PHILADELPHIA | Highrise Development Thread IX - Page 522

Londonee · #**10421** Posted **Feb 12, 2016, 9:28 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by PhillySteaks

1.) Patience with PREIT.

PREIT has owned the Gallery since 2003 and began discussing possible renovations/overhaul around the time they bought Gallery 2 in 2004.

How much more patience do we owe them?

MikeNigh · #**10422** Posted **Feb 12, 2016, 9:29 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by summersm343

Neighborhoods group leader: Too much housing on waterfront site plan

Read more at http://www.philly.com/philly/business/re...front_site_plan.html#tsWIS0DKpJdz4C0V.99

Can someone please quantify "too quickly" and exactly what needs to adjust? He sounds like the kind of idiot who would hang around the entrance to a moving escalator figuring out when to jump and then land on face.

summersm343 · #**10423** Posted **Feb 12, 2016, 9:32 PM**

1835 Market retail fit-out

http://www.mscretail.com/property-listing/1835-market-street/

cafeguy · #**10424** Posted **Feb 12, 2016, 9:33 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by summersm343

Neighborhoods group leader: Too much housing on waterfront site plan

Read more at http://www.philly.com/philly/business/re...front_site_plan.html#tsWIS0DKpJdz4C0V.99

If by TOO much, you mean only half of these towers are going to get built like those next to sugarhouse... I ask, who cares? This is the type of development the water front needs and if even half of it gets built, it would put Blatstein's next door proposal to shame!

jsbrook · #**10425** Posted **Feb 13, 2016, 1:59 AM**

Great! Hopefully Retail A will be a good restaurant/bar. The more detailed brochure is emphasizing the courtyard and outdoor seating.

Quote:

Originally Posted by summersm343

1835 Market retail fit-out

http://www.mscretail.com/property-listing/1835-market-street/

Jayfar · #**10426** Posted **Feb 13, 2016, 2:27 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by summersm343

1835 Market retail fit-out

http://www.mscretail.com/property-listing/1835-market-street/

Funny they removed the SEPTA trolley entrance in the renderings, although it still shows in the diagram.

Busy Bee · #**10427** Posted **Feb 13, 2016, 5:09 AM**

That's Marketing. Rimshot.

Urbanthusiat · #**10428** Posted **Feb 13, 2016, 8:00 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by cafeguy

If by TOO much, you mean only half of these towers are going to get built like those next to sugarhouse... I ask, who cares? This is the type of development the water front needs and if even half of it gets built, it would put Blatstein's next door proposal to shame!

While I love this proposal, I have to agree that it's unlikely this ever gets fully built out with Columbus Blvd in its current form... it's even more unlikely if Blastein builds on the Foxwood site the way he is currently proposing. I think Inga had a good point in her recent article about Blastein's proposals when she said:

Quote:

Ironically, Blatstein told me a "self-contained community" is exactly what he's after. Despite the city's high-minded talk, he argued, nothing has been done to calm traffic or improve sidewalk conditions on this part of Columbus Boulevard. How can the city expect urban projects when it hasn't made the conditions more urban?

Frankly, anyone who wants to live an "urban lifestyle" isn't going to want to live along somewhere like Columbus Blvd... UNLESS there is some form of rail service. There won't be any urban projects along the Blvd until it isn't just a highway. IMO SEPTA should forgo (or put off) the BSL extension to the Navy Yard and the KOP extension of the NHSL and build light rail along Columbus... it would probably get more use than the BSL extension. Hell, you could take light rail to the Sports Complex and the Navy Yard even... Then you solve the same problem, and if I had to guess using very rough mental estimates, it would cost roughly the same while more greatly increasing real estate values and ridership. If I were Septa, I'd prioritize Columbus and Roosevelt Blvd light rail service before I would think about extending the BSL or NHSL. Then again I'm not SEPTA and I'm sure they've put a lot more thought and serious study into it than I have... My dream scenario of course would be to put light rail along Columbus Blvd up to Spring Garden, then have it run along Spring Garden to the Art Museum. How the logistics of that would work is beyond me, but just looking at a map of how the areas are served by public transportation, that seems to me to be an effective route. End rant.

cafeguy · #**10429** Posted **Feb 14, 2016, 5:01 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urbanthusiat

While I love this proposal, I have to agree that it's unlikely this ever gets fully built out with Columbus Blvd in its current form... it's even more unlikely if Blastein builds on the Foxwood site the way he is currently proposing. I think Inga had a good point in her recent article about Blastein's proposals when she said:

Frankly, anyone who wants to live an "urban lifestyle" isn't going to want to live along somewhere like Columbus Blvd... UNLESS there is some form of rail service. There won't be any urban projects along the Blvd until it isn't just a highway. IMO SEPTA should forgo (or put off) the BSL extension to the Navy Yard and the KOP extension of the NHSL and build light rail along Columbus... it would probably get more use than the BSL extension. Hell, you could take light rail to the Sports Complex and the Navy Yard even... Then you solve the same problem, and if I had to guess using very rough mental estimates, it would cost roughly the same while more greatly increasing real estate values and ridership. If I were Septa, I'd prioritize Columbus and Roosevelt Blvd light rail service before I would think about extending the BSL or NHSL. Then again I'm not SEPTA and I'm sure they've put a lot more thought and serious study into it than I have... My dream scenario of course would be to put light rail along Columbus Blvd up to Spring Garden, then have it run along Spring Garden to the Art Museum. How the logistics of that would work is beyond me, but just looking at a map of how the areas are served by public transportation, that seems to me to be an effective route. End rant.

I completely agree. Unfortunately, even the majority of Philly's young urbanites on Phl Urban facebook page believe the BSL extension or KOP line is much better than a light rail along the river. The major argument is that we should build where there is demand and the water front doesn't have demand. I believe the contrary...we should create infrastructure to drive demand if data points to demand being generated. Putting in rail for KOP and the navy yard to help commuters is very helpful, but the question is whether making business easier for commuters to the navy yard or KOP will put more tax dollars into the Philly budget. My impression is that a waterfront line would benefit Philly residents and drive more residents onto the water front. But it doesnt seem to be what most people are thinking.

Larry King · #**10430** Posted **Feb 14, 2016, 6:03 PM**

Roosevelt blvrd line is the best transit expansion idea,, how much will that cost?

Columbus will never be urban the way other parts of the city are. Let it develop in the 'Miami urban' style, cool high rises with parking. Many many truly organic urban living options in town, allowing Columbus to develop as drivable high rise living provides alternative option to people. Trying to turn Columbus blvrd into a walkable street grid is trying to fit a square peg into a round hole and the city doesn't have the $$ or will to do it anyway

cafeguy · #**10431** Posted **Feb 14, 2016, 6:17 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Larry King

Roosevelt blvrd line is the best transit expansion idea,, how much will that cost?

$800 million for this version... http://articles.philly.com/2008-01-10/news/25254574_1_trolley-route-pier-extensions

Larry King · #**10432** Posted **Feb 14, 2016, 6:35 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by cafeguy

$800 million for this version... http://articles.philly.com/2008-01-10/news/25254574_1_trolley-route-pier-extensions

Should be septa's focus! would be very successful, drop the KOP and navy yard lines and get this done

jsbrook · #**10433** Posted **Feb 14, 2016, 6:50 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Larry King

Roosevelt blvrd line is the best transit expansion idea,, how much will that cost?

Columbus will never be urban the way other parts of the city are. Let it develop in the 'Miami urban' style, cool high rises with parking. Many many truly organic urban living options in town, allowing Columbus to develop as drivable high rise living provides alternative option to people. Trying to turn Columbus blvrd into a walkable street grid is trying to fit a square peg into a round hole and the city doesn't have the $$ or will to do it anyway

What say you on Blatstein's Foxwoods proposal? Even if accepting your general premise as the right approach, it seems uniquely bad to me...

http://articles.philly.com/2016-02-05/business/70347552_1_bart-blatstein-gas-station-master-plan

http://www.philly.com/philly/columnists/...opments__Bad_Bart__Blatstein__rules.html

http://www.5thsq.org/delaware_sprawl

Larry King · #**10434** Posted **Feb 14, 2016, 7:06 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by jsbrook

What say you on Blatstein's Foxwoods proposal? Even if accepting your general premise as the right approach, it seems uniquely bad to me...

http://articles.philly.com/2016-02-05/business/70347552_1_bart-blatstein-gas-station-master-plan

http://www.philly.com/philly/columnists/...opments__Bad_Bart__Blatstein__rules.html

http://www.5thsq.org/delaware_sprawl

It's a first draft.. looks like something thrown together by the broker, general idea of big box stores mixed with low rise housing is ok for the site. I believe he needs zoning variances and the city needs his land for river trail so there'll be a good amount of negotiation.

a lower rent version of this suburban dc project would be cool, driveway to access stores with parking in the back:

cafeguy · #**10435** Posted **Feb 14, 2016, 8:46 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Larry King

It's a first draft.. looks like something thrown together by the broker, general idea of big box stores mixed with low rise housing is ok for the site. I believe he needs zoning variances and the city needs his land for river trail so there'll be a good amount of negotiation.

a lower rent version of this suburban dc project would be cool, driveway to access stores with parking in the back:

WOW! Now, THAT would be a great way for Blatstein to get what he wants but create something we want.That is magnificent.

jsbrook · #**10436** Posted **Feb 14, 2016, 9:22 PM**

Yes, Larry King! If that was to be the approach to development on Columbus, something like that would be the way to go.

PhilliesPhan · #**10437** Posted **Feb 14, 2016, 9:40 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Larry King

Roosevelt blvrd line is the best transit expansion idea,, how much will that cost?

Completely agree! A BSL spur from the flying junction at Erie to the city/county line at Southampton Road would be the most beneficial transit expansion project. A park-and-ride transportation center at the empty field off of Roosevelt Boulevard and Southampton Road could take a multitude of drivers off The Boulevard, I-95, PA 63, and the Schuylkill Expressway. As far as transit operations go, Roosevelt Boulevard trains could use the inner two tracks of the BSL trunk, stopping at Walnut-Locust, City Hall, Race-Vine, Spring Garden, Girard, (potentially) North Philadelphia, and Erie. Perfect way to utilize the under-utilized 4-tracked main.

PhilliesPhan · #**10438** Posted **Feb 14, 2016, 9:41 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Larry King

It's a first draft.. looks like something thrown together by the broker, general idea of big box stores mixed with low rise housing is ok for the site. I believe he needs zoning variances and the city needs his land for river trail so there'll be a good amount of negotiation.

a lower rent version of this suburban dc project would be cool, driveway to access stores with parking in the back:

If Blanstein proposed something like this on Columbus Boulevard, then I would actually support him building that site out!

summersm343 · #**10439** Posted **Feb 14, 2016, 9:50 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Larry King

It's a first draft.. looks like something thrown together by the broker, general idea of big box stores mixed with low rise housing is ok for the site. I believe he needs zoning variances and the city needs his land for river trail so there'll be a good amount of negotiation.

a lower rent version of this suburban dc project would be cool, driveway to access stores with parking in the back:

Totally support something like that! Great development. Somebody should show this to him as an example.

Baconboy007 · #**10440** Posted **Feb 15, 2016, 6:06 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Larry King

a lower rent version of this suburban dc project would be cool, driveway to access stores with parking in the back:

Most of my friends from high school have moved here after college and every time I visit them we end up around here. It's nice but totally lacks any personality.