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  #2521  
Old Posted Nov 17, 2015, 10:15 PM
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Originally Posted by FFX-ME View Post
Yes. We should allow development in those segments of the greenbelt which will be near the LRT lines and create a transit-oriented community.
This would be a great opportunity to actually plan out the area. First, all parks need to be identified. Cycling/walking paths need to be established.

The, plan out where the stations will be. The allow high density growth within 1km of each station.

The rest, leave as is.
     
     
  #2522  
Old Posted Nov 18, 2015, 1:59 AM
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The sections that run through the Greenbelt will actually be the cheapest to build. And if we can't get it right in the suburbs now, why would we expect anything more than the usual auto-centric trash if we allowed development in the Greenbelt next to an LRT line? With virtually everything else in the surrounding area requiring car access, it will not be that much different.
     
     
  #2523  
Old Posted Nov 18, 2015, 2:16 AM
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The sections that run through the Greenbelt will actually be the cheapest to build. And if we can't get it right in the suburbs now, why would we expect anything more than the usual auto-centric trash if we allowed development in the Greenbelt next to an LRT line? With virtually everything else in the surrounding area requiring car access, it will not be that much different.
Ottawa needs a new Greber Plan. One that is based off of the current realities and the future that the city needs. If 2 different ones were made, one of the actual current city of Ottawa, and one of the neighbouring towns. If followed, this would slow the sprawl, yet still allow smart growth.

They could learn from the mistakes made in the GTA.
     
     
  #2524  
Old Posted Nov 18, 2015, 3:27 PM
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Originally Posted by lrt's friend View Post
The sections that run through the Greenbelt will actually be the cheapest to build. And if we can't get it right in the suburbs now, why would we expect anything more than the usual auto-centric trash if we allowed development in the Greenbelt next to an LRT line? With virtually everything else in the surrounding area requiring car access, it will not be that much different.
Well the point of that direction would be that no one would live in "everything else in the surrounding area" so all new housing is built along the lines.
     
     
  #2525  
Old Posted Nov 18, 2015, 3:48 PM
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Not sure additional development on the greenbelt would curb sprawl. Sprawl is created by people trying to get more land/house at a lower cost or people trying to get into a neighbourhood with others at a similar stage in life (i.e. lots of kids around). Almost every transit station on the confederation is surrounded with develop-able land (brownfield, greenfield, parking lots, one story buildings) and development of this land is going very slowly because there isn't a lot of demand. You could build cheap low density housing on the greenbelt that would get gobbled up quickly, but what would be the point?
     
     
  #2526  
Old Posted Nov 18, 2015, 6:21 PM
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Not sure additional development on the greenbelt would curb sprawl. Sprawl is created by people trying to get more land/house at a lower cost or people trying to get into a neighbourhood with others at a similar stage in life (i.e. lots of kids around). Almost every transit station on the confederation is surrounded with develop-able land (brownfield, greenfield, parking lots, one story buildings) and development of this land is going very slowly because there isn't a lot of demand. You could build cheap low density housing on the greenbelt that would get gobbled up quickly, but what would be the point?
Well you would essentially need to shift the greenbelt out such that sprawl cannot occur elsewhere and then control the land to ensure that high density neighbourhoods are built. Not make the whole strip accessible at once. But yea, you need to kill all development on the edges of Orléans and Kanata so that everything happens there.

At the end of the day too, if it does sprawl there, better it sprawls in those thin corridors than in the blobs that are Kanata and Orléans.
     
     
  #2527  
Old Posted Nov 18, 2015, 7:11 PM
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Originally Posted by FFX-ME View Post
Well you would essentially need to shift the greenbelt out such that sprawl cannot occur elsewhere and then control the land to ensure that high density neighbourhoods are built. Not make the whole strip accessible at once. But yea, you need to kill all development on the edges of Orléans and Kanata so that everything happens there.

At the end of the day too, if it does sprawl there, better it sprawls in those thin corridors than in the blobs that are Kanata and Orléans.
I don't think you can possibly end sprawl. The housing market is telling us that most people prefer living in a low rise situation. Also, at the present time, we have a surplus of high density housing and land available within the Greenbelt to satisfy this need for many years to come. The end result would be that ribbons of development through the Greenbelt will either be low rise like the rest of the suburbs or will have very limited success. If you want to live in high rise situation, why would choose there over a more central location? This begs the question of why we would release conservation land under those circumstances. I don't see much value being derived.

The only way we can curb development on the edges of Kanata and Orleans is to provide an alternative. That was where the failed north-south line was supposed to fit in. That would have enabled us to experiment with transit oriented suburbs, something that may never be fully achievable at the edges of Kanata or Orleans.
     
     
  #2528  
Old Posted Nov 18, 2015, 9:56 PM
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^I think to some extent yes, it is people wanting the low-rise lifestyle and the large house with double garage etc...
But to some extent it's also costing... Living in a central neighborhood is expensive, so for someone entering the housing market, if you can't afford to pay $300K + for a condo downtown or 500-1M for an actual house, you are driven out of the core... Lots of affordable townhouse options but most are all in places like Hunt Club, Bells Corner, Orleans, etc...
     
     
  #2529  
Old Posted Nov 18, 2015, 11:21 PM
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I think the key is to bring LRT to each of the suburban town centres (Place d'Orleans, Kanata Centrum, Barrhaven Marketplace) and not necessarily beyond. Make each one of these the preeminent transit hub for each community and over time, land values will rise to a point that the sea of free parking lots won't make sense. One of the good things about those big box power centres is that they are so cheaply built and easily redeveloped, but in the meantime they're establishing traffic patterns within the community that make them logical placeholders for future densified cores, even though they may not be feasible at present.
     
     
  #2530  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2015, 12:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Kitchissippi View Post
I think the key is to bring LRT to each of the suburban town centres (Place d'Orleans, Kanata Centrum, Barrhaven Marketplace) and not necessarily beyond. Make each one of these the preeminent transit hub for each community and over time, land values will rise to a point that the sea of free parking lots won't make sense. One of the good things about those big box power centres is that they are so cheaply built and easily redeveloped, but in the meantime they're establishing traffic patterns within the community that make them logical placeholders for future densified cores, even though they may not be feasible at present.
This is how we do it in Metro Vancouver. Every SkyTrain line terminates at a mini downtown for every suburb, where that suburb then concentrates growth, and has most of its local bus lines feed into it. The Alberta model of extending rapid transit out to the edge of the city always seemed bizarre to me.
     
     
  #2531  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2015, 12:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Kitchissippi View Post
I think the key is to bring LRT to each of the suburban town centres (Place d'Orleans, Kanata Centrum, Barrhaven Marketplace) and not necessarily beyond. Make each one of these the preeminent transit hub for each community and over time, land values will rise to a point that the sea of free parking lots won't make sense. One of the good things about those big box power centres is that they are so cheaply built and easily redeveloped, but in the meantime they're establishing traffic patterns within the community that make them logical placeholders for future densified cores, even though they may not be feasible at present.
I was thinking of something similar and really that was the plan for the north-south line to service the town centres in Riverside South and Barrhaven, the latter of which would have been the terminus for two rapid transit lines. What a better way to concentrate commercial development instead of the auto-centric model that tends to create ribbons of low density commercial development along arterials. Unfortunately, by the time we get rail transit to Riverside South, Barrhaven, Kanata and Orleans, we will have a sprawling mess even in the town centres. Yes, the buildings are disposable, but it is pity that we have to use a bulldozer to get it right. It is too bad, we couldn't have got rail transit to these locations much sooner and built the area properly from day 1. I guess better late than never.
     
     
  #2532  
Old Posted Nov 20, 2015, 8:42 PM
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So, the latest update is up on the website. Nothing too exciting, but they are hinting that the roadheader at Lyon is almost done the station.

One thing I'm wondering, though, is that there are no more references to the Citadis assembly. Has it started, or has there been a delay?
     
     
  #2533  
Old Posted Nov 20, 2015, 11:35 PM
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Construction Update
Week of November 16




Multi-use pathways to undergo paving on Scott Street

Scott Street Widening


Lighting installation on the multi-use pathways continues, as well as road paving along Scott Street. Final work on the O-Train platform relocation is ongoing.



Lyon Station cavern excavation

Lyon Station


Bench excavation is ongoing as Jawbreaker continues to work through the Lyon Station cavern. Crews continue with removal of backfill in the north and south side ramps.



Formwork on the elevator structure at Lyon Station east entrance

Lyon Station East and West Entrance


East Entrance: formwork continues on the elevator walls and slabs, while abatement occurs on the ground floor.

West Entrance: installation of reinforcements in the parking lot is ongoing and hoarding installation is being finalized.



Work continues on Parliament Station walls

Parliament Station Cavern


Work is ongoing as Chewrocka completes central pillar excavation and crews install reinforcements.



Utility work continues at the Queen and O’Connor streets intersection

Parliament Station East and West Entrance


Demolition occurs and footing excavation is ongoing throughout the parking levels at the Sunlife Financial building west entrance.

Utilities relocation continues at Queen and O’Connor.



Excavation continues in Rideau Station cavern

Rideau Station


Crews begin concrete pours of the east running tunnel for the final concrete arch. Cavern mining at Rideau Station is ongoing.



Piling at Rideau Centre west entrance

Rideau Station East and West Entrance


East Entrance: rock excavation and hoe ramming continues, with blasting ongoing.

West Entrance: Rideau Street watermain relocation work to be completed over the weekend. Piling is being finalized at the west entrance.

Traffic restrictions on Rideau Street remain in effect.



Foundation work continues at Cyrville Station

Hurdman, Tremblay, St-Laurent, Cyrville and Blair Stations


At Hurdman Station, underground electrical work begins and removal of the existing structure is complete. At Tremblay Station, piling and reinforcements continue and construction hoarding is finalized. At St-Laurent Station, foundation and underground electrical work continues.

At Cyrville Station, crews pour walls and footings as part of station foundation work. At Blair Station, crews are continuing to form the footings and the walls for the new structure.



Concrete pouring occurs on the Hurdman Station elevated guideway

Guideway– Hurdman Station


Rebar and formwork installation begins on the elevated guideway parapets. Concrete pouring continues.



Formwork is ongoing at the east road next to VIA Rail

Guideway– Tremblay Station


Crews are finalizing formwork and rebar on the abutment walls to allow concrete pouring to begin.



Work continues on the guideway between St-Laurent and Tremblay stations moving west

Guideway– St-Laurent, Cyrville and Blair Stations


Crews continue ballast placement and distribution of concrete ties between Cyrville and St-Laurent stations. Duct bank and overhead catenary pole foundation installations continue from St-Laurent Station moving west. Trackwork between Cyrville and Blair stations is ongoin



Landscaping in front of the maintenance building at Belfast Yard

Belfast Yard Administration and Maintenance Building and Yard


Final landscaping, fencing, lighting and paving are ongoing as the maintenance building nears completion. Welding of tracks continues in the yard.



Crews continue working on the connector at Belfast Yard

Belfast Yard Vehicle Storage Shed and Connector Works


In the shed, crews continue paving pathways and preliminary work is being done to install louvres.

Crews finalize waterproofing on the connector roof while also completing work on walls. Formwork is being completed and the concrete slab is being poured.

Road construction occurs and includes slopes, grading and curbs.



Upcoming Construction Activities

In the coming weeks, the following construction activities are scheduled to occur:
  • Installation of girders on the remaining Hurdman Station elevated guideway columns.
  • Jawbreaker to move from Lyon cavern to Parliament cavern.

In the coming months:
  • Lyon Station west entrance blasting operations.
  • Lyon Station east entrance and west shaft construction.

http://www.ligneconfederationline.ca/construction/construction-update-49/
     
     
  #2534  
Old Posted Nov 21, 2015, 12:08 PM
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Tracks

I was walking across the pedestrian bridge at Blair the other day. From the end of the bridge you have a good vantage point for looking at the tracks that are being installed coming from Cyrville towards Blair.

The tracks appear to be straight in long sections with two kink-type bends connecting the straight sections.

Will this be a comfortable ride.
     
     
  #2535  
Old Posted Nov 21, 2015, 1:11 PM
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Originally Posted by rocketphish View Post



Upcoming Construction Activities

In the coming weeks, the following construction activities are scheduled to occur:
  • Installation of girders on the remaining Hurdman Station elevated guideway columns.
  • Jawbreaker to move from Lyon cavern to Parliament cavern.

In the coming months:
  • Lyon Station west entrance blasting operations.
  • Lyon Station east entrance and west shaft construction.

http://www.ligneconfederationline.ca/construction/construction-update-49/
Makes me wonder what's going to be left to do on Lyon Station when its official construction schedule starts in May next year!
     
     
  #2536  
Old Posted Nov 21, 2015, 1:25 PM
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Shop owners 'devastated' by drop in business because of Rideau Street construction

Vito Pilieci, Ottawa Citizen
Published on: November 21, 2015 | Last Updated: November 21, 2015 6:26 AM EST


Stung by a drop in business they blame on ongoing roadwork, a number of Rideau Street business owners say they are ready to walk away from downtown Ottawa.

“It’s devastating us, if you want to be honest,” said Corey Hackett, co-owner of Top of the World skateboard shop, which has been on Rideau Street for 23 years. “I was worried, but I thought, ‘Time will tell.’ Well, time has told.”

The construction of the Confederation Line LRT means Rideau Street will remain closed to most vehicle traffic between Mackenzie Avenue and Dalhousie Street until 2018. Business owners say they’ve seen a significant drop in pedestrian traffic as well.

Hackett said walk-in traffic to his shop has fallen by more than 50 per cent since construction began.

The drop in foot traffic is happening during the important Christmas shopping season, the three-month stretch when many retailers make the majority of their profit.



Traffic has become so light in the downtown core that finding parking and moving around the Rideau Street and ByWard Market area is easier to do than ever before, Hackett said. But that hasn’t changed the public’s perception that the area is a giant construction zone to be avoided. Rideau Street is only closed to car traffic for a short span. Pedestrians, and some buses, can still travel along the roadway.

“The street closure … all it’s done is discouraged people from coming down here,” he said. “I stood there for a half-hour yesterday to count how many actual construction vehicles were coming in to justify the fact that the entire street is closed off. There was one in that half-hour. It’s turned the whole place into a ghost town.”

Hackett isn’t alone in his complaints. Sam Dalbah, franchise owner of the Second Cup coffee house at the corner of Dalhousie and Rideau streets, said he is also concerned. The middle of November usually sees more shoppers in the downtown core, which means more coffee sales from consumers. This year, business is already down as much as 19 per cent, Dalbah said..

“It’s really bad. It seems to be non-stop for us in this area,” said Dalbah. “This is our busiest season. It should be really busy. After Christmas time (comes) the slowest season. That’s my concern. Am I going to be able to cover my rent, my employees, my overhead, all of that stuff? Business after Christmas goes down dramatically.”

Both Dalbah and Hackett said they are considering their options. With more than two years left before construction is completed, neither is sure whether he can wait it out. Hackett, in particular, is afraid of losing his two-decade-old business. Dalbah said his lease is up for renewal early next year and he might use the opportunity to move his business somewhere with less disruption.



Hackett said he is concerned that the city is doing little to help boost the profile of businesses affected by the Rideau Street construction. Without intervention, he said, the city might find itself opening its new transit station in 2018 to a street that has nothing to offer consumers outside of the Rideau Centre.

“Do they want to open this brand new transit station so people can come out and see a whole bunch of boarded up shops?”

Peggy DuCharme, executive director of the Downtown Rideau Business Improvement Area, said several members have expressed concern about the lowered foot traffic on Rideau Street. But it’s too early to blame it on construction, she said, as its been a warmer fall than usual and many merchants believe that the Christmas shopping season won’t really pick up until temperatures fall and the snow starts flying.

She said the BIA is preparing a survey for its members to get a better understanding of how they’ve been affected and what factors they believe are impacting any change in business they might be seeing.



Rideau-Vanier Councillor Mathieu Fleury said a plan is in place to help promote the area, however he would not comment on the plan specifically as it is “confidential” until announced by the BIAs in downtown Ottawa in December.

Fleury said he sympathizes with the businesses affected, but said the area is long overdue for renewal. The construction that is happening in the city’s core over the next three years will result in even more people wanting to head downtown to shop.

“We do need to renew the infrastructure,” said Fleury. “You look at zones where we have and those areas thrive afterwards. It is obviously really tough during the construction months. There’s a big picture here and there is no other part of town that is seeing this level of investment.”

http://ottawacitizen.com/business/local-...ss-because-of-rideau-street-construction
     
     
  #2537  
Old Posted Nov 21, 2015, 7:45 PM
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Originally Posted by JM1 View Post
I was walking across the pedestrian bridge at Blair the other day. From the end of the bridge you have a good vantage point for looking at the tracks that are being installed coming from Cyrville towards Blair.

The tracks appear to be straight in long sections with two kink-type bends connecting the straight sections.

Will this be a comfortable ride.
Until the ballast has been poured over the ties and rails and the ties have been tamped it is too early to tell how the rails will look visually. It's also possible that the rails haven't been welded together yet, possibly explaining the kinks. Little effort is put into making the rails straight when they are installed as the ties just sitting on top of the sub grade can move around still. Only as the ballast is brought up to grade does the alignment begin to get corrected.
     
     
  #2538  
Old Posted Nov 22, 2015, 12:38 AM
EdFromOttawa EdFromOttawa is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rocketphish View Post
Shop owners 'devastated' by drop in business because of Rideau Street construction

Vito Pilieci, Ottawa Citizen
Published on: November 21, 2015 | Last Updated: November 21, 2015 6:26 AM EST
Oh no! We might lose High Times, Money Mart, a chain coffee shop, and 18 tattoo parlours...

Plz City, intervene to save the trashy businesses occupying this prime real estate!
     
     
  #2539  
Old Posted Nov 23, 2015, 10:03 PM
Uhuniau Uhuniau is offline
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Originally Posted by EdFromOttawa View Post
Yahhhhhh damn our lack of North American foresight and love for the auto.

Can you imagine where we would be if we had focused Ottawa as a transit-first city back in the 50s???
Can you imagine where we'd be if we started planning around transit today?

But no - the developers keep proposing projects which are functionally no different from the mass-segregated, low-density sprawl of the 60s and 70s, and the city keeps approving it.
     
     
  #2540  
Old Posted Nov 23, 2015, 10:04 PM
Uhuniau Uhuniau is offline
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Originally Posted by FFX-ME View Post
Given what the city looks like now it would be very very very easy to use that Copenhagen model. All you need to do is allow development to occur in thin segments along where the LRT lines are planned within the greenbelt. For some stupid reason I don't know people oppose this development and instead support suburban sprawling. It's inevitable, it has to happen at some point.

We otherwise will have many km of track with no people in sight.
Because Ottawa has a pointless stupid "green" space fetish.

You can never convince Ottawa to defetishize pointless stupid "green" space, no matter what.
     
     
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