Winnipeg Construction VIII

[esquire]

Originally Posted by buzzg

A lot of them go to The Pint now. That place is the most bizarro-land place I've ever been. Why is a chain pub one of the toughest "clubs" to get into on a weekend. I don't understand... Someone there is a genius.

The Pint is what the MTS Centre Tavern United was 10 years ago... I remember thinking then that it was odd people would line up to get into what is basically a regular pub kind of place.

For what it's worth I still love the Tavern rooftop patio in the summertime, although I can't understand why they don't improve their menu offerings. If there was something to eat there besides deep friend something-or-other I might go there more than my usual couple of times a summer.

[rrskylar]

Originally Posted by Riverman

Chick 'N' Deli at Mount Pleasant and Eglington is a great example. Cover bands of all types, middle agers going to dance with strangers. Really fun place.

Had some good times at El Mocambo in TO years ago, is that place still around?

Spent time at the Pal a few times and was never impressed, lots of desperate people and the types that prey on them, since I go to bars to drink, really wasn't my kinda place...

[buzzg]

Originally Posted by esquire

The Pint is what the MTS Centre Tavern United was 10 years ago... I remember thinking then that it was odd people would line up to get into what is basically a regular pub kind of place.

For what it's worth I still love the Tavern rooftop patio in the summertime, although I can't understand why they don't improve their menu offerings. If there was something to eat there besides deep friend something-or-other I might go there more than my usual couple of times a summer.

Agreed, but the difference was Tavern was one of the only big bar's downtown at all aside from clubs, so it was kind of a default. There's so many (better) options now, also one of the reasons (patio aside) Tavern is WAY quieter than it was a few years ago, even on game nights.

But yes they have the best patio in the city and yes the food inedible. The burgers are about the only thing they actually make there. I used to work there, it was the worst job I ever had so I didn't stay long: management was awful and the food was disgusting. My manager asked me why I always brought my own food and I straight up told him I refused to eat the food there. However I go there during jets games for 3.50 buds.

[CoryB]

Originally Posted by Simplicity

I could see another location on Portage Avenue west of Route 90 as being perfect (for the Pal)

The challenge is Portage between Route 90 and Moray is heavily constrained in terms of possible development. For most of that stretch the Assinboine is hugging the south side so basically cross off anything there. On the north side you are both in the airport restricted zone and have residential skirting the light commercial fronting onto Portage. There is not a single place you could stick something like the Pal without having major objections from residents. To compound the issue, finding a site both big enough for the building and able to provide free on-site parking is going to require buying out existing buildings.

The area definitely could support a nightclub of some time based on the size of the population, the challenge is finding a suitable site. The "best" possible for that area might be to combine with an existing hotel property and move in their.

In terms of the Pal relocation, I could be off the mark but something south Pembina like the Reset site might be a winning idea. This could pull in St Vital, Linden Woods, Waverly West, etc as possible clients and would not compete with the Silver Spike.

[The Unknown Poster]

Originally Posted by Riverman

Surprise surprise. This guy has made way too much money to make a stupid decision like that.

Had limited success with the Pembina HWY bar. He's no genius. His resisting renovating the Pal when the other popular clubs did so was smart. Though I was under the impression renovating would require bringing the building up to code which would not be financially prudent. Place is a dump. But Im not really the target demo.

[The Unknown Poster]

Originally Posted by CoryB

The challenge is Portage between Route 90 and Moray is heavily constrained in terms of possible development. For most of that stretch the Assinboine is hugging the south side so basically cross off anything there. On the north side you are both in the airport restricted zone and have residential skirting the light commercial fronting onto Portage. There is not a single place you could stick something like the Pal without having major objections from residents. To compound the issue, finding a site both big enough for the building and able to provide free on-site parking is going to require buying out existing buildings.

The area definitely could support a nightclub of some time based on the size of the population, the challenge is finding a suitable site. The "best" possible for that area might be to combine with an existing hotel property and move in their.

In terms of the Pal relocation, I could be off the mark but something south Pembina like the Reset site might be a winning idea. This could pull in St Vital, Linden Woods, Waverly West, etc as possible clients and would not compete with the Silver Spike.

They had that exact location and didnt last that long. Im not sure what the rent is on that Reset building but nothing last there and generally, the concepts are bad. Rockbar was decent.

The mistake a lot of bars make is, they get one really hot night and decide to change their entire concept to that theme. Ie. Country Friday is hot so they go Country 5 nights a week, dilute their own following and fail. Boogie Nights did that years ago though they were insanely successful for a little while.

Also, the bar (Reset) always tries to be a downtown style bar in a University location. High cover. High prices. Techno music blaring.

When the Palladium became Stratosphere they spent a ton of money trying to cater to a downtown crowd. it worked for about 6 -8 months and then they died. They closed for a week, became The Lid, dropped cover and drink prices to $2.50 and were packed. Cater to your audience.

The Pal has a great brand so it would likely attract its audience wherever it is. I find the Spike totally different. Whether I enjoy my night at the Spike runs about 50/50 but Im generally not offended to be there. The service is way better and I dont have to fight off groping losers from my female friends like you do at the Pal.

[rypinion]

Originally Posted by CoryB

The challenge is Portage between Route 90 and Moray is heavily constrained in terms of possible development.

Pretty sure Portage/Rte 90 has a second cloverleaf that is still unoccupied.

[Riverman]

Originally Posted by rypinion

Pretty sure Portage/Rte 90 has a second cloverleaf that is still unoccupied.

Good one!

[CoryB]

Originally Posted by rypinion

Pretty sure Portage/Rte 90 has a second cloverleaf that is still unoccupied.

That reminds me of an even better location. There is a certain vacant building at the corner of St Matthews and St James with lots of free on site parking that no doubt would be the perfect target for the Pal relocation!

[Cyro]

Originally Posted by The Unknown Poster

T

The Pal has a great brand so it would likely attract its audience wherever it is.

Hey, Hey, Hey Good Bye....


winnipeglovehate.com

This establishment, ( I've seen many live bands here,[Played in] and had many a good/bad experience.) is past it's prime. The Live band venue/(Bar Only), concept is dieing. The combination of Bar/Eating Establishment is thriving. Let it die in peace. Put it where ever you like and restart it, it may last a year or 2 but all good things eventually and inevitably come to an end.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by Cyro

The Live band venue/(Bar Only), concept is dieing. The combination of Bar/Eating Establishment is thriving. Let it die in peace. Put it where ever you like and restart it, it may last a year or 2 but all good things eventually and inevitably come to an end.

There was a great article about Winnipeg's live music scene in the bars which apparently really thrived from about 1970 to the early 90s... I was unaware of how big it was until I read this piece:

http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/arts-an...inking-in-the-music-scene-327005501.html

I guess we're seeing the last gasp of this scene as the remaining live music joints fade away. Sure, there will always be places like The Good Will that actively bring in performers, but the days of live local acts with sizable followings routinely playing regular neighbourhood rooms are all but gone.

[drew]

^ The thing is, a place like the Pal, and the Good Will REQUIRE live music in order to sell booze. Bar "cover" bands would have gone the way of the Dodo long ago if this wasn't the case.

I remember when I was going to bars, clubs etc. the worst part of the night was when the band played. Nobody went to these places to hear a band. The band was just a necessary evil to sell booze when the club isn't attached to a hotel (i.e. all the places in the Exchange - back when there was actually a thriving club scene there).

What's crazy is that you cannot open a simple booze only, neighbourhood bar in Manitoba. It's gotta have some sort of combination of food, live music, and accommodation.

[The Unknown Poster]

Originally Posted by drew

^ The thing is, a place like the Pal, and the Good Will REQUIRE live music in order to sell booze. Bar "cover" bands would have gone the way of the Dodo long ago if this wasn't the case.

I remember when I was going to bars, clubs etc. the worst part of the night was when the band played. Nobody went to these places to hear a band. The band was just a necessary evil to sell booze when the club isn't attached to a hotel (i.e. all the places in the Exchange - back when there was actually a thriving club scene there).

What's crazy is that you cannot open a simple booze only, neighbourhood bar in Manitoba. It's gotta have some sort of combination of food, live music, and accommodation.

You dont need a band, just entertainment which runs the gamut from girls dancing on stage to certain DJ's to live wrestling.

I also agree that generally the dance floors is busier for the DJ than the band. Although Leanne Pearson always packs the dance floor at Cowboys (she's good).

I recall a bar I worked at had changed their license whereby they required entertainment. They had dancing girls on Friday and Saturday and wrestling on Thursday. The MLCC said no problem to the girls but couldnt understand how live professional wrestling qualified.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by drew

^ The thing is, a place like the Pal, and the Good Will REQUIRE live music in order to sell booze. Bar "cover" bands would have gone the way of the Dodo long ago if this wasn't the case.

I remember when I was going to bars, clubs etc. the worst part of the night was when the band played. Nobody went to these places to hear a band. The band was just a necessary evil to sell booze when the club isn't attached to a hotel (i.e. all the places in the Exchange - back when there was actually a thriving club scene there).

What's crazy is that you cannot open a simple booze only, neighbourhood bar in Manitoba. It's gotta have some sort of combination of food, live music, and accommodation.

I recall that the province loosened the rules a couple of years ago, but yeah, they didn't go so far as to allow someone to open up a neighbourhood pub. It's amazing, really... something so simple, a corner bar, which is taken for granted in much of the world, is still forbidden by law here. As if the Temperance Society still ran the show here.

[drew]

^ corner bars could really help liven up some of our "strips" in Winnipeg. There has to be some sort of economic argument for relaxing the liquor laws here. It would also really help for the reuse of commercial spots where the costs associated with going "full restaurant" are prohibitive. Especially in older buildings.

Let's get people drinking!

[esquire]

^ The funny thing is that having a bunch of quiet, relaxed neighbourhood rooms where regulars passively set the tone would probably lead to more responsible consumption vs. the handful of jam-packed, loud, indoor playground-like superclubs that young Winnipeggers typically experience.

[bomberjet]

It's stupid to have some run down, dive motel just to sell booze. Why can't Jimmy open up a small pub at the corner? Ridiculous. What is the logic behind it? Make everyone drive to the centralized dive bar for what reason? To prevent drinking and driving? Lol

[The Unknown Poster]

Some very archaic liquor laws. I remember getting in trouble for being 8 people over capacity because we didnt lock the pool tables. I remember Cowboys got in huge trouble because they served shooters made in a blender.

A lot of the inspectors are more interested in playing gotcha then in just seeing responsible drinking. Not all, but many. We had one inspector for awhile who essentially said "i dont really care whats happening as long as I believe you're in control of the situation".

One night we had two inspectors hiding out behind our building waiting for the barback to take the trash out so they could sneak in and "catch" the bar staff sitting quietly unwinding with a beer. How dare we.

[Cyro]

Originally Posted by esquire

There was a great article about Winnipeg's live music scene in the bars which apparently really thrived from about 1970 to the early 90s... I was unaware of how big it was until I read this piece:

http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/arts-an...inking-in-the-music-scene-327005501.html

I guess we're seeing the last gasp of this scene as the remaining live music joints fade away. Sure, there will always be places like The Good Will that actively bring in performers, but the days of live local acts with sizable followings routinely playing regular neighbourhood rooms are all but gone.

Thanks for the Article. Yes, Your absolutely right, I've seen it happen and experienced it. For those that haven't or are not willing to realize it let's throw out the Montcalm, Hagars Rock Club, the Black Night and the ZOO which is and institution and may soon follow with the Palamino to join all the others shortly to name a few of many. It was big, it was an in your face live band experience..It's gone now people. CHANGE... RIP

Drew..Tomatoes Tamotos, Potatoes Potatos,(didn't check spelling) Personal taste and preference, why some avoided live bands while in a bar as a filler and others flocked to them.

I do agree with both you and Esquire on the establishment of your local corner bar and relaxing of our governments liquor laws to allow people to DRINK,( Please drink responsibly and hand over your keys if driving)..

[drew]

Originally Posted by Cyro

Drew..Tomatoes Tamotos, Potatoes Potatos,(didn't check spelling) Personal taste and preference, why some avoided live bands while in a bar as a filler and others flocked to them.

No, I get that some people want to see live bands.

What I am talking about was the situation in the East Exchange about 15 to 20 years ago. There were several successful clubs (in and around where Wise Guys used to be). People went to these clubs to drink and dance.

In order for these places to offer the drinks, every hour or so, the DJ stopped playing the top 40 music (which people wanted to dance to) and instead a band got on stage to do their set of covers. No one went to these bars to hear a band. But the establishments needed the bands to serve booze.

Now, compare this situation to what was occurring at, for example Scandals, a club attached to a hotel. This place could play top 40 music all night, without a band in site. ONLY because it was attached to a hotel, it satisfied one of the requirements to serve booze.

Back in these days, DJs were not considered live bands. I think that has changed now, but either way, the Club scene in the East Exchange is basically dead.