Quote:
Originally Posted by BCPhil
Well, Toronto also has an extensive streetcar network in the areas of heavy use. Like in the SW part of the City, there are streetcar lines on College, Dundas, King, and Queen. And it's pretty high because further north you have the St Claire Streetcar that carries 33,000 people a day on just 7km of track. The 504 King carries 40,000 riders a day just between Bathurst and John streets.
|
You're making it sound like the reason that transit use is so heavy is because it is a streetcar. But I think we all know that Toronto's streetcar system isn't any more well designed than a high-frequency local bus service. Heck, up until the recent introduction of the (heavily delayed) Bombardier streetcars, the system hasn't provided a capacity advantage due to its technology.
There's certainly a merit to having that sort of high capacity, high frequency transit in place - but it's pretty clear that the difference has more to do with the neighbourhood design and perhaps even matters of scale. Toronto's downtown core and surrounding area is huge - I can understand why walking or biking to your destination would appear far less convenient/feasible than hopping on a transit bus/street-car and paying the fare. That huge SW area you're talking about would be distant from the downtown core in Vancouver terms. From Denman to Beatty is 2.2km - just the segment between Bathurst and Jervis streets is already longer than this, and there's plenty more on either side. Let's say a commuter needs to travel on the 504 King from Dufferin to Yonge Street. That's over 4km - in Vancouver the same distance would be to travel from Granville & Georgia across the bridge and all the way to King Edward Ave. That's probably bikable, but much less walkable - and I reckon there are many people travelling further than that than could bike.
Combine that with the inferior developments for walking and cycling and it seems evident why transit use is higher. Toronto is a bigger city and there are bigger travel distances. People without cars really do need transit in order to manage. They will take whatever.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut
It seems more like a symptom of Transit-Oriented Design than Skytrain per se; you'll notice that the residents around Millennium and Canada Lines don't use them as much.
Might be a good idea to compare it with another map in 4+ years, when the Evergreen opens and Cambie is denser.
|
That's true, but it's also true in this region that transit-oriented design is often brought forward after the construction of transit itself. The Expo Line has certainly been a leading example of how communities were re-adapted to be optimal to nearby transit. The Millennium Line has yet to maximize this as there is much lower residential density in the in-between places on Lougheed, but it's getting there with leading examples in Brentwood and Gilmore. The Canada Line just needs more time, but it is already on its way.
To conclude this I think it might be noteworthy to consider the sizes/positions of the zones and boundaries on the map. The ones around the Millennium Line do appear to exhibit a lower transit usage, but the squares are larger and take up much more of the surrounding low-res area that's far enough to have many non-transit households. Each of those zones around the Expo Line is much smaller, and closer. I don't mean to cry "gerrymandering" here but it certainly seems like the direct advantages of SkyTrain are not being conveyed as well near the Millennium & Canada Lines (look at the borders around Brentwood, for example).
Prev
Linear Mode
