Stadiums and Arenas of Canada part 2

[osmo]

Originally Posted by king10

If you don't care enough to support your argument with fact then don't expect to get far with your arguments or have anyone take you seriously. It doesn't take much to back up arguments with credible fact, that is unless you're trying to pass off your opinion as fact.

Here is a FACT: from 2005 City of Toronto Council minutes discussing that funding was contingent on the following:

(ii) 20,000-seat stadium (capable of expansion to 30,000 seats and capable of conversion to a
football format) with luxury viewing suites, premier seating, FIFA specifications
including artificial field turf, food and beverage concessions and an air supported winter
field structure;

http://www.toronto.ca/legdocs/2005/agendas/council/cc051026/pof9rpt/cl036.pdf

notice how both of those things have been achieved 10 years later: football format and 30,000 seats

the argos as a backup plan was never "quickly dismissed" it was always on the table even on the signing of the original business arrangement as indicated in the council report

Let us not forget it was the Argos who botched this initial proposal. They stoned footed looking for better deals at UofT or Lamport and the concrete got poured and the ship sailed.

If we fast forward to today...

The idea that the City aside from writing stern worded Memos and publically shaming MLSE in the press could now, in 2016, really cause any sway with MLSE and BMO Field after they dumped in $100 Million of their own cash is laughable. The Argos are in BMO field because 2/3 of MLSE owns them, not because of the City.

It is the same reason Muzik nightclub gets to run wild on Ex Place land. Money talks. The Muzik owner has large capital investments in Ex Place and sways the board. MLSE now has the same type of weight IMO.

All the City wants from BMO Field its the x # of days kids can play soccer on the field and the cheques sent to them each month from MLSE.

Let us bring up the new Raptors Practice Facility as another example. It was approved with the condition that it be open to community groups for a certain amount of days. MLSE said the right things and agreed. Now that it is built, it is a fortified NBA facility, and MLSE is doing the dance on how to get the public inside. The idea that a fortified facility where you need fingerprint scans to gain access will let public in at random is a joke.

Many of these City statements are not worth the paper they are written on. Those are just two examples that directly relate to sports facilities. You can find many more that deal with transit and housing.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by esquire

Obviously they're not quite at the selling-out stage yet. I don't think it'll take years and years to get there but this season is a bit of a transitional one. Still, they're clearly headed in the right direction.

Michael Copeland has stated many times their goal is to sellout every game. That maybe lofty for year one but they have the brainpower and knowledge of the market to do it. They're aiming high (as they should) and doing everything right (so far)

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by elly63

You know I'm a reactor and if they didn't act the way they do I wouldn't respond. I want to like TFC but a large number of their fanbase (to a CFL fan) makes it nearly impossible to do so.

And as the poster said, you don't get this garbage from the Whitecaps fans, so it is what it is. And if I repeat myself it is because I am old and forgetful.

As a fan of L'Impact in Montreal, it makes TFC that much easier to hate as a rival club. That and FHRITP seals the deal!

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by Acajack

That and FHRITP seals the deal!

One fan saying it isn't indicative of an entire club. It's not as if TFC Ultras were running around with FHRITP banners at matches. It's not as if TFC are suddenly the Lazio of North American footy.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by JHikka

One fan saying it isn't indicative of an entire club. It's not as if TFC Ultras were running around with FHRITP banners at matches. It's not as if TFC are suddenly the Lazio of North American footy.

Agreed. Rivalries don't have to be based on common sense though! (On either side.)

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Agreed. Rivalries don't have to be based on common sense though! (On either side.)

Like the stadium share between Argos and TFC?

[elly63]

Originally Posted by osmo

Let us not forget it was the Argos who botched this initial proposal. They stoned footed looking for better deals at UofT or Lamport and the concrete got poured and the ship sailed.

Sorry Calvin, had the U of T not screwed the Argos what we have now is how it would have went down in the first place.

Originally Posted by osmo

The Argos are in BMO field because 2/3 of MLSE owns them, not because of the City.

Many of these City statements are not worth the paper they are written on. Those are just two examples that directly relate to sports facilities. You can find many more that deal with transit and housing.

Exhibition Place 2014-2016 Strategic Plan (Pg 14)

Goal One - Business Development
Objective (#5) Actively support the expansion and enhancement of sports facilities at Exhibition Place
• Continue to analyze and explore expansion opportunities for BMO Field including improvements to the facility
• Explore the possibility of hosting Toronto Argonauts football games at BMO Field

Yup Calvin, official sources or you, who do I believe?

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by JHikka

Like the stadium share between Argos and TFC?

What isn't common sense? The stadium share itself or the shitstorm that some are raising about it?

[elly63]

Originally Posted by Acajack

As a fan of L'Impact in Montreal, it makes TFC that much easier to hate as a rival club. That and FHRITP seals the deal!

Don't get me going on that, that childish and immature moment and many of them trying to defend those idiots sealed the deal for me as well.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by elly63

Don't get me going on that, that childish and immature moment and many of them trying to defend those idiots sealed the deal for me as well.

In retrospect, it actually wasn't just "one guy". It was actually several guys from two or three distinct groups of TFC fans who likely didn't even know each other.

Obviously it's not reflective of TFC fans in general.

Sports fans can be idiots regardless of the team they support. It just manifests itself in different ways.

I mean, I am kinda part of this fan group:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=exVualh2fpg

[Berklon]

Back to stadium talk.

Is it me, or does it seem like the new Regina stadium will be done long before the next season starts? Judging by the pictures, it looks like it could be complete before the year ends - which would be like 6 months before the CFL season starts. Not sure I've seen a stadium/arena complete that far ahead of the main tenant's season - it always seems like one or two months at most.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by Berklon

Back to stadium talk.

Is it me, or does it seem like the new Regina stadium will be done long before the next season starts? Judging by the pictures, it looks like it could be complete before the year ends - which would be like 6 months before the CFL season starts. Not sure I've seen a stadium/arena complete that far ahead of the main tenant's season - it always seems like one or two months at most.

Doubtful. They still have a fairly long way to go, and fitting out the interiors will take some time too. Recall that THF, TD Place and even IGF weren't 100% finished in all respects during their first seasons, there was still a lot of work to do on the guts of the place.

That said, I could see NMS being totally finished around the end of the season, which is a bit awkward in that you have a new stadium that will sit empty for a full six months before it gets used, but that's small potatoes. They did a good job projecting timelines in Regina. Probably cost them a few bucks more up front, but no unexpected and costly surprises this way.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by Berklon

Back to stadium talk.

Is it me, or does it seem like the new Regina stadium will be done long before the next season starts? Judging by the pictures, it looks like it could be complete before the year ends - which would be like 6 months before the CFL season starts. Not sure I've seen a stadium/arena complete that far ahead of the main tenant's season - it always seems like one or two months at most.

It was supposed to be that way. I think the basic completion date was supposed to be late summer/early fall 2016. Then another 9 months before the true opening ceremony. Not sure if a test event between UofR and USask isn't planned for this fall.

New Regina stadium 77% complete
Natascia Lypny leaderpost.com March 17, 2016

Regina's new stadium is now 77% complete (Video)
Five and a half months from the new Mosaic Stadium’s “substantial completion date,” the big build is about 77 per cent complete.

“We’re in good shape,” Sean Hamelin, district manager for PCL Construction Management, said on Wednesday standing in the midst of a snow-dusted construction site with workers buzzing. He said the company is “very confident” moving toward its end-of-August target.

The construction jargon “substantial completion” means, in essence, that all the basics required for the stadium’s intended purpose will be in place, said Hamelin. That means things like the fire alarm systems, heating, cooling and washrooms must be functioning, but details like furniture might not all be checked off the list.

So, work will continue until opening day, in time for the 2017 CFL season, and, yes, the project is on-time and on-budget, Mayor Michael Fougere reassured.

The focus of Wednesday’s update wasn’t so much the stadium itself but what will surround it. In May, the construction team will begin working on a paved terrace that will encircle the facility, providing seating areas for visitors to mingle. Monuments or artwork might be added in the future, as well.

That work will involve the temporary closure of Elphinstone Street from 10th Avenue to North Railway Street, and the 10th Avenue entrance to Evraz Place until Queen City Exhibition in August.

Within the stadium, the structural steel roof is nearly complete on most sides, with fabric roofing installation beginning in the spring. Some portions of the sunken field have been excavated to their deepest point, with the final digging happening over the next few months.

The City of Regina has also had preliminary conversations with community groups about who might be involved in the stadium test events, said Fougere.

The project has a $278.2-million budget.

[esquire]

^ There was some unconfirmed speculation about a possible CIS or CJFL or both game this fall at NMS. I'd imagine that the stadium will be far enough along by that point that it could be done with relative ease, even if everything is not 100% finished by then.

[VANRIDERFAN]

Originally Posted by esquire

^ There was some unconfirmed speculation about a possible CIS or CJFL or both game this fall at NMS. I'd imagine that the stadium will be far enough along by that point that it could be done with relative ease, even if everything is not 100% finished by then.

The test event will also allow security, food and beverage folks and volunteer hosts/ticket takers to find out what works and what doesn't and have time to make changes.

[SkydivePilot]

^^^^ The new Regina stadium will be "functional" by mid-summer. There are a number of test events planned --- maybe even a concert. The planners learned a lesson from IGF for not doing a rush job and compromising the structural integrity of the facility. TSN on Saturday night: "The new stadium will be a sight to behold." I'm sure looking forward to her debut as well!!!! ^^^^

[esquire]

Originally Posted by VANRIDERFAN

The test event will also allow security, food and beverage folks and volunteer hosts/ticket takers to find out what works and what doesn't and have time to make changes.

Yeah, I'd imagine those kinds of test runs where you have a large but not capacity crowds are essential for planning... at IGF there was a large interdenominational church service that served as the test event. Double bonus for the Rams/Huskies as they could probably get a nice little revenue bump from playing a game in front of 15 or 20 thousand fans.

[osmo]

Originally Posted by esquire

Doubtful. They still have a fairly long way to go, and fitting out the interiors will take some time too. Recall that THF, TD Place and even IGF weren't 100% finished in all respects during their first seasons, there was still a lot of work to do on the guts of the place.

That said, I could see NMS being totally finished around the end of the season, which is a bit awkward in that you have a new stadium that will sit empty for a full six months before it gets used, but that's small potatoes. They did a good job projecting timelines in Regina. Probably cost them a few bucks more up front, but no unexpected and costly surprises this way.

No money burned when finishing a project on time!

[esquire]

Originally Posted by SkydivePilot

The planners learned a lesson from IGF for not doing a rush job and compromising the structural integrity of the facility.

I wonder how IGF remains open with its structural integrity compromised

[elly63]

Originally Posted by Acajack

In retrospect, it actually wasn't just "one guy". It was actually several guys from two or three distinct groups of TFC fans who likely didn't even know each other.

Obviously it's not reflective of TFC fans in general.

Not to belabour this but it wasn't just one guy, of course. In fact the goof who got fired wasn't even the one who said it, he was just too stupid not to shut up. But there was a very significant number of the TFC fanbase who were trying to defend these goofs and that was sickening.