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  #4601  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2016, 1:43 AM
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SW Noise Crazies this year? I'm also guessing the horse people will be out again.
     
     
  #4602  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2016, 3:08 AM
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Quote:
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- Last years question was regarding availability of the terminal to handle 2016 traffic given the delayed opening of International Terminal. Unfortunately the recession (depress traffic) and that WS chose to hub out of LGW means that YYC can handle the summer traffic peak.
Summer 2016 will be the busiest period Concourse A has ever seen. Between Edelweiss, Hainan, BA, KLM, Transat, Sunwing, WS Widebodies and the expansion to Encore ground load gates area it will be unlike any summer before.

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Originally Posted by Bigtime View Post
SW Noise Crazies this year?
That would be my guess as well. Hopefully they don't overshadow announcements related to the International Terminal.

Amazing the conversations I've had with people over the past year, many along the lines of "Why are you opening a new terminal during an economic downturn?" Really makes me scratch my head. I try explaining to them about gates being at capacity, a 35+ year old terminal hitting EOL in certain areas and, oh, that the new terminal has been under design and construction for nearly 10 years. Then the blank stares ensue.

Last edited by yyc_engineer; Apr 19, 2016 at 3:20 AM.
     
     
  #4603  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2016, 11:13 AM
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Hainan - seasonal?

I cannot see any flights scheduled past 29 October.

Does anybody know if this route is actually seasonal?

I was under the assumption it was to be year-round.

It's possible the schedules just aren't loaded yet but there definitely aren't any scheduled past 29 October.
     
     
  #4604  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2016, 3:08 PM
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The Hainan website has booking past the date. not sure if they are non-stop though

Last edited by People.talking; Apr 19, 2016 at 3:21 PM.
     
     
  #4605  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2016, 5:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Johnny Aussie View Post
I cannot see any flights scheduled past 29 October.

Does anybody know if this route is actually seasonal?

I was under the assumption it was to be year-round.

It's possible the schedules just aren't loaded yet but there definitely aren't any scheduled past 29 October.
Over the past 18 months I have seen so many unusual booking issues with Chinese airlines that I no longer trust forward bookings as a future indicator. For example, in a North American/European context airlines should be obtaining route rights 9-12 months before first flight, however frequently this happens 2-6 months for Chinese airlines.

On the flip side, initial low load factors do not seem to phase the Chinese Airlines. This is a good thing given the new route status of YYC-PEK and economic downturn as there is less risk the flight will get pulled.
     
     
  #4606  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2016, 5:53 PM
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So many places, check out this guide for all the info:

http://www.dude8472productions.com/yyc-spotting-guide-1.html
Awesome!
     
     
  #4607  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2016, 6:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cage View Post
Reminder that the Calgary Airport AGM is this coming Thursday at 11am.

Two years ago the crazies were the McCall Lake Golf Course preservation society.
Last year the crazies were the save our horses from being shipped to Asia for slaughter.
Who will be this years' crazies????
I'll go along with Bigtime and choose the SW Nimby's and their noise complaints.

AGM would be interesting to go to, unfortunately it's during the day so that precludes me from being able to attend.
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  #4608  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2016, 6:25 PM
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Yeah I'm 50/50 on if I'll make it this year, I went last year and it was packed.
     
     
  #4609  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2016, 7:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by People.talking View Post
The Hainan website has booking past the date. not sure if they are non-stop though
Yes bookable but direct flights end 29 October. After that date it's booking through YYZ. It looks like YYC is the only city not showing direct flights after that date. Even MAN, another new city this June, shows direct after the end of October.
As I said it is possible flights post October just aren't loaded yet. Or maybe it is to be seasonal after all?
But like Cage says, Chinese Airlines can have booking issues. Who knows.
     
     
  #4610  
Old Posted Apr 21, 2016, 6:12 PM
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The Airport AGM is now into the Q&A part, tweet from the event:

Quote:
Amanda Stephenson ‏@AmandaMsteph 4m4 minutes ago

At Calgary Airport AGM, which is quickly turning into a meeting about airport noise. Lots of frustrated Marlborough residents here. #yyc
     
     
  #4611  
Old Posted Apr 21, 2016, 10:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigtime View Post
The Airport AGM is now into the Q&A part, tweet from the event:
How did you find the AGM? I thought Rick Erickson's praises for YYC a bit over the top... but since the CEO's about to retire, I guess we'll let that slide...

Some good questions about liquidity, no one asked about Hainan's progress though.

Oh and of course the noise complaints, mentioned that the noise reports will be made public, we'll see.
     
     
  #4612  
Old Posted Apr 21, 2016, 11:32 PM
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I wasn't there, just saw what was being tweeted.
     
     
  #4613  
Old Posted Apr 22, 2016, 12:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cage View Post
in a North American/European context airlines should be obtaining route rights 9-12 months before first flight, however frequently this happens 2-6 months for Chinese airlines.


CA to YUL had a similar situation. At one point, bookings were only available for the first two months of service. (Sept and October). But here we are, end of April, and the flight is still running.

I wouldn't worry about it. Stuff like this seems to be the norm with Chinese carriers.

Last edited by thenoflyzone; Apr 22, 2016 at 1:41 PM.
     
     
  #4614  
Old Posted Apr 22, 2016, 1:08 AM
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New video has been posted!!:
https://youtu.be/A7b1VvUk_sM
     
     
  #4615  
Old Posted Apr 22, 2016, 2:06 PM
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Originally Posted by hoboman27 View Post
How did you find the AGM? I thought Rick Erickson's praises for YYC a bit over the top... but since the CEO's about to retire, I guess we'll let that slide...

Some good questions about liquidity, no one asked about Hainan's progress though.

Oh and of course the noise complaints, mentioned that the noise reports will be made public, we'll see.
This AGM was really long. Formal portion of the AGM was 45 minutes long and Q&A was just as long. Especially the last guy up at the mike, holy smokes he asked three questions about all kinds of stuff, cutting into everyone's lunch hour. The last guy was me.

Interestingly enough, it was not the SW Calgary noise crazies that made a seen but rather the NE residents of Marlborough area that were kicking up a fight.

John Schmal (former city alderman) lead the charge for the airport noise hating crowd. It became apparent through listening to Schmal's rant (at times it was getting into Larry Heather territory and maybe approaching an Oscar Fech incoherent mess) that what Marlborough residents want is for departures off 17R to converge with 17L, so that departing aircraft are over Deerfoot and Mayland Heights and away from Marlborough. From looking at a map, it is apparent that whether its 0, 5, 10, or 15 degree turn; the community will have aircraft flying overhead.

The second presenter on Marlborough noise issues did have one good point, the 1979 NEF contour and AVPA (Airport Vicinity Protection Area) did not account for the Navcan required 15 degree turn instead the study and protection area assumed a no turn scenario.

Overall I was okay with Rick Erickson's speech, but one thing I have noticed is the Erickson goes to everything Calgary Airport related and is always hosted by Calgary airport. Erickson and Atkinson have known each other for over 25 years and Atkinson is probably responsible for a material amount of revenue for Erickson's firm.

The final two presenters (including me) were primarily focused what will happen to the current terminal building. This is relevant because the airport authority is exclusively focused on presenting the new international terminal and not mentioning the domestic terminal refurbishment.

As a user of Calgary airport it is comforting to know that the CAA has financial capacity to continue with refurbishment. As I stated at the meeting, the standard operating procedure for airports is to complete the major eapansion and then spend the net 5-10 years paying down the debt. This is similar to over extending oneself on home purchase and then not having enough cash to replace the car while simultaneously hoping the furnace and kitchen appliances don't require replacement.

I am disappointed there will not be a consolidation of domestic pre-board screening into the US pre-clearance area. As a traveller who uses mobile checkin and does not have checked bags; central security would have provided me with ability to avoid the checkin hall area entirely. Additionally, central security would have guaranteed Nexus lanes would be open longer and have exclusive status (meaning there would be no regular passenger traffic through the Nexus lane). However I understand the Airport's viewpoint, it is not preferable to require all pax to checkin at the ends of the terminal building only to walk to the central area for security screening and then back to the ends of the terminal in order to board their flight.

On the subject of trials for new international terminal, the airport will be conducting two types of trials, small focus group trials and large public oriented trials. Stay tuned to the airport website for the large public trials which will likely be just before opening and are more focused on measuring passenger throughput.
     
     
  #4616  
Old Posted Apr 22, 2016, 5:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cage View Post
This AGM was really long. Formal portion of the AGM was 45 minutes long and Q&A was just as long. Especially the last guy up at the mike, holy smokes he asked three questions about all kinds of stuff, cutting into everyone's lunch hour. The last guy was me.

Interestingly enough, it was not the SW Calgary noise crazies that made a seen but rather the NE residents of Marlborough area that were kicking up a fight.

John Schmal (former city alderman) lead the charge for the airport noise hating crowd. It became apparent through listening to Schmal's rant (at times it was getting into Larry Heather territory and maybe approaching an Oscar Fech incoherent mess) that what Marlborough residents want is for departures off 17R to converge with 17L, so that departing aircraft are over Deerfoot and Mayland Heights and away from Marlborough. From looking at a map, it is apparent that whether its 0, 5, 10, or 15 degree turn; the community will have aircraft flying overhead.

The second presenter on Marlborough noise issues did have one good point, the 1979 NEF contour and AVPA (Airport Vicinity Protection Area) did not account for the Navcan required 15 degree turn instead the study and protection area assumed a no turn scenario.

Overall I was okay with Rick Erickson's speech, but one thing I have noticed is the Erickson goes to everything Calgary Airport related and is always hosted by Calgary airport. Erickson and Atkinson have known each other for over 25 years and Atkinson is probably responsible for a material amount of revenue for Erickson's firm.

The final two presenters (including me) were primarily focused what will happen to the current terminal building. This is relevant because the airport authority is exclusively focused on presenting the new international terminal and not mentioning the domestic terminal refurbishment.

As a user of Calgary airport it is comforting to know that the CAA has financial capacity to continue with refurbishment. As I stated at the meeting, the standard operating procedure for airports is to complete the major eapansion and then spend the net 5-10 years paying down the debt. This is similar to over extending oneself on home purchase and then not having enough cash to replace the car while simultaneously hoping the furnace and kitchen appliances don't require replacement.

I am disappointed there will not be a consolidation of domestic pre-board screening into the US pre-clearance area. As a traveller who uses mobile checkin and does not have checked bags; central security would have provided me with ability to avoid the checkin hall area entirely. Additionally, central security would have guaranteed Nexus lanes would be open longer and have exclusive status (meaning there would be no regular passenger traffic through the Nexus lane). However I understand the Airport's viewpoint, it is not preferable to require all pax to checkin at the ends of the terminal building only to walk to the central area for security screening and then back to the ends of the terminal in order to board their flight.

On the subject of trials for new international terminal, the airport will be conducting two types of trials, small focus group trials and large public oriented trials. Stay tuned to the airport website for the large public trials which will likely be just before opening and are more focused on measuring passenger throughput.
Well to be honest, the airport authority is in a monopoly position, they can always jack up rates and what not if they really needed the money...

As for the trials, I'm sure YYC_Engineer was there too, so let's ask him to have us posted on that.

Good questions Cage, and now I know what you look like...
     
     
  #4617  
Old Posted Apr 22, 2016, 6:42 PM
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The final two presenters (including me) were primarily focused what will happen to the current terminal building. This is relevant because the airport authority is exclusively focused on presenting the new international terminal and not mentioning the domestic terminal refurbishment.
Great question Cage, something that I'm curious about too. More than just curious, as it may directly impact my livelihood! I think I said this last year too, but good on you for getting up to the mic. It takes balls to ask a question in front of that many influential people.

I think everyone is just so focused on opening the new terminal successfully that the B-refurb has taken a bit of a backseat until 2017.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hoboman27 View Post
As for the trials, I'm sure YYC_Engineer was there too, so let's ask him to have us posted on that.
I don't know a lot, but there will definitely be at least one full scale trial (think hundreds of mock passengers). I will pass on any info that I have!

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Good questions Cage, and now I know what you look like...
Ditto. Let me know if you attend next year and I will introduce myself!
     
     
  #4618  
Old Posted Apr 22, 2016, 6:45 PM
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Also, I was amazed to learn about the rough financial situation of GTAA! Didn't even know airport authorities could operate at a loss!
     
     
  #4619  
Old Posted Apr 22, 2016, 8:18 PM
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Cage, you should have made multiple mentions to a "Plan B" to bug Ken King.
     
     
  #4620  
Old Posted Apr 22, 2016, 8:57 PM
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I'm sure it has been answered here before and I assume the answer has to do with capacity but is there any valid reason that they could not run all arrivals onto one of the parallels and all departures off the other instead of mixing them? You would immediately eliminate the noise issue from Marlborough and other east side communites (although not Airdrie or Skyview Ranch) as traffic patterns would revert to how they were before the parallel opened in terms of where aircraft are when the airport is running a south operation. If capacity is the issue what is the difference between doing that and how they are running it now? Is it significant?
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