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  #9281  
Old Posted Jun 8, 2016, 10:36 PM
trofirhen trofirhen is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hot Rod View Post
http://www.traveldailymedia.com/newsletters/2016/TDA8Jun16.pdf

Yup, we very well could see YVR-BKK via 789 very soon. They're interested in closer markets than the mega markets of LAX and NYC; specifically mentioning Vancouver and Seattle as target(s).

While I suspect they might eventually add flights to both cities to fully server the Thailand-North American market, Vancouver needs to jump hard on this right away to ensure it is first and establishes itself as THE gateway; particularly since THAI is Star Alliance and YVR is a major Star Gateway Hub!

What I would like to know about THAI AIRWAYS, and others, regarding Vancouver and Seattle, is it a question of YVR or SEA, YVR and/or SEA or YVR and SEA.
Some Airlines, like LH, BA, JAL etc serve both. Others usually choose one or the other. Is it guaranteed that THAI wil choose YVR, or is it a toss-up with our rival?
It looks good, THAI being *A and all, but is that necessarily going to cinch the deal?
     
     
  #9282  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2016, 4:51 AM
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Johnny Aussie Johnny Aussie is offline
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Another inaugural

Tomorrow is the inaugural rouge flight to baile átha Cliath!

Enjoy the festivities YVR and DUB.
     
     
  #9283  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2016, 5:23 AM
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Dublin? why not melbourne?

Quote:
Air Canada looks for Vancouver-Melbourne flight


Air Canada is setting its sights on adding a direct Vancouver-to- Melbourne route soon as the airline continues to expand its presence in the Australian market.

The Canadian flag-carrier last week started flying direct from Vancouver to Brisbane, making the Queensland capital its second Australian port after Sydney.

Air Canada’s vice-president of global sales, Duncan Bureau, said the decision to add the Brisbane leg to the airline’s trans-­Pacific destinations was made on the back of a positive outlook for travel demand to and from Australia.

“We’ve had a long history here in Australia and we’ve been very bullish on adding more capacity here,” he told The Australian.

“We really want the team here to deliver on Brisbane and get it to the point where we feel strongly enough that we could add another market. Obviously Melbourne is a market that we are keenly interested in and Melbourne Airport is keenly interested in working with us and would love to have us operate there.”

But before Air Canada can get to Melbourne, Mr Bureau said the airline would need to free up some of its aircraft that were committed to other routes or wait until new orders for planes were delivered.

The airline currently has $12 billion worth of new aircraft on order as part of a wide-ranging fleet refresh. That includes 35 confirmed Boeing 787 Dreamliners and 15 options that would take its Dreamliner fleet to more than 50.

The airline also has an order of 100 737 MAX aircraft. Delivery of those start next year to replace Air Canada’s Airbus 319 and 320s.

“For us it’s about aircraft availability and as we bring on more aircraft we have to find homes for those aircraft,” Mr Bureau said. “Melbourne is a very attractive market and if the team here can demonstrate that we can operate a year-round service with the 787-9 aircraft and that kind of ­capacity then we would be in a position to add another market. We are keenly interested in doing that.”

Air Canada’s three-times-a- week Brisbane service will initially be operated with Boeing 787-8s, fitted with 20 business class suites, 21 premium economy and 210 economy class seats. The Brisbane route will become daily from June 17 and in October it will start being flown by the larger, 298-seat Boeing 787-9.
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business...s-story/014fdf61aee779d11f8137f8e4ba9c45

(Paywall, you can google the title to get to the article directly..)
     
     
  #9284  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2016, 10:41 AM
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Qantas, where are you??? AC is kicking your butt on Australia-Canada routes...
     
     
  #9285  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2016, 4:34 PM
teriyaki teriyaki is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hourglass View Post
Qantas, where are you??? AC is kicking your butt on Australia-Canada routes...
Here we see a very clear case of the 787 really opening up routes that would otherwise not be possible to do profitably. Qantas doesn't expect to receive any of these jets until 2017 so Air Canada will likely be dominating this market for the short term
     
     
  #9286  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2016, 6:32 PM
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^ I don't have a source, but I recall hearing that Air Canada paid a modest premium for earlier delivery slots on its Dreamliner order, presumably to get the first mover advantage on new routes like BNE, to which their competition (Qantas) cannot respond without using a larger, more costly aircraft or surrendering the route entirely.
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  #9287  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2016, 7:58 PM
twoNeurons twoNeurons is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SFUVancouver View Post
^ I don't have a source, but I recall hearing that Air Canada paid a modest premium for earlier delivery slots on its Dreamliner order, presumably to get the first mover advantage on new routes like BNE, to which their competition (Qantas) cannot respond without using a larger, more costly aircraft or surrendering the route entirely.
And to think that way back when AC actually gave up some of its 787 options ( before it launched of course ).

The 787 is also one of the reasons ANA weathered high fuel prices so well. The Bigger is not the future of Aviation... A380. Has Airbus even broken even on their A380 yet?
     
     
  #9288  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2016, 8:04 PM
trofirhen trofirhen is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by teriyaki View Post
Here we see a very clear case of the 787 really opening up routes that would otherwise not be possible to do profitably. Qantas doesn't expect to receive any of these jets until 2017 so Air Canada will likely be dominating this market for the short term
Other than Melbourne (and perhaps Auckland), do you imagine any other new Pacific or Oceania routes that would be workable with a 787? I guess that would about cover it, no?
Perth? Singapore? Those seem long shots, though perhaps possible.
     
     
  #9289  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2016, 8:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by teriyaki View Post
Here we see a very clear case of the 787 really opening up routes that would otherwise not be possible to do profitably. Qantas doesn't expect to receive any of these jets until 2017 so Air Canada will likely be dominating this market for the short term
The initial QF 789 order is primarily for replacement of selected 744s. Additionally, QF execs have contemplated where to put expansion 789s and YVR was not one of the North American locations to make the short list.

My prediction on the YVR-Australia route maintains, Ac will dominate the routes for quite some time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SFUVancouver View Post
^ I don't have a source, but I recall hearing that Air Canada paid a modest premium for earlier delivery slots on its Dreamliner order, presumably to get the first mover advantage on new routes like BNE, to which their competition (Qantas) cannot respond without using a larger, more costly aircraft or surrendering the route entirely.
Any premium paid by AC for early delivery slots has long been paid back in compensation for 787 delays and reduced performance for the 787.

AC was in the second wave of aircraft orders. The first wave of orders were launch customers, while they got a better initial price for the aircraft, I believe they also got less compensation due to the lower initial price. However as with everything to do with large aircraft orders, terms and prices are confidential and anything said aloud is conjecture.

Quote:
Originally Posted by trofirhen View Post
Other than Melbourne (and perhaps Auckland), do you imagine any other new Pacific or Oceania routes that would be workable with a 787? I guess that would about cover it, no?
Perth? Singapore? Those seem long shots, though perhaps possible.
China alone covers the vast potential for new YVR routes from AC: Chongqing and/or Chengdu, Guanghou, Hangzhou (especially if the UA expirement works) Xian, Harbin, and of course Singapore as the best SE Asia destination.
     
     
  #9290  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2016, 8:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trofirhen View Post
Other than Melbourne (and perhaps Auckland), do you imagine any other new Pacific or Oceania routes that would be workable with a 787? I guess that would about cover it, no?
Perth? Singapore? Those seem long shots, though perhaps possible.
Jakarta
Guangzhou
Bangkok
Kuala Lumpur
Chengdu
Manila
Shenzhen
Taipei
Mumbai
Kuminng
Xi'an
Chongqing
Hangzhou
Jeju
Fukuoka
Sapporo
Xiamen
Changsha
Wuhan
Qingdao
Nanjing
Zhengzhou
Busan
Ho Chi Minh City
Tianjin
Harbin
Nagoya
.......


Not like all of those make sense, but just to list some of the the large airport/metro areas that are not currently served by AC
     
     
  #9291  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2016, 9:05 PM
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What UA Experiment?
     
     
  #9292  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2016, 9:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Gordon View Post
What UA Experiment?
Direct non-stop route from SFO to secondary Chinese cities like Xi'an, Hangzhou, and Chengdu
     
     
  #9293  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2016, 11:11 PM
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So StatsCan numbers came out today and showed further growth in Vancouver employment, in fact it showed downright stupid levels of growth.

Vancouver has added 79,900 jobs over the past 12 months. For those of you who don't track that, that's insane. That equates to a growth rate of 6.3% YoY... the kinda numbers China is now fudging to achieve.

So that got me thinking, most economists predict Vancouver will continue to lead Canada in growth for the next 5 years, even assuming a return in the price of WTI you guys are supposed to outgrow the Albertan cities. If in fact that is the case what could YVR look like in 5 years. So I took my old chart:



And had some fun with it:



Now let me note before we get started that this is an assumption of what could be, given a huge set of circumstances go very well. So Trofirhen don't you go asking me when LATAM is starting to Sao Paolo

Some interesting changes you may note:

Air New Zealand - Apparently they are miffed at LAX on their treatment related to their AKL-LAX-LHR so I figured, what if they shipped it up here instead (it's a shorter routing afterall) and JV'd with their star alliance partner Air Canada on it. AC drops their second frequency to LHR, freeing up the 789 for Frankfurt, and lets NZ run it.

Air Canada - Not too many changes here, a few upgauges, a couple obvious new routes (Taipei, Frankfurt and Melbourne), but no major growth to China. Perhaps this is a something I could add on but so far it seems the Chinese airlines have been much more aggressive than AC so I've given the new routes and capacity to them.

Air Canada Rouge - Air Canada has a lot of 767s coming to Rouge and I figured a few of them must be hitting YVR. These all seemed sensible routes to me both from a range and PAX standpoint. It's pretty euro heavy but the 763 doesn't hit too many cities in Asia, and frankly asia is usually premium strong from YVR so Rouge seems better deployed to Europe IMO.

Rest of Star Alliance - Star Alliance by far sees the bulk of the growth here. Air China goes full 3x daily on a 777, Swiss takes over from Edelweiss (don't really see it happening but wouldn't it be great?), Thai, Turkish, Singapore and Asiana all rumored growth coming to fruition. Avianca I almost took off but didn't I think we are going to see a turn around in the minerals sector over the next few years and that combined with Colombia's strong economic growth could make a 3x 788 viable. Copa to panama is a bit of a long shot but it's just a 737 and they ordered a ton of them so it's possible.

One World - Not much of a change here, JAL upgauged to a 789 and Qantas going daily (will be a 789 or A350 but there are no seat maps for those yet so I just left it on a 744). Can't think of any other changes YVR will see from One World.

Sky Team - All predictable changes here, Air France daily, a few more frequencies for MU, and the big change here being the addition of LATAM. Might be a dumb call given the painful growth in South America these days but LATAM has a bunch of new A350 and dreamliner metal and they need to send it somewhere. Ties in very well with MU, CA and CZs Asian connections.

No Alliance - A few big changes here, figure Transat will send another 333 our way at some point. picks off a few once a week destinations similar to what they just did at Rome. Hainan was the big change here with Shenzhen and Xian, but I think both those markets make sense and with the other big Chinese players already locked into their hubs the pickings are there for Hainan. Volaris to Guadalajara also makes sense, though it was a toss up between that or Monterey. Maybe both?

So that is how I see the world at YVR in an optimistic sense. One I took off at the last moment but wouldn't be surprised to see in 5 or so years (maybe a bit longer) would be Iran air. They want to grow their business and there is a large wealthy Persian diaspora here. Makes sense to me. Would probably kill Turkish's business though.

What do you guys think? Too much? Not enough? Miss anything obvious?
     
     
  #9294  
Old Posted Jun 11, 2016, 12:29 AM
trofirhen trofirhen is offline
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Arrow .... the 2021 "fun" version ^^^^^^

I LOVE IT !!!!!!! What else is there to say? Anyone agree?
     
     
  #9295  
Old Posted Jun 11, 2016, 8:21 PM
Hourglass Hourglass is offline
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  #9296  
Old Posted Jun 11, 2016, 9:14 PM
trofirhen trofirhen is offline
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Arrow

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hourglass View Post
Did anyone really expect anything else? That good ol' Eastern Canada / YYZ / AC protectionism is still there.

Last edited by trofirhen; Jun 11, 2016 at 10:47 PM.
     
     
  #9297  
Old Posted Jun 12, 2016, 8:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hourglass View Post
The Vancouver Sun. I get more disappointed in their reporting day by day.

In the last paragraph their expert claims soon we should be seeing a Vancouver - Auckland flight established.

Only problem is we have had that route for a few years now.
     
     
  #9298  
Old Posted Jun 12, 2016, 10:41 AM
Hourglass Hourglass is offline
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Originally Posted by casper View Post
The Vancouver Sun. I get more disappointed in their reporting day by day.

In the last paragraph their expert claims soon we should be seeing a Vancouver - Auckland flight established.

Only problem is we have had that route for a few years now.
The writer might be mentioning Auckland in the context of an Air Canada route, but yeah, YVR-Auckland is doing quite well for Air New Zealand.
     
     
  #9299  
Old Posted Jun 13, 2016, 2:29 AM
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Good to see the Turkish community stepping up and Turkish Airline's interest in going out with Vancouver. It's funny that Seattle is the backup, lol.

As to the earlier question regarding Thai, I believe they are interested in both cities; likely starting with Vancouver since it is closest and easiest to get going. If demand is as projected, they'd then add Seattle. That's just a guess based on what I read and what folks posted concerning the competitive advantages Vancouver has; many of the very obvious - over Seattle.

I think Seattle's new Terminal plan is to basically redu the South Satellite. Seattle doesn't have the land/space to really construct a true International Terminal (ala YVR or SFO) that could ever hope to really compete. This IMO is really just Delta wanting to expand/rehab the South Terminal and SEA's desire to expand/modernize the Customs/Immigration; however, the fact that Delta is even interested in playing ball on this DOES show a commitment from DL to making SEA a gateway (which honestly I'm actually surprised given the loads). SEA is definitely trying to be a player, though - the little engine that 'could'.
     
     
  #9300  
Old Posted Jun 13, 2016, 6:49 AM
trofirhen trofirhen is offline
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Originally Posted by Hot Rod View Post
Good to see the Turkish community stepping up and Turkish Airline's interest in going out with Vancouver. It's funny that Seattle is the backup, lol.

As to the earlier question regarding Thai, I believe they are interested in both cities; likely starting with Vancouver since it is closest and easiest to get going. If demand is as projected, they'd then add Seattle. That's just a guess based on what I read and what folks posted concerning the competitive advantages Vancouver has; many of the very obvious - over Seattle.
...... however, the fact that Delta is even interested in playing ball on this DOES show a commitment from DL to making SEA a gateway (which honestly I'm actually surprised given the loads). SEA is definitely trying to be a player, though - the little engine that 'could'.
Hot Rod, I (and I'm sure all SSP Vancouver) love your support of Vancouver. I just don't get why you feel Vancouver has it all over Seattle, which has a much larger GDP$ than Vancouver (and,by extension, more business pax). Plus, Seattle is a larger metro by one million plus. I would have thought SEA would be first choice, not YVR.
     
     
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