Calgary Stoney Trail [Ring Road]

[Wooster]

Originally Posted by MalcolmTucker

The more important part of the announcement is that it came from the "National Infrastructure Component". That means it did not take any more allocation out of the Alberta pot of the New Building Canada Fund Provincial-Territorial Infrastructure Component.

The differences between the pots here: http://www.infrastructure.gc.ca/plan/nbcf-nfcc-eng.html

Indeed

I also understand the project scope for SWRR has extended west to 101st rather than stopping at 69th as it was before. SW project scope has grown, west leg is now a smaller project once it gets going.

[sim]

Originally Posted by suburbia

Follow-up to my news yesterday:

http://news.gc.ca/web/article-en.do?mthd=index&crtr.page=1&nid=1011079

Nothing like basing a several billion dollar piece of infrastructure on falsehoods.

Today I will use my first hashtag ever: #stoptheBS

[suburbia]

Originally Posted by Wooster

I also understand the project scope for SWRR has extended west to 101st rather than stopping at 69th as it was before. SW project scope has grown, west leg is now a smaller project once it gets going.

I didn't realize this - great news! Let's hope the last pinch heading south from 16th ave doesn't get delayed too much past this portion.

[suburbia]

Originally Posted by 5seconds

Something that I noticed in the announcement that was oddly not reported by any of the media outlets was an estimated cost. Kenney stated that the $583m figure was roughly 25% of the $2.8b estimated price tag for this leg.

That's just the construction costs, and don't include the construction mafia vacation account fees.

[MalcolmTucker]

Originally Posted by 5seconds

Something that I noticed in the announcement that was oddly not reported by any of the media outlets was an estimated cost. Kenney stated that the $583m figure was roughly 25% of the $2.8b estimated price tag for this leg.

The province is sensitive about ever announcing the cost of something before the tender is done. Leads to some absurdities for sure.

[Cage]

Originally Posted by 5seconds

We haven't had an answer from the Province on the Green Line, have we? This might provide flexibility for the Province now.

EDIT: Or does this just mean that the Province can green-light the West leg?

Call me cynical, but I think the provincial NDP will use the freed up cash for something else, like healthcare or education. I also don't expect the provincial NDP to tell Albertans where the $583 million freed up cash was put to good use.

[Socguy]

Originally Posted by Cage

Call me cynical, but I think the provincial NDP will use the freed up cash for something else, like healthcare or education. I also don't expect the provincial NDP to tell Albertans where the $583 million freed up cash was put to good use.

I take it you don't approve of healthcare and education?

But seriously, the federal conservatives must be a little nervous about their base in Calgary if they're actually spending real $$$ in this city before an election.

Regarding the RR, just build the whole thing. If we need to expand the project to cope with the problems an uncompleted RR will create and it's going to be all built eventually just do it. Delaying the project will just cost more in the end anyway.

[Joborule]

Originally Posted by 5seconds

For sure.

Since the announcement is the result of the Province applying for the funding, they would have had to provide rough numbers, so it was interesting to hear the $2.8b figure.

I believe this is the first time that a rough estimate for just the SW leg has been publicly mentioned, and since the media (understandably) alway latches onto the $5b figure and is always asking about cost, I was surprised that not one media outlet reported on it.

EDIT: What is also interesting is that with the funding coming from the National Infrastructure Component (Thanks for pointing that out), and all of the talk about helping cargo get around the city and US tourists etc, those benefits would only happen if the west leg were also completed. I just found it interesting that they were talking about the national importance of the project, but when you look at them, those importances only come to fruition with the completion of both legs.

The west leg is important, but how important? Couldn't Sarcee Trail get the job done for bypass traffic, thus fulfilling the need (for the meantime) of the west leg? (Assuming all interchanges are built to their ultimate form along the corridor)

[ClaytonA]

Wasn't there a legion parking lot getting paved in the Maritimes that got funding from one of these slush funds?

I wouldn't read too much into it. Given this portion is going through a native reserve the Fed's are already involved. Did the federal government contribute anything to the freeway around Edmonton?

[mersar]

Originally Posted by ClaytonA

Wasn't there a legion parking lot getting paved in the Maritimes that got funding from one of these slush funds?

I wouldn't read too much into it. Given this portion is going through a native reserve the Fed's are already involved. Did the federal government contribute anything to the freeway around Edmonton?

According to the most recent news release I found from the province that has anything in it, the feds kicked in $37M for the Edmonton ring road.

[ClaytonA]

Thanks Mersar,

Yeah I'd thought there was some GoC contribution since there was the CANAMEX highway angle up there.

Google found an announcement from 2009 for one interchange for $168.6 million.
http://news.gc.ca/web/article-en.do?nid=436299

To clarify my comment - this GoC funding could always have been planned for and isn't extra and doesn't free up money for other provincial priorities. It's not "free" money like the Green Line funding.

It'll be interesting to see what David Dodge's recommendations are especially given the long, low commodity prices scenario discussed in the business pages. Things like the Cancer Centre, Crowchild Tr bridge, Deerfoot, and SWRR appear to be catch up infrastructure needed regardless of the next five year's economic growth.

[Socguy]

Originally Posted by ClaytonA

...
It'll be interesting to see what David Dodge's recommendations are especially given the long, low commodity prices scenario discussed in the business pages. Things like the Cancer Centre, Crowchild Tr bridge, Deerfoot, and SWRR appear to be catch up infrastructure needed regardless of the next five year's economic growth.

Very much so. It's my understanding that his mandate is to recommend infrastructure projects needed by the Provence which stimulate enough economic activity to justify the cost of borrowing to build them.

Considering how far this Provence has fallen behind in infrastructure and if David Dodge recommends enough major projects, I can see this government keeping this Provence out of recession through new construction until the price of oil comes back in 4 or 5 years.

I know lots of people in this Provence would lose their minds at this thought but I'm not one of them. All the factors are lining up to make now the time to build!

Originally Posted by Joborule

The west leg is important, but how important? Couldn't Sarcee Trail get the job done for bypass traffic, thus fulfilling the need (for the meantime) of the west leg? (Assuming all interchanges are built to their ultimate form along the corridor)

Sarcee can't handle its current traffic, to serve as the west leg of the ring it would need hundreds of millions of dollars in improvements.

[Joborule]

Originally Posted by Acey

Sarcee can't handle its current traffic, to serve as the west leg of the ring it would need hundreds of millions of dollars in improvements.

Yes, the question was aimed would it be better off (thus, save money) to invest into Sarcee upgrades, rather than spending on building the west leg?

Probably not since the west leg will eventually have to be built, and due to inflation would be more costly in the long run. The cost difference likely wouldn't be that large to justify it also.

[Socguy]

Originally Posted by Joborule

Yes, the question was aimed would it be better off (thus, save money) to invest into Sarcee upgrades, rather than spending on building the west leg?...

The other issue is who pays. The RR is a provincial project but Sarcee is a city road. I doubt the Provence wants to give the city hundreds of millions to upgrade Sarcee only to spend a ton more money finishing the RR in a few years.

If you mean that the Provence would never build the West leg and Sarcee would be the permanent west portion of the RR, I don't think that would work either as I would wager the cost to upgrade Sarcee to RR standards would be almost as high as building the West leg.

Although I get where you're coming from. I think that Sarcee is going to be a mess without the West leg.

[Porfiry]

Originally Posted by Socguy

I doubt the Provence...

Off topic, but why do you keep misspelling this? Alberta is a province, Provence is in France.

[Socguy]

Originally Posted by Porfiry

Off topic, but why do you keep misspelling this? Alberta is a province, Provence is in France.

Spellcheck

[DoubleK]

I am so happy that *most* of Stoney Trail has been and will be greenfield construction with a couple exceptions.

I had the misfortune of being on AHD in Edmonton earlier this week. What an absolute gongshow from Whitemud North.

[Wentworth]

Just to add another random comment to this thread today... seems a lot of my neighbors here in West Springs are still under the belief that the West leg (Hwy16-Hwy8) is going to be built sometime in the next 5 years. One even thinks they've already started construction because there has been unusual activity at the Burnco site lately.

[Mazrim]

Originally Posted by Wentworth

Just to add another random comment to this thread today... seems a lot of my neighbors here in West Springs are still under the belief that the West leg (Hwy16-Hwy8) is going to be built sometime in the next 5 years. One even thinks they've already started construction because there has been unusual activity at the Burnco site lately.

I think some of the Burnco activity is related to the ring road, but it's basically opportunity work that's ultimately not tied to the construction of the road itself.