar than different.

As for Vancouver: Skytrain is pretty good, but there are many times more places that it doesn't run than it does. Vancouver may be walk-able, but that's not true of a lot of the City itself and varies greatly in the surrounding municipalities. Vancouver prides itself on accommodating bikes, but the ride-share for commuting by bike is tiny and growing by even tinier numbers. Vancouver is doing a lot of good things, but car based suburban development still accounts for a large portion of all growth. Live in Langley and you will share an urban lifestyle with someone in Pickering.

To expect things to be different than they really are is just to waste your time and opinions. To visit Burnaby/Metrotown and be surprised that its just like Scarborough Town Centre is just funny. Vancouver metro is a real city, not a fairy tale or a distopic failure. Surprised? Probably not really.

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by GreaterMontréal

A-85, the only controlled access highway link between the Maritime provinces and the rest of the country

Will be driving the A-85 southbound tomorrow. Really looking forward to the improvements. They can't twin it soon enough.

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by JHikka

Will be driving the A-85 southbound tomorrow. Really looking forward to the improvements. They can't twin it soon enough.

I'm looking forward to the completion of the twinning too, but I am dismayed that it won't be completed until 2025.

I remember the project to complete the twinning of the TCH through NB was first green lighted in the early 1990's. The A-85 was promised at the same time. I believe it was about 1992 and I was 35 years old.

By the time the damned thing is complete, I will be 68 years old (or dead).

[Acajack]

If it's any consolation, the A-85 is now complete through all of the areas that are populated and were the most congested. The 40-km that's left is mostly through wooded areas and has a good number of passing lanes as well.

I've never found that the fact that that stretch was just two lanes slowed me down much on my trips to and from the Maritimes.

The other stretch (south to the NB border) was really bad for traffic congestion, driveways and had few opportunities to safely pass.

[libtard]

Originally Posted by manny_santos

I've been in BC for the past week, and I've actually been surprised at the lack of walkability in Metro Vancouver outside of the City of Vancouver. I've been in Burnaby and Surrey and once you leave the Skytrain stations, I'm finding lack of sidewalks and areas where pedestrians are actually blocked from accessing streets where there's construction on private property nearby (while cars still get to pass). In one location there's a CN crossing I had to walk across to get to my destination and I had to walk on the road in traffic to get around the signal post which blocked any right-of-way for pedestrians.

I was surprised at the lack of respect for pedestrians in planning by both the City of Burnaby and City of Surrey. These were all urban areas right next to Skytrain stations.

The average American suburb is actually more walkable than much of the lower mainland. At least they actually build sidewalks. Now it might take you a long time to walk to any type of amenities but technically it is walkable. In Metro Vancouver, and especially in recent years, sidewalks are the responsibility of developers. The city takes no initiative in building sidewalks and instead waits for lots to be developed so the developer can build the sidewalk. In the meantime, pedestrians have nowhere to walk