CF Pacific Centre Developments

[Klazu]

Originally Posted by SpongeG

but if i go to a store and am completely ignored and do need some help and they do nothing, no acknowlegement or a hello i will just go to another store and do a pretty woman thing lol, see look what you missed out by ignoring me

It was interesting when we were furnishing our apartment and we went to McKellars in Coal Harbour. We were honestly interested to learn about their furnitures, but the lady wasn't interested in selling anything to us. We had to drag information out of her.

I guess she didn't think we would really be buying from there (us being in our early 30s), but it was largely due to that attitude that we ended up buying from elsewhere. They lost $30k with their attitude.

Originally Posted by daverraver

I always kept my distance and watched their behaviour. If they appeared like they needed assistance, that was my cue to approach them.

Yeah, that's how it should work but the salesperson needs to be diligent so that the customer doesn't feel pressured and watched. It's a delicate balance act.

It is interesting that see that so many of you Canadians are also uncomfortable with pushy service, as I though it's a North-American thing and you guys love small talk. I guess people are similar everywhere. Good point about the shoplifting, btw.

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

I wonder if the viaduct removal will re-invigorate International Village...

If we are to believe what we are being told about the removal of viaducts, it will bring peace to Middle East and stop hunger in Africa, so I think that is sure to happen.

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by red-paladin

I'm pro-Pacific Centre, but I can't understand the obsession with indoor malls for downtown.

"Our City is fine but, if only we had a massive mall we'd move up the global city charts!" - Said Edmonton in 1979.

Don't get me wrong, I support the growth of retail, mixed use and yes, a certain amount of enclosed mall space. I think that this project in particular was right on to integrate the basement to Pacific Centre (and Skytrain!). Lots can be done in this area for sure in the future.

However, as International Village, and some smaller projects downtown have shown, even the tepid failure of the original Royal Centre vision. There isn't an insatiable demand for indoor malls downtown.

It's true we have nothing like the Galleria in Milan (whew! talk about indoor malls!!!) ... but seriously, could it be linked to our climate, normally chilly and rainy more than half the year?
Or is it something else? I'd love a great outdoor market of some sort downtown, but in the long rainy, cold Vancouver winter, it might not work.

[csbvan]

The weather argument always seems so pointless to me. We Canadians seem to cower in the winter, and hibernate. I tend to find Amsterdam a good winter comparative to Vancouver. Slightly less wet in the winter (but still wet), and cooler darker and windier. Yet their outdoor market carries on in the winter months, their bike culture hardly takes a break. All the things we pretend can't happen due to our weather seem to carry on just fine in the Netherlands.

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by csbvan

The weather argument always seems so pointless to me. We Canadians seem to cower in the winter, and hibernate. I tend to find Amsterdam a good winter comparative to Vancouver. Slightly less wet in the winter (but still wet), and cooler darker and windier. Yet their outdoor market carries on in the winter months, their bike culture hardly takes a break. All the things we pretend can't happen due to our weather seem to carry on just fine in the Netherlands.

Good pointIt has made me rethink my whole stance on the weather bit. Just what kind of market do you have in mind?
Would it be posible to post some renderings of cities with such markets?

[dreambrother808]

Originally Posted by Klazu

It is interesting that see that so many of you Canadians are also uncomfortable with pushy service, as I though it's a North-American thing and you guys love small talk. I guess people are similar everywhere.

You are grouping Canadians into American tendencies when you speak of this "North American thing." Americans love small talk. Canadians are not quite as comfortable with this, but American retail infiltrates Canadian culture and therein lies the discrepancy.

[Sheba]

Originally Posted by LeftCoaster

The Bay Parkade will be torn down. Not any time soon is my guess, as Holborn has their hands full at little mountain, but a full redevelopment is in the cards for that site.

I don't know the state of it now, but the Bay used to have an underground bunker there with their computer center. It could be anywhere (including down there) now. Hopefully it won't be a major pain trying to dig that out of the ground.

[officedweller]

Something being built (using steel girders) on the roof of 725 Granville:

[officedweller]

Originally Posted by LeftCoaster

One thing to note, if you walk Pacific Centre below Nordstrom you will notice that the expansion space isn't 100% leased, and some of the tenancies are to not entirely optimal tenants (I'm looking at you rockport...). Demand for downtown mall space is not as high as you may believe, and if Canada's most productive mall can't lease out brand new space below Nordstrom, I doubt a mall on the fringe of downtown would be a highly successful venture.

Based on the leasing plan, the unleased unit looks to be the biggest one.

[jsbertram]

Originally Posted by Sheba

I don't know the state of it now, but the Bay used to have an underground bunker there with their computer center. It could be anywhere (including down there) now. Hopefully it won't be a major pain trying to dig that out of the ground.

The Bay Skytrain level walk-though recently had some historic photos on display, including one of the lady computer operator in the 1960's.

White gloves, beehive hair, high-heels, looking more stylish than techie.
I didn't notice if she was wearing a strand of pearls too.
too busy giggling after I saw it.

[Vin]

Originally Posted by red-paladin

I'm pro-Pacific Centre, but I can't understand the obsession with indoor malls for downtown.

"Our City is fine but, if only we had a massive mall we'd move up the global city charts!" - Said Edmonton in 1979.

Don't get me wrong, I support the growth of retail, mixed use and yes, a certain amount of enclosed mall space. I think that this project in particular was right on to integrate the basement to Pacific Centre (and Skytrain!). Lots can be done in this area for sure in the future.

However, as International Village, and some smaller projects downtown have shown, even the tepid failure of the original Royal Centre vision. There isn't an insatiable demand for indoor malls downtown.

Indoor malls brighten up and enliven the surrounding streets. With a concentration of retail tenants, management can also provide better services like security, garbage removal & cleanliness, etc. Just look at Nordstrom and PC mall, the surrounding sidewalks are usually kept pretty clean, and the homeless do not camp over there. In contrast just across Granville St., the walkways servicing the street retailers are often unkempt, dirty and stinky. During periods of heavy rain and wind-swept days, I always see loads of people congregating in PC mall. Indoor malls are epitomes of urban social hubs and they can be updated to today's standards, and even incorporate outdoor elements, to pacify those sun-worshippers. They can also host exhibitions, small museums and theme parks, etc, as in the case of Aberdeen Centre and West Edmonton Mall. In the downtown environment, good public indoor space is just as important as the outdoor ones, and other than malls, most indoor spaces are restricted to the selected few, which is kind of sad when one needs to hang out indoors after dark, or when the weather isn't optimal. Moreover, more retail shops can hopefully bring down the overall rental rates in the city, thus attracting more local retailers to set up shop downtown.

I like Nordstrom for bringing the variety of high fashion concept boutiques, as well as food and beverage into their large-format indoor mall/department store format. One thing lacking is the food hall that everyone loves. Now that we have a high-end department store (Nordstrom) as well as lower range (Winners), downtown definitely needs more mid-range retailers like Simons, Uniqlo, Toys r Us or even Ikea to not only take up shop here, but occupying a new attractive building, which is obviously lacking. The General Post Office or Bay parkade sites would be perfect for them, while a mixed-use development of the sites, be it residential, hotel, or office use, can add even more vibrancy.

[Klazu]

Originally Posted by dreambrother808

You are grouping Canadians into American tendencies when you speak of this "North American thing." Americans love small talk. Canadians are not quite as comfortable with this, but American retail infiltrates Canadian culture and therein lies the discrepancy.

In Europe many perceive United States and Canada being almost identical countries. Sure, everything is bigger and more extreme in the US, but normal life in both countries is often seen being more or less similar.

This is of course just a prejudice and after having lived here for close to four years, I already know that this is not the case. But there are small things like this that I had not known about Canadians before, so this was something interesting to learn.

[Sheba]

Originally Posted by jsbertram

The Bay Skytrain level walk-though recently had some historic photos on display, including one of the lady computer operator in the 1960's.

White gloves, beehive hair, high-heels, looking more stylish than techie.
I didn't notice if she was wearing a strand of pearls too.
too busy giggling after I saw it.

Are the photos still there? I can imagine an image like that but it'd be great to see it.

[SpongeG]

cadillac fairview has renamed all its malls across canada CF-whatever mall name

http://www.cp24.com/news/cadillac-fairvi...ther-canadian-shopping-centres-1.2573870

The official new name of the downtown mall will be “CF Toronto Eaton Centre."
The same naming convention will apply to all Cadillac Fairview malls including Sherway Gardens, which will become “CF Sherway Gardens.”

[nickbeaulieu]

That sounds ridiculous. I'm not sure I understand the need for their brand in the mall name. I've never thought to myself "Oh ya, that mall is soooo much better cus it's a CF mall" or "no, let's not go to that mall. It's not Cadillac Fairview, and I ONLY shop at Cadillac Fairview"

Originally Posted by SpongeG

cadillac fairview has renamed all its malls across canada CF-whatever mall name

http://www.cp24.com/news/cadillac-fairvi...ther-canadian-shopping-centres-1.2573870

[LeftCoaster]

Originally Posted by nickbeaulieu

That sounds ridiculous. I'm not sure I understand the need for their brand in the mall name. I've never thought to myself "Oh ya, that mall is soooo much better cus it's a CF mall" or "no, let's not go to that mall. It's not Cadillac Fairview, and I ONLY shop at Cadillac Fairview"

Well of course you haven't because CF nor any other Landlords have ever pushed for that kind of branding in Canada.

It is done elsewhere in the world to great success though, so why not try it here.

At worst people just won't take to the CF part and they original name will stick, at best CF can differentiate themselves from the other behind the scenes landlords and give themselves a competitive advantage.

[officedweller]

The most familiar branding locally is "Westfield" - i.e. Westfield Southcenter

But that makes a bit more sense since Westfield is at least a word/name, not initials or an acronym.

"CF" is a bit different / odd to add as a prefix to a mall name.

It's also a bit odd because I assume they are not also changing the names to their office properties that have retail - i.e. "CF Waterfront Centre", "CF HSBC Building" or "CF The Station".

Another US Property developer, Simon Property Group has taken a different approach and advertises "Simon Malls" and "Simon Premium Outlets". These include Seattle's Northgate Mall and Tacoma Mall and Seattle Premium Outlets.

"McArthur Glen Vancouver" is the latest parent company branded mall name. I guess that works if there's only one in each city.

[osirisboy]

I've never heard of Westfield

[SpongeG]

they are huge around the world, there are a few of them in the seattle area, based out of australia, they built the huge one near the olympic site in london

i think adding the name like westfield or even CF does kind of give customers an idea of what to expect at the mall as they know the stores will be up to a certain level to be in the mall

westfield is know for having a lot of popular stores and more high level stores

its kind of like if you are a tourist and you see kingsgate mall vancouver you may get there and be disappointed, where as CF pacific centre you wouldn't be

[officedweller]

Yeah, referring back to Simon Property Group
- if you see a "Premium Outlet Mall" you know exactly what mix of stores to expect.

[officedweller]

I just noticed that the City planted OAK trees on Robson along Nordstrom.

That reverses the trend along Robson further east, where the City has been removing the oak trees (even big ones) and replacing them with maples.

***********

Memo sent around the office toady:

ATTENTION: All Office Tenants – 725 Granville and 700 West Georgia

WHAT: Plaza Construction Activity

WHEN: Today - Thursday, October 8 through to Monday, October 19, 2015

WHERE: TD Plaza stair landing

WHY: Contractors will be erecting fencing around a small work area on the plaza to remove and replace the concrete floor at the stair landing. The work is meant to level the concrete and eliminate the issue of rain water pooling in this area.

IMPACT: From Thursday, October 8 through to Friday, October 16, noise generated by the concrete demolition may be heard between the hours of 7:00 a.m. and 9:30 a.m. daily.

Additionally, the south half of the plaza stairs will be inaccessible for the duration of the work schedule. Access and egress via the main lobby doors of the 725 Granville building will remain unaffected.