ATLANTA | Development Thread V

[shivtim]

Originally Posted by Martinman

The Crum & Forster building is not integrated at all with the rest of the site. There's the interior courtyard which you would think we would have learned by now is terrible for retail. And then there is this massively wide L- shaped tower. If the Tech space and for-lease space we're vertically stacked, we'd be looking at close to 40 stories.

Co-sign. Horrible use of the block, big middle finger to the C&F, and absolutely bizarre mis-matching step/ramp design on the southern facade.

[Libertarian]

To this layman it doesn't seem to blend with the C&F building, Tech Square, or the Biltmore. Something more understated would have been appropriate but what do I know? I let my wife advise me what to wear.

[RocketSurgeon]

Originally Posted by ATLcubs

I agree. I'm not real sure where all the animosity is coming from, I guess it stems from the same place that the negative reaction to NCRs original design came from. I don't think it's a bad building at all, and that's a cartoonish rendering of what it will actually look like, so it'll look a lot better (or less bad for some of you) once the actual thing is built. Just my two cents

I never minded NCR. It didn't look too interesting at first, but I've never had a problem with "safe" designs. Hell, I'm usually defending Novare because we need the basic infill. That HPCC is the first project I've seen in ten years that I actually hate. It's not the materials but the disjointed shape of the thing that bothers me. To each his own, though

[GeorgiaPeanuts]

Grabbed some pictures of a couple projects on Sunday

Heights at West Midtown


Phipps Plaza Renovations

[Tuckerman]

Architecture, like art and music, is largely a matter of taste. If is interesting how the Crum and Foster has been transformed by some into an architectural "gem" when it really is like many buildings in the NE and mid-Atlantic and would be rather uneventful there. It stands out because it is an unusual building in Atlanta. The new computing center is a rather typical Portman effort, well known and well hated and or liked in Atlanta. The important thing is that vacant areas in the CBD get filled. Most CBDs that are interesting, e.g. SF, Chicago, NYC are in fact a hodgepodge of styles, but they are tight and continuous. IMO continuity beats personal views of what is ugly or beautiful because those opinions change over time.

[shivtim]

Originally Posted by Tuckerman

Architecture, like art and music, is largely a matter of taste. If is interesting how the Crum and Foster has been transformed by some into an architectural "gem" when it really is like many buildings in the NE and mid-Atlantic and would be rather uneventful there. It stands out because it is an unusual building in Atlanta. The new computing center is a rather typical Portman effort, well known and well hated and or liked in Atlanta. The important thing is that vacant areas in the CBD get filled. Most CBDs that are interesting, e.g. SF, Chicago, NYC are in fact a hodgepodge of styles, but they are tight and continuous. IMO continuity beats personal views of what is ugly or beautiful because those opinions change over time.

This is a strawman. Nobody said don't build something on that lot. The choice isn't "build this Portman building" or "build nothing at all." We have DRC for a reason. The actual look of the building is a minor quibble, but the layout with the interior facing courtyard is a huge problem. We've seen over and over in Atlanta that this just creates dead streets. It's entirely inappropriate for this area of Midtown. If they redesigned the site layout so that all of that retail and active use space was facing nice tree-lined sidewalks, I don't think you'd see anyone complaining on here.

[jsvh]

Originally Posted by shivtim

This is a strawman. Nobody said don't build something on that lot. The choice isn't "build this Portman building" or "build nothing at all." We have DRC for a reason. The actual look of the building is a minor quibble, but the layout with the interior facing courtyard is a huge problem. We've seen over and over in Atlanta that this just creates dead streets. It's entirely inappropriate for this area of Midtown. If they redesigned the site layout so that all of that retail and active use space was facing nice tree-lined sidewalks, I don't think you'd see anyone complaining on here.

It is a straw man as long as you are just voicing your personal thoughts. It becomes a real deterrent to development if you start to make laws that add cost and complexity to building something. Then you really will be pushing towards nothing on the lot over something.

[shivtim]

Originally Posted by jsvh

It is a straw man as long as you are just voicing your personal thoughts. It becomes a real deterrent to development if you start to make laws that add cost and complexity to building something. Then you really will be pushing towards nothing on the lot over something.

But we already have exactly what you're talking about. We have zoning laws. We have requirements from Blueprint Midtown. These things definitely add cost and complexity to everything that is built. But I like living in a place that requires a new development to have a sidewalk. It's not a "nothing or something" choice at all. We're just avoiding bad development. For the record, I think the current proposal does fit all of the existing requirements, and could be approved as is, it's just a bad design and way too inward-facing for Midtown.

[GeorgiaPeanuts]

http://www.bizjournals.com/atlanta/real_talk/2016/03/united-ways-downtown-campus-eyed-for-sale.html

The United Way of Greater Atlanta is exploring options for its downtown campus that could include the sale of the 4-acre property, as developers and their capital partners continue gravitating back to the city’s urban core.

The United Way plans to pick a real estate services firm in the next week that will assist the nonprofit with its decision. The process would take months and might include the United Way selling the property, which occupies about 4 acres at 100 Edgewood Avenue and 99 Auburn Avenue and includes an aging 18-story office building and surface parking lot.

[Tuckerman]

Originally Posted by shivtim

This is a strawman. Nobody said don't build something on that lot. The choice isn't "build this Portman building" or "build nothing at all." We have DRC for a reason. The actual look of the building is a minor quibble, but the layout with the interior facing courtyard is a huge problem. We've seen over and over in Atlanta that this just creates dead streets. It's entirely inappropriate for this area of Midtown. If they redesigned the site layout so that all of that retail and active use space was facing nice tree-lined sidewalks, I don't think you'd see anyone complaining on here.

I don't see my comments as a "strawman." I don't think anything was misrepresented in my comment. That architectural design of high rises is a matter of taste is patently true. I am not fond of the Portman design personally, but that does not mean it is bad architecture. I think the key problem is the overall use of the space around the Crum and Foster building and the failure to better set it in the overall design; a secondary problem, as has been noted by others, is the closed in courtyard. These usually don;t work unless they have through traffic of pedestrians, that is, if one could walk all the way from Spring to W Peachtree in an arcade, then this retail area might rally succeed.

[jsvh]

Originally Posted by shivtim

But we already have exactly what you're talking about. We have zoning laws. We have requirements from Blueprint Midtown. These things definitely add cost and complexity to everything that is built. But I like living in a place that requires a new development to have a sidewalk. It's not a "nothing or something" choice at all. We're just avoiding bad development. For the record, I think the current proposal does fit all of the existing requirements, and could be approved as is, it's just a bad design and way too inward-facing for Midtown.

Yes. I am not denying that we don't have rules / laws / building codes that add cost and complexity to everything built today. Nor that those or other possible laws would not be beneficial. But just pointing out that if we decide to "turn up the dial" on laws and regulations on development, we will drag down the amount of development. (And if we get rid of existing laws like fire codes it will spur more development, but that doesn't mean there wouldn't be other consequences. Like fire.) Either way, we should be aware that changes to these rules and regulation do have very real effects on how much development happens and could very well be the deciding factor between "something or nothing" happening at a site.

[arjay57]

Originally Posted by jsvh

Yes. I am not denying that we don't have rules / laws / building codes that add cost and complexity to everything built today. Nor that those or other possible laws would not be beneficial. But just pointing out that if we decide to "turn up the dial" on laws and regulations on development, we will drag down the amount of development. (And if we get rid of existing laws like fire codes it will spur more development, but that doesn't mean there wouldn't be other consequences. Like fire.) Either way, we should be aware that changes to these rules and regulation do have very real effects on how much development happens and could very well be the deciding factor between "something or nothing" happening at a site.

Not to get off into the weeds, but I think the city should hold the bar high on new development. While that may deter some development it will tend to increase quality and property values overall.

That being said, I sort of like the Portman renderings and look forward to seeing more details of what it will be like at street level.

[Triptychtwo]

http://www.ajc.com/news/news/local-govt-...ks-for-entertainment-district-at-/nqfnk/

The Atlanta Hawks are in discussions to redevelop the area surrounding Philips Arena into a mixed-use entertainment district, multiple people with knowledge of the negotiations told The Atlanta Journal-Constitution.

The plan, which would involve investments of hundreds of millions of dollars, could rank among the largest commercial redevelopments conceived for downtown Atlanta in a generation, according to several people who declined to be named because of the sensitivity of the negotiations.

The discussions are fluid and coincide with negotiations with the city over a major Philips Arena renovation, which was first reported by the AJC in October. It’s unclear when a deal could come together, though state legislation could be required to clear the way for the project.

[micropundit]

371 East Paces Ferry, a five-story. 118,000 square foot medical office building by The Loudermilk Companies would be connected (via a parking deck) to another, larger tower in development by the same company in Buckhead Village. The medical office project, located at 371 E. Paces Ferry Road would house a surgical center, primary care and pharmacy operations above three levels of parking, with 5,000-square-feet of retail at the base.

Developers want to double the maximum parking requirements to 607 spaces to support medical-office demand, and a Buckhead Development Review Committee recently gave the thumbs-up, the committee requested that areas of the proposal on Buckhead Avenue be activated with art and that all utilities be buried.

http://atlanta.curbed.com/2016/3/7/11174392/renderings-buckhead-villages-latest-proposal-

[atlwarrior]

Originally Posted by sbrptree

Surveyors spent most of Saturday marking up the 7th @ Peachtree (881 Peachtree) Hanover Midtown site....

Once Hanover announces something they waste no time. They are the real deal.

[RocketSurgeon]

Originally Posted by atlwarrior

Once Hanover announces something they waste no time. They are the real deal.

Funny you should say that with 1010 still being a hole in the ground! They must have run into some problems with the foundation or something. I think it's been under construction for nearly a year now, and they haven't finished pouring the first slab yet.

In better news, a fence is up at the Related tower on 14th, so that must be fully underway (not just clearing).

[Atlanta3000]

Broadstone Buckhead Village

• 3190 Cains Hill Place
• 12 stories
• 275 apartments
• 15,000 SF retail

http://view.exacttarget.com/?j=fe5e13757...1679&jb=ffcf14&ju=fe0e12777d6c0274731279

[pica]

Originally Posted by GeorgiaPeanuts

Phipps Plaza Renovations

Wow. This new façade, full of fake storefronts with fake windows and no doors, reminds me that thing Walmart does when they try to class-up a supercenter by making it look like multiple different shops.

[Atlanta3000]

Originally Posted by pica

Wow. This new façade, full of fake storefronts with fake windows and no doors, reminds me that thing Walmart does when they try to class-up a supercenter by making it look like multiple different shops.

My house is literally right behind this mall and the neighborhood is calling it "Phipps Super Center".

[bigstick]

Originally Posted by Atlanta3000

My house is literally right behind this mall and the neighborhood is calling it "Phipps Super Center".

LOL. Whilst I would not go that far, but I am not blown away by it either.