Phoenix Development News (3)

[azsunsurfer]

I wish they were better designed...They are useful, yes they are big to help motorist but they still look borderline tacky. I wish they were somewhat more "iconic?"

[Pink Jazz]

Originally Posted by exit2lef

That's right. Let's build a new prison where freeway sign opponents can be housed in the same cells as people who dare to advocate against the South Mountain Freeway. I actually have no problems with the signs, but I also respect the First Amendment rights of those who don't like them.

The problem is that there are no valid reasons to be opposed to them, regardless of First Amendment rights. They help tourists/newcomers and bring in revenue to the state that we taxpayers don't have to pay for. How is that a bad thing?

Originally Posted by azsunsurfer

I wish they were better designed...They are useful, yes they are big to help motorist but they still look borderline tacky. I wish they were somewhat more "iconic?"

The designs of such signs are regulated by the MUTCD, which ADOT has to follow.

[exit2lef]

Originally Posted by Pink Jazz

The problem is that there are no valid reasons to be opposed to them, regardless of First Amendment rights. They help tourists/newcomers and bring in revenue to the state that we taxpayers don't have to pay for. How is that a bad thing?

Like I said before, I have no problems with the freeway signs. I have a big problem with censorship via threats of imprisonment. For the First Amendment to be meaningful, it must apply to speech that you consider misinformed, misguided, or just plain dumb -- not just speech that conforms to your fantasy transportation scenarios.

[biggus diggus]

There's a lot of work going on at McKinley Row but I can't tell if it's work related to the development or just happens to be in front if it. The machinery there is mostly utility type of stuff.

[CrestedSaguaro]

Originally Posted by exit2lef

That's right. Let's build a new prison where freeway sign opponents can be housed in the same cells as people who dare to advocate against the South Mountain Freeway. I actually have no problems with the signs, but I also respect the First Amendment rights of those who don't like them.

I'm sure he was just joking about his imprisonment comment. Relax, lol.

As far as the information signs, almost every other state in the country has been using them for many years. I really never noticed Arizona not having them until reading this thread. I thought they have been in use since I moved here (3 years ago)? I use them constantly. I don't want to use my phone to search for food when driving 65 mph.

[biggus diggus]

They have been here as long as I can remember but they never advertise anything I want.

McDonald's? Nope, not eating that.
Circle K? Nope, not putting that in my car.

So, I get my phone out or use my GPS to find what I want anyway.

[PHX31]

I can see them being useful out in the rural areas where you're not sure if an exit has any type of food/gas/services. But in the middle of the city they're pretty useless.... drive in any direction at any exit and you'll quickly find any type of services you'd need.

[Pink Jazz]

Originally Posted by RonnieFoos

I'm sure he was just joking about his imprisonment comment. Relax, lol.

As far as the information signs, almost every other state in the country has been using them for many years. I really never noticed Arizona not having them until reading this thread. I thought they have been in use since I moved here (3 years ago)? I use them constantly. I don't want to use my phone to search for food when driving 65 mph.

Until 2013 Arizona only had them in rural areas, despite the national MUTCD containing provisions to allow them in urban areas since its 2000 edition. Some states continue to maintain these restrictions, and some don't have them at all.

In addition to adding provisions to allowing logo signs in urban areas, the 2000 MUTCD also eliminated the requirement for food establishments to serve three meals a day, and reduced the requirement from being open a minimum 7 days a week to 6 days a week (the latter largely due to lobbying to the feds from Chick-Fil-A).

[rocksteady]

Amazed at how long a discussion about freeway signs can be. The signs aren't for local residents, guys. Get over it and move on.

[ASU Diablo]

Originally Posted by combusean

Downtown Voices is reporting on their facebook page renderings for a new "Jefferson Place" to wrap around the Barrister Building.

Looks to be shy of 20 stories.

https://www.facebook.com/DowntownVoi...07631332630117

so back to actual development news....

I like the project...nice height!

[dtnphx]

From what I see, I like too.

[muertecaza]

Originally Posted by airomero83

so back to actual development news....

I like the project...nice height!

I can't tell from the pictures and the Facebook post if there are two different proposals, or what?

There appear to be two different presenters, one of which is presenting what appears to be the proposal we heard about before--two additional 6 story buildings matching the height of Barrister. Then the other presenter has the higher-rise pictures that show the building wrapping Barrister.

Does anyone know if this is still up in the air between the two, or were the pictures of the smaller proposal just for comparison, or what the status is?

[dtnphx]

Originally Posted by muertecaza

I can't tell from the pictures and the Facebook post if there are two different proposals, or what?

There appear to be two different presenters, one of which is presenting what appears to be the proposal we heard about before--two additional 6 story buildings matching the height of Barrister. Then the other presenter has the higher-rise pictures that show the building wrapping Barrister.

Does anyone know if this is still up in the air between the two, or were the pictures of the smaller proposal just for comparison, or what the status is?

Whoa, good point! I hope the taller version...

[CrestedSaguaro]

Originally Posted by dtnphx

Whoa, good point! I hope the taller version...

I think the high-rise proposal should be much more favored at this point...especially now with the potential Fry's coming directly around the corner. If the low-rise proposal were to be selected, that would be an emense waste and the potential loss to add many more residents to Downtown.

This along with the Fry's project could seriously jumpstart the Downtown population.

[ASU Diablo]

Originally Posted by RonnieFoos

I think the high-rise proposal should be much more favored at this point...especially now with the potential Fry's coming directly around the corner. If the low-rise proposal were to be selected, that would be an emense waste and the potential loss to add many more residents to Downtown.

This along with the Fry's project could seriously jumpstart the Downtown population.

So I'm confused...I thought the city already selected a winning proposal already, Crescent Bay Development Services, LLC.

https://www.phoenix.gov/financesite/Tabu...ed%20Proposer%20List%20-%20Barrister.pdf

[Obadno]

Originally Posted by rocksteady

Amazed at how long a discussion about freeway signs can be. The signs aren't for local residents, guys. Get over it and move on.

Seriously, Highways are always ugly. Who cares if there are some additional signs.

Unless you just are angry about the unnecessary use of public funds I guess.

[exit2lef]

Originally Posted by RonnieFoos

I'm sure he was just joking about his imprisonment comment. Relax, lol.

I don't think so. He's made repeated statements in support of criminal charges against opponents of the South Mountain Freeway.

[plinko]

This, especially in Phoenix. Totally unnecessary in a sprawling urban area where nearly every exit has a plethora of gas food and lodging options.

Have you ever noticed the lack of billboards in Tempe? Same concept for me.

A much more pleasant driving experience than being bombarded with a cacophony of visual stimuli.

Screw people who can't find an Exxon station or a Wendy's while driving along I-10 inside the 101 or 202. It's not difficult.

Originally Posted by PHX31

I can see them being useful out in the rural areas where you're not sure if an exit has any type of food/gas/services. But in the middle of the city they're pretty useless.... drive in any direction at any exit and you'll quickly find any type of services you'd need.

[nickw252]

Deleted

[gymratmanaz]

OMG....Are we still talking about street signs on this forum. Is there a sign forum somewhere? Please, God, let there be!!!!!