Edmonton Public Transit

[oiler-dude]

Originally Posted by Daveography

But handfuls of single-occupant vehicles are being inconvenienced slightly by trains full of people! The injustice of it all!

Originally Posted by bulliver

What's wrong with the University Ave crossing? When I'm on the train I breeze right through there....

I do get your point of view on it, and support imperfect LRT before no LRT, but at the same time, transit should allow efficient movement for everyone when possible. As others have mentioned, University Ave sees buses, taxis, commercial vehicles as well. And at the end of the day a user who needs to travel down to Groat can't take the train because it doesn't go there. That argument works better when there's a full LRT network to work with.

Whyte is basically the only E/W corridor south of the river before Argyll or 51st, I think keeping it moving a little better would be beneficial to more than just single occupant vehicles. Like the #4 bus...

[s211]

Originally Posted by Landlocked

Yup, there aren't multi-person vehicles, bicycles, taxis, buses, ambulances, police, firetrucks, couriers, semis, cube vans or anything else that is interfered with. The problem with such bias comments is they render your argument useless. Stating that you think the delays are acceptable is fine, but suggesting that the only people who are impacted are those with commuting practices you oppose is way off.

Social engineers aren't exactly known for tact, their crusade being so just.

[SHOFEAR]

You guys are delusional if you think that it is perfectly acceptable to LRT traffic to cause major disruptions to vehicle traffic.

Look, only a fraction of people use the LRT. Most vehicle commuters are smart enough to realize that you need a variety of transportation options to get across the city and recognize the LRT is a part of that picture (something some militant urbanistas on here don't exactly grasp). But if that picture involves replicating scenarios like the university ave and Kingsway crossings your going to find more and more people against LRT expansion.

The city needs a variety of transportation methods to function....and there are a shit ton of people in this city who work in industrial areas in this city that need to get to work locations that will never be serviced by the LRT.

[Hallsy's Toupee]

See, I've been led to believe that the LRT is a social engineering tool to force people out of their cars and to spur development. Not a, y'know, quick and viable transportation choice.

[GreenSPACE]

You guys are all missing the point. There will always be cars in Edmonton, like any major city. I took a car around London when I was there recently. Lots of traffic. What the LRT provides is another options to get around as our city gets busier in a more sustainable way. It's about providing mobility to all citizens. Young people don't want to be forced to drive if they don't want to. And it's fixing the modality imbalance we have right now between cars and transit. You shouldn't be forced to buy a car to get around a city.

You work in Nisku? You're probably going to live in Leduc or Summerside. That is absolutely fine. I get that we have a large, vibrant industrial service sector economy. But don't for once tell me that you think the rest of Edmonton should just forgo mass transit and the solutions it brings to city building because you can't envision what Edmonton should be vs. where it is now, and you're worried about one or two intersections. That's small town thinking boys. If we don't build the LRT it will be a comparative disadvantage to our city economically in the future. Just the way the world is going.

[s211]

Originally Posted by GreenSPACE

You guys are all missing the point.

Actually, I don't think we're missing the point.

Isn't the point here that the city could have designed that intersection to be grade-separated, but chose not to?

[GreenSPACE]

^Ya probably. But it just doesn't matter anymore.

[oiler-dude]

Originally Posted by GreenSPACE

^Ya probably. But it just doesn't matter anymore.

But it doesn't mean it should just be ignored for an intersection like Whyte, either. Learn from mistakes.

[GreenSPACE]

I'm just concerned people are more worried about these two intersections than they are about getting LRT done. So what you have to wait 2 more minutes, now you have x-number new interchanges making your commute easier somewhere else. It just seems like people not looking at the bigger picture. It's very selfish imo.

[oiler-dude]

Originally Posted by GreenSPACE

I'm just concerned people are more worried about these two intersections than they are about getting LRT done. So what you have to wait 2 more minutes, now you have x-number new interchanges making your commute easier somewhere else. It just seems like people not looking at the bigger picture. It's very selfish imo.

I can't speak for others, but my view is still imperfect LRT before no LRT, handily. But I do hope key intersections can be revisited before construction kicks off.

[GreenSPACE]

^For sure. But this far down the road with engineering and design, there won't be any major changes.

Reality is people adjust their behaviour accordingly. 104 Avenue is closed a lot of the time around the arena and we maybe have a bit of gridlock for 1/2 morning and night. People shift their commute. I just can't imagine someone who works in Nisku in the future living Downtown and crying about Whyte Ave intersection. They just simply will adapt (cause living Downtown is awesome!) or not live Downtown.

[Coldrsx]

The reality is LRT should not impede efficient traffic flow, but at the same time, adding 8 or 9 figures for 1-2 grade separations is not worth it, people will adjust.

[Landlocked]

Originally Posted by GreenSPACE

I'm just concerned people are more worried about these two intersections than they are about getting LRT done. So what you have to wait 2 more minutes, now you have x-number new interchanges making your commute easier somewhere else. It just seems like people not looking at the bigger picture. It's very selfish imo.

My bigger picture includes the LRT being a valid option for people commuting to and from work. There are people here and elsewhere that see the LRT being the only valid option for people commuting to and from work. Which of us is being selfish?

[GreenSPACE]

^Perfect, then you can commute by LRT and take the bus to where you have to go. That's the reality in most other cities as well. Or arrange a carpool with people already living on the outskits.

[Landlocked]

Originally Posted by GreenSPACE

^Perfect, then you can commute by LRT and take the bus to where you have to go. That's the reality in most other cities as well. Or arrange a carpool with people already living on the outskits.

Prove it. Show me this plethora of big cities where commuting to work by car isn't a viable option AND where this is considered a good thing by anyone but a small but vocal, and very smug, hipster crowd.

[Mikemike]

Originally Posted by GreenSPACE

^For sure. But this far down the road with engineering and design, there won't be any major changes.

Reality is people adjust their behaviour accordingly. 104 Avenue is closed a lot of the time around the arena and we maybe have a bit of gridlock for 1/2 morning and night. People shift their commute. I just can't imagine someone who works in Nisku in the future living Downtown and crying about Whyte Ave intersection. They just simply will adapt (cause living Downtown is awesome!) or not live Downtown.

There's lots of time for changes if they get on it with negotiations and a change right now. It's entirely possible that the P# consortium could even find that there is a saving to add grade separations where the at-grade option means way more roadwork at grade, potential delays to their trains(increased operating costs), more salt exposure for their trains, more signals to maintain...

Now that the city has selected the P3 group they should have a good handle on the budget, and whether there is a few million there for a couple grade separations.

[GreenSPACE]

^They could. But the evaluation criteria for that is on the City's website (http://www.edmonton.ca/transportation/Evaluation_Criteria_23_July_2014.pdf) and I'm assuming they would have already gone through the process of deciding whether grade separation is needed or not. My guess is not.

^^Really not my job to inform you. We're not spending $1.8B on LRT just for the fun of it.

[MrOilers]

Whoever decided to put those at-grade LRT crossings next to the Royal Alex hospital is an idiot.

Last night around 8:00pm I was behind an ambulance heading westbound (lights flashing, sirens on), when we got stuck at the 111 Ave LRT crossing. The ambulance stopped right in front of the tracks for almost 3 minutes, while waiting for trains carrying a grand total of maybe 10 people inched by.

Once those crossing arms came back up the ambulance blared its siren and sped onward. Hopefully those extra 3 minutes weren't too critical to whoever needed the ambulance. I also hope that the ambulance didn't get trapped at the snail train crossing again on its return trip.

[Landlocked]

Originally Posted by GreenSPACE

^Really not my job to inform you. We're not spending $1.8B on LRT just for the fun of it.

So you're quite comfortable spouting BS as facts then failing to back it up, instead resorting to nonsensical statements as justification for your position. Fair enough. Unfortunately it's way too common in today's society.

[GreenSPACE]

^Not backing up my statements does not make them untrue. You can't say something is untrue because it isn't convenient to your position.

And something about 'hipsters' thrown in there makes me believe you're not serious about having a discussion.