CHICAGO | General Developments

[tintinex]

Originally Posted by msu2001la

Interesting plan. I would have assumed there would be some opposition from condo buildings along the lake, but maybe the historically high lake levels are muting that a bit?

http://chicago.curbed.com/2016/6/1/11830332/chicago-edgewater-lakefront-extension-renderings

I live on one of those buildings and I certainly welcome this plan. The lake has risen so much over the last few years that it already hits the back wall of the building next to mine. There used to be a strip of land in between that building and the water. I expect those neighbors are getting nervous about the lake rising even more

[Chi-Sky21]

Those high lake levels and more high winds may help Chicago get more parkland along the lake from Fullerton southward too. They are going to have to something about the high waves not only washing away the beach, damaging the trail, but also coming up onto LSD itself. As for this plan, i sure hope it goes through. They really need a path from Loyola area down to the rest of the lakefront paths. Going down that stretch of Sheridan on a bike is close to suicide. At least it was back in the day.....

[emathias]

Originally Posted by LouisVanDerWright

...
Yet it's nowhere near transit and almost never talked about on this forum.

I wouldn't say it's "nowhere near transit." It's just not near rail transit. The Diversey bus stops at it's front door, the Western bus stops a 5 minute walk away, and the Belmont bus is a 10 minute walk away.

[Steely Dan]

Originally Posted by Chi-Sky21

Going down that stretch of Sheridan on a bike is close to suicide.

and also illegal. cyclists are supposed to use the bike lanes on winthrop/kenmore to get through that stretch, though that doesn't always stop the occasional death-wisher from attempting it.

as for the proposed plan to expand the edgewater lakefront north of hollywood, i can only dream that i'll live long enough to see it realized.

[msu2001la]

Originally Posted by Chi-Sky21

Those high lake levels and more high winds may help Chicago get more parkland along the lake from Fullerton southward too. They are going to have to something about the high waves not only washing away the beach, damaging the trail, but also coming up onto LSD itself.

Here's a few ideas, just for fun:

[msu2001la]

The stretch between Oak Street and Ohio Street is particularly brutal. This area was supposed to be addressed as part of the NLSD relocation project, but that seems to have fallen off of the radar for now.

[r18tdi]

^ All that work and they wouldn't think to bury LSD underground?

[Mr Downtown]

Originally Posted by ardecila

People in the condo towers have reported drug deals, etc there and I think they'd prefer a well-lit landscaped park area.

They fought the idea hammer and tong when it was discussed in 2007-2008.

[emathias]

Originally Posted by ardecila

...
People in the condo towers have reported drug deals, etc
...

In some places that might almost be seen as a feature, lol

[msu2001la]

Originally Posted by Mr Downtown

They fought the idea hammer and tong when it was discussed in 2007-2008.

This is what I recall too.

[ChiHi]

Interesting plan. I would have assumed there would be some opposition from condo buildings along the lake, but maybe the historically high lake levels are muting that a bit?

http://chicago.curbed.com/2016/6/1/11830332/chicago-edgewater-lakefront-extension-renderings[/QUOTE]

Maybe they'll hire the fine craftsman that built Northerly Island.

[r18tdi]

Originally Posted by ChiHi

Maybe they'll hire the fine craftsman that built Northerly Island.

womp-womp

[SamInTheLoop]

Originally Posted by Mr Downtown

Or—through some sort of land-use planning—we could just refrain from putting big destinations where transit is inconvenient.

Naw, that's just crazy talk.

Bingo. Sometimes - often times - we need to get back to fundamentals first.

Some here have this - let's ignore land use planning to the point where the infrastructure makes so little sense that we'll be forced to build an 'outer ring train loop'.........as if that's a 'strategy' that will turn out alright in the end.....

[SamInTheLoop]

Originally Posted by moorhosj

You have an embedded assumption that they didn't do analysis on efficiency of access for workers. It is very probable they ran the numbers and came to a different conclusion than your assumption.

This land is 6 minutes walk from the Google campus. I would assume Google, the company with probably the most data in the world, analyzed this as well. Maybe they received commitment from the city that an Ashland BRT is coming. Maybe they are starting a food startup incubator and want to be close to talent. You are assuming you have all the information and you don't.

There's no arrogance here. It's a level-headed assessment of the site selection. You seem to display this perplexing attitude that many harbor that if some business makes a choice, they must know what they're doing. Businesses - yes, also large and successful ones - make bad choices everyday of the week - most are minor and relatively inconsequential. Some are purely internal-directed decisions, some are influenced to some degree by outside vendors, consultants, etc, etc. Some mistakes are more significant and even intractable. Where this mistake (assuming Harpo deal is completed) falls on the spectrum, I'm not exactly sure and only time will tell but my best guess is it's not insignificant, at minimum.

Re Google - it's their people that are making decisions (and yes, they too make mistakes often, despite being a very large, successful and even dominant in some respects company) - not some sort of algo that told them to locate in Fulton Market.

And, for the record - (again, I thought East Loop was odd choice because it was too far East, however that was a better site selection for a new HQ than Harpo....and, again, ideal would be somewhere within 5-6 blocks generally of the Canal/Monroe area) - this is interesting.....apparently what killed the deal at Prudential Plaza last year was the actual leak to the media. McD's CEO apparently had not yet gone to the board with the deal for approval at that time. Board no likey that, deal off......

[msu2001la]

Originally Posted by ChiHi

Maybe they'll hire the fine craftsman that built Northerly Island.

Maybe this is just what happens when you hire architects to lead the design of park/lakefront projects that feature no buildings.

Zing.

[SamInTheLoop]

Originally Posted by streetline

You can't have it both ways, either it's a psychological difference, or your thinking represents reality exactly. And, if it is a psychological thing, that's something that should be addressed with PR rather than wasting hundreds of thousands of commuters' time every day.

The expressway is not nearly the barrier you seem to be cast to it as; it's pretty close to the width of the river you'd cross going east, and given all the idling trains by the river at rush hour I wouldn't be surprised if the air quality is better to boot. And on your way west, you'll see more greenery, smaller crowds, less beggars, and nicer restaurants, on your way to work.

No - not having it both ways out all here. It's both too far west in reality - and - the pedestrian experience - the 'psychology' of going over the bridge across the expressway (this is what I'm speaking of, in case that wasn't clear), makes it both unpleasant and perceived by the pedestrian to be even longer/bleaker/etc than it actually is. It's psychology, but it's a very real thing at the same time. It just is. A similar length walk to the east certainly 'feels' shorter than a walk to the west from the stations when you are talking west of the expressway. I believe this 'effect' is part of what tjp was probably experiencing and perceiving when he mentioned it feels like a real trek walking from the commuter station area all the way over to Harpo.....

[LouisVanDerWright]

Originally Posted by emathias

I wouldn't say it's "nowhere near transit." It's just not near rail transit. The Diversey bus stops at it's front door, the Western bus stops a 5 minute walk away, and the Belmont bus is a 10 minute walk away.

By that definition every section of Chicago is "near transit" lol. The Diversey bus is infrequent and, well have you ever heard of anyone taking the Pulaski bus? It doesn't go anywhere most people are interested in going unless you have a very specific reason for going there. There will be 700 parking spaces in the Fields.

Originally Posted by ardecila

There is already beachfront along most of that stretch. The lake levels may play a part in it, but there's also safety concerns on the unlit, semi-private beaches. People in the condo towers have reported drug deals, etc there and I think they'd prefer a well-lit landscaped park area.

Didn't the last attempt at this call for LSD to be extended as well? I think a potential expansion of LSD cutting them off from the lake is really what they fear. A buddy of mine is now the president of the condo board in one of those old condo buildings and seems to think that's the real threat. They would much rather have a real park and beach than the riprap they have now so they can actually access the water instead of just stare at it.

Originally Posted by msu2001la

Maybe this is just what happens when you hire architects to lead the design of park/lakefront projects that feature no buildings.

Zing.

Or the Army Corps of ENGINEERS who actually ran the construction should have actually done their job. It's right there in their name. Honestly I don't know if there was much they could have done about this, the lake is at all time highs and, as we all know, has a pretty mean temper in general. Look what it does to the bulkheads downtown. Expose raw sand and dirt that was supposed to be out of reach of the waves to that kind of force and this result is not surprising in the least.

[msu2001la]

Originally Posted by LouisVanDerWright

Or the Army Corps of ENGINEERS who actually ran the construction should have actually done their job. It's right there in their name. Honestly I don't know if there was much they could have done about this, the lake is at all time highs and, as we all know, has a pretty mean temper in general. Look what it does to the bulkheads downtown. Expose raw sand and dirt that was supposed to be out of reach of the waves to that kind of force and this result is not surprising in the least.

Agree with all of this.

My post was in jest and I thought that was apparent, though I do find it annoying that park designs are being led by architecture firms who's only real qualification for this type of work is being famous for designing buildings.

[Mr Downtown]

Originally Posted by LouisVanDerWright

Didn't the last attempt at this call for LSD to be extended as well?

Friends of the Parks' Last Four Miles initiative specifically excluded any extension of Lake Shore Drive.

[HowardL]

Originally Posted by Mr Downtown

Friends of the Parks' Last Four Miles initiative specifically excluded any extension of Lake Shore Drive.

Sorry but fuck FOTPL. They have lost every last shred of credibility.