Stadiums and Arenas of Canada part 2

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by esquire

^ I guess the hockey correspondents must always be on vacation whenever I'm down in TX or CA... why else would there hardly be a word about hockey in the newspapers or on local TV? Not to mention the fact that you hardly ever see anyone wearing team gear.

Come on guys, kids playing a sport does not equate to mainstream popularity. I'm sure lots of awesome high school lacrosse players come out of California too.

I am mostly with you on this esquire. Yes, hockey has grown a lot in the US Sunbelt but I think it's popularity is being overstated by some on here.

When I travel to the northern US in places like Upstate NY and New England, one thing I notice is how the visibility of hockey drops like a stone. Yes, it's there and you see it from time to time, but for example I've been to restaurants and sports bars and I don't think I've ever seen a game on a big screen, much less people actually paying attention to it. Not saying it never happens, but it's not something that seems to be part of the main sports diet for the average person.

The difference in the short drive between Watertown NY and Kingston ON is quite striking in this respect. Kingston is all hockey when it comes to sports interest. In Watertown, yes there are lots of kids who play hockey but somehow I doubt that many kids are talking about the Rangers or Sabres game from the night before in the schoolyard.

[esquire]

^ The only place I've been to in the US where hockey is more or less at the same level as other sports is in my neighbouring states of North Dakota, and to a lesser extent Minnesota. In those places people will play and follow the pro game to a similar extent as compared to football/NFL, basketball/NBA and baseball/MLB. You'll see guys wearing Wild or Blackhawks jerseys in Fargo, for example, and some people will watch the game at a bar. But even then it's a far cry from Canada where hockey clearly reigns supreme.

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by esquire

Great, but I stand by my point that if it ever gets a team, the CFL will become a much bigger deal in Halifax than the NHL is in places like Dallas.

Sure thing.

Originally Posted by esquire

Come on guys, kids playing a sport does not equate to mainstream popularity. I'm sure lots of awesome high school lacrosse players come out of California too.

And i'm not saying it equates to mainstream popularity. Nowhere have I stated that hockey will surpass football, basketball, et. al. in America. I'm saying there's more interest than there was 20 years ago and that's an undeniable fact. More interest =/= most popular, or mainstream.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by jhikka

and i'm not saying it equates to mainstream popularity. Nowhere have i stated that hockey will surpass football, basketball, et. Al. In america. I'm saying there's more interest than there was 20 years ago and that's an undeniable fact. More interest =/= most popular, or mainstream.

ok?

I must say, you really take a strange approach to these discussions. You respond to my post about the likelihood that football would take off in Halifax in a way that exceeds hockey in sunbelt cities, and you go on telling me that hockey has grown in sunbelt cities over the last 20 years? No one ever said it didn't... who are you arguing with?

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by esquire

ok?

I must say, you really take a strange approach to these discussions. You respond to my post about the likelihood that football would take off in Halifax in a way that exceeds hockey in sunbelt cities, and you go on telling me that hockey has grown in sunbelt cities over the last 20 years? No one ever said it didn't... who are you arguing with?

It was a rough comparison to make because football is already prevalent in Halifax via CIS and local high schools whereas there was no basis for hockey in Dallas prior to the NHL, so of course a Halifax football team would garner more interest and become more prevalent from the starter block. Folks like to make fun of hockey in the southern US so I tend to get a bit defensive.

[Oilkountry]

Originally Posted by JHikka

Folks like to make fun of hockey in the southern US so I tend to get a bit defensive.

I didn't see anyone make fun of the hockey support in southern markets

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by JHikka

It was a rough comparison to make because football is already prevalent in Halifax via CIS and local high schools whereas there was no basis for hockey in Dallas prior to the NHL, so of course a Halifax football team would garner more interest and become more prevalent from the starter block. Folks like to make fun of hockey in the southern US so I tend to get a bit defensive.

I have noticed. But you are from NB and live in Ottawa. Why would you care enough to be defensive?

[elly63]

Originally Posted by JHikka

whereas there was no basis for hockey in Dallas prior to the NHL,

Lets not go that far,Texas had a pretty good hockey history with the Dallas Black Hawks of the CHL and the Houston Apollos (the number one farm team of the Canadiens). Also the Houston Aeros had a fair degree of notoriety in the WHA with the Howes.

[Nathan]

Back to a current stadium.

A picture of old Mosaic; the Labour Day Classic last year. A good view of the skyline too...


Source = CFL Twitter Account

[25grapes]

^ Does anybody know how they came up with that shape for the East grandstands?

[esquire]

Originally Posted by 25grapes

^ Does anybody know how they came up with that shape for the East grandstands?

That grandstand backs up against a street, so they clipped it in the NE corner... the alternative would have been cantilevering it over the street which I'm sure people in the neighbourhood would not have been crazy about!

Here's a clearer view:


source: ottawacitizen.com

I'm sure but for that factor, they probably would have put an upper deck on the east stands as with the west stands... as you can see though, there just wasn't enough room.

[Bluenote]

Originally Posted by JHikka

Sure thing.



And i'm not saying it equates to mainstream popularity. Nowhere have I stated that hockey will surpass football, basketball, et. al. in America. I'm saying there's more interest than there was 20 years ago and that's an undeniable fact. More interest =/= most popular, or mainstream.

Ummm there was not any major hockey leagues in the sunbelt 20 years ago. So even if one team was added it would be an increase.
Now although they have empty arenas now which they did not have ten years ago. I'd ha e to say it's on the decline. Unless all those pictures my friends send me from Arizona are photo shopped? Amd when I watch a game against most sunbelt teams the arena is either empty or half empty.
Yes some teams still attract crowds. But are they for the home team? No, and as me example. My Jets played the panthers the other day. The arena was half full of jets fans. Take those away and you have an empty arena.
I have seen games in LA even and the arena had countless empty seats.

[25grapes]

It's amazing how much of a positive impact (visually) the temporary stands have on Old Mosaic. All this discussion about building a stadium in Halifax had me thinking that if a suitable owner was found, they could just build a similar stadium to Empire Field which would cost about $14M which could buy them considerable time to finance and build a permanent stadium.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by 25grapes

It's amazing how much of a positive impact (visually) the temporary stands have on Old Mosaic. All this discussion about building a stadium in Halifax had me thinking that if a suitable owner was found, they could just build a similar stadium to Empire Field which would cost about $14M which could buy them considerable time to finance and build a permanent stadium.

They gussied the place up nicely in 2013, during the Grey Cup season. I'm actually surprised they put so much money into Mosaic Stadium considering they knew it wasn't going to last much longer... at least the stands will be reused elsewhere in the province.

It shows a lot more nicely on TV, that's for sure. For many years the overarching design principle of CFL stadiums was to cram as many seats between the goal lines as possible...which was great from a ticket buying fan's perspective but made for lousy TV views as much of the field had nothing in the background (especially the endzones), making it seem like the games were being played at a local community centre field or some such.

[SkydivePilot]

Originally Posted by esquire

That grandstand backs up against a street, so they clipped it in the NE corner... the alternative would have been cantilevering it over the street which I'm sure people in the neighbourhood would not have been crazy about!

Here's a clearer view:


source: ottawacitizen.com

I'm sure but for that factor, they probably would have put an upper deck on the east stands as with the west stands... as you can see though, there just wasn't enough room.

Prior to the west-side stands expansion back in '78, the west side's stands were "clipped" at both ends. It's possible that the west side had fewer seats as well.

[esquire]

^ Interesting... I did not know that. For whatever reason old photos of prairie CFL stadiums seem rarer than hen's teeth.

[HomerSPC]

Originally Posted by esquire

^ Interesting... I did not know that. For whatever reason old photos of prairie CFL stadiums seem rarer than hen's teeth.

They were easily as much of a shithole back in the day as they are in the present. Who would want to take a picture of that?

[esquire]

Originally Posted by HomerSPC

They were easily as much of a shithole back in the day as they are in the present. Who would want to take a picture of that?

Because some people are interested in building design? Why are you here if you're not?

Whenever I read these pissy kinds of answers it's a reminder that there are a lot of whiny adolescent-aged members here...

[Oilkountry]

I have an appreciation for the Older Stadiums in this country I do agree that the Mosiac,canads,ivor wyne type bare bones grand stands were a bit underwhelming but they served the league really well and canada knows how to stretch a dollar like no other. But I also love that we have kept some history. Ive warmed up to Molson so much over the last year (last year I hated it). It needs a slight upgrade to the bells and whistles but overall the History the als have with it as a CFL venue is just great. Ottawa has a great mix of The old "shithole" type stand and a new stand that i'm not sure is all that much better.
I also hope "shithole" mcmahon is kept will into the last half of this century. But to me mosiac isnt a shit hole. It's an old dog in a pack of puppy's.

I love the story of the als return to molson. The Big O was busy with whatever event. Anyway the Als had to play a game there. It sold out people loved it so they made it a permanent home again. There was a tree growing out of one of the stands and they fixed it up. So cool

[Westernrider]

Originally Posted by esquire

Because some people are interested in building design? Why are you here if you're not?

Whenever I read these pissy kinds of answers it's a reminder that there are a lot of whiny adolescent-aged members here...

This is a mosaic of Taylor Field over the years. In the 1962 you can see the baseball field behind and underneath the portable wooden bleachers. Interesting to note that the east stand didn't extend all the way to the goal line in 1971, And the deep endzones with coffin corners.