YVR Airport & Sea Island Developments Discussion

[Johnny Aussie]

Originally Posted by Klazu

Anyone having flexible schedule this fall can enjoy some great bargains from YVR. Just check out some reference prices from Flight Center and then look for yourself: http://www.flightcentre.ca/worldwide-deals

I could find return fares from YVR to HKG for as low as $650 CAD (all taxes included) next month! I am really tempted to pick one of those, but my wife has such a busy work.

Wow.. just checked the link... great deals from gateways right across Canada to a lot of places... not just HKG but some amazing cheap deals!

I reckon downunder we win for really cheap domestic flights (like mega mega cheap - a couple of weeks ago the return MEL-ADL was only $74 all in for BOTH of us! $34 of that was the cc fee) but you guys win for excellent long-haul international. We get some great deals to south-east Asia and surrounding regions due to the presence of LCCs but really cheap deals like YVR-HKG for $650 or YYZ-HKG for $749 not happening here!

[Johnny Aussie]

Originally Posted by vanlaw

I booked that flight/price earlier this week for travel early next year. It is ridiculously low. However, downside is it is on AC's cattle car 777HD. I had second thoughts for a moment, but was booking 4 tickets, so the price differential won the day. Lots of cheap budget flights from HK to sun destinations.

From the airline's perspective and the consumer (to a degree) this is the upside to the HD 77W. They can dump a few more really cheap seats than on the regular 77W for seats that would most likely otherwise go empty. I realise that is the basic rule of any flight anyway, but the HD 77W and the new 788s (and now 789s) with their lower costs make these types of sales easier to push. I notice a few of the really cheap deals are via SEA on DL too... hmmmmm!

[Johnny Aussie]

Just wanted to say yesterday flying in had the best experience going through Canada Customs at YVR.

Despite a few heavies getting in the same time PR from MNL, NH from HND and LH from MUC... getting through was a breeze. Nice to see almost every counter was manned just a constant flow... Wait was less than 10 mins to get through.

The arrivals experience is just so pleasant having gone through LAX earlier that day.

Plenty of Canadians on the MEL-LAX UA flight heading to YVR, YCD, YYJ and YHZ. Those are just the ones I met

The UA 787-9 was just brilliant and a fantastic crew.

So nice to have another excellent star alliance option from MEL-YVR.

Just that bloody LAX transfer!!

[PaperTiger]

Originally Posted by Johnny Aussie

Just wanted to say yesterday flying in had the best experience going through Canada Customs at YVR.

Despite a few heavies getting in the same time PR from MNL, NH from HND and LH from MUC... getting through was a breeze. Nice to see almost every counter was manned just a constant flow... Wait was less than 10 mins to get through.

The arrivals experience is just so pleasant having gone through LAX earlier that day.

Plenty of people Canadians on the MEL-LAX UA flight heading to YVR, YCD, YYJ and YHZ. Those are just the ones I met

The UA 787-9 was just brilliant and a fantastic crew.

So nice to have another excellent star alliance option from MEL-YVR.

Just that bloody LAX transfer!!

"UA" and "excellent Star Alliance option" in the same paragraph! I can honestly I have never seen that before.


A more common expression is "I have flown United three times. My first. My last . My only."

[Johnny Aussie]

Originally Posted by PaperTiger

"UA" and "excellent Star Alliance option" in the same paragraph! I can honestly I have never seen that before.


A more common expression is "I have flown United three times. My first. My last . My only."

That is exactly what I used to think....

Since I had moved downunder I had only flown UA transpacific once return and thought never again.... Have mainly flown AC and NZ and about to give CA another chance as my Star options.... since they introduced NON-STOP MEL-LAX (tick) and on the new Dreamliner 787-9 (tick) I thought "lets give it a go shall we!"

Definitely better than AC on the SYD-YVR route which I have done about 12 times now but probably won't again.

I would still say NZ is better but overall not by much really... but like I said... I was pleasantly surprised and wouldn't hesitate to fly UA on that route again. Although the 787-9 is rumoured to be put on the AKL-YVR route maybe next year so that may sway me back over anyway.

But yup... sticking by my "excellent Star Alliance option." ANA about to relaunch SYD-HND again so yet another option coming up but prefer nonstop out of Australia so MEL-LAX non-stop is a huge tick in that column.

[Klazu]

I have only flown United between east coast and west coast, but I have nothing to complain. They have an armada of new A320s that are clean. Even the slim seats are not that uncomfortable and leg room is okay (I am tall).

[SFUVancouver]

I haven't flown on a 'real' United flight, only their United Express feeder service on RJs. The person in front of me reclined their seat all the way and there was, without exaggeration, less than 15cm between the tip of my nose and the seatback in front of me.

[Alpine]

To frequent flyers of SSP Vancouver.

I know that Vancouver is missing a lot of longhaul destinations. With that being said, from your observations of flights, check-in counters and the like, what flights or carriers do you think Vancouverites use when getting from YVR to: European capitals that aren't LHR/FRA/AMS, Eastern and Southern Europe, the Middle East/North Africa (there's a huge Jewish population in Vancouver, in case a direct YVR-TLV ever becomes feasible. Also Dubai, Doha, etc), South Asia, sub-saharan Africa (Plenty of South Africans in Vancouver as well; could a nonstop YVR-JNB flight ever be worth the trouble?), or southeast Asia, which is huge with backpackers?

Hopping across the border and taking a flight from Sea-Tac is a bit too easy. It should be separated into three categories: Those that depart/arrive Canada from YVR, those that use YYZ as a link, and those depart/arrive from SEA or another US airport.

My anecdotal experience is very slim. However, I was at YVR late one night to see off a relative who was going overseas. Wandering around the international terminal, I saw the CX889 check in for the red eye to HKG. To my surprise, many of the people in the check in line were Indo-Canadian! After asking around, I learned that since Vancouver doesn't have a direct flight to Delhi, Indians in Vancouver who want to get to DEL will use Cathay and transit via HKG, whose flights to Delhi all leave in the late afternoon while CX889 gets in early in the morning. Well, it's cheaper than a direct YVR-DEL flight would have been!

Another anecdote I have received is from someone who was a baggage handler at YVR, years ago. He told me that he recognized Delhi bags on sight and the most popular tags were CX839/838 and AC854/855. And AC854 arrives late morning at Heathrow, perfect timing for the afternoon AI116 flight to Delhi. Both Air India and Air Canada are Star Alliance.

As for me. I travelled to Addis Ababa, Ethiopia twice; in 2006 and 2007. Both times I flew via Heathrow on BA86/85, leaving at 6pm and arriving around noon. And both times the flight to Ethiopia was BA6565, which was operated by BMED back when it still existed, using an aging A321 that didn't even had seatback TVs (okay, summer of 2006, AVOD hadn't come yet). In 2006, the journey was LHR-HBE (Alexandria, Egypt), where the plane refuelled and continued to ADD. The two-leg journey was 7,500 km and took ten hours. In 2007, the stopover was in Beirut. I had hoped to see any damage to the airport from the Lebanon War the previous year, but it was predawn when we landed and I couldn't see anything.

My parents have been to Ethiopia many times. They could have saved money going down to Seattle, but they refuse to cross the border even if it saves them money. The reason why was because when I was 13, I stayed with family in Maryland on summer vacation. A relative, who was a travel agent in Seattle, had me fly SEA-BWI via America West (this was back in 2004), but messed up the tickets and forced me to stay in Seattle an extra night, flying ATA the next day SEA-MDW-DCA. Since then, my parents have always flown out of Vancouver. My first trip was $3100 roundtrip, the second was $2400, and ever since then my parents have been paying $1700-1800 roundtrip flying out of YVR. With the turbulent exchange rate I don't know if it's still cheaper to fly out of SEA.

Anyway. Between 2008 and 2015, my mom went to Addis Ababa twice. Once via Heathrow, and the second time with Lufthansa via Frankfurt (LH493/598, both A340-600s back then), and she loved it. My dad went three times. The first using the same LH routing via FRA. Then ET started their YYZ-ADD service with the 787, and my dad liked the 787, so the second and third time he flew AC156 to YYZ and ET503 to ADD.

What hubs or carriers do travellers in Vancouver use to connect with far-flung places?

[twoNeurons]

Originally Posted by Alpine

What hubs or carriers do travellers in Vancouver use to connect with far-flung places?

Well, there's a lot of Asian Vancouverites... so obviously, the big hubs used are:

ICN ( Seoul, Korea )
NRT/HND ( Tokyo, Japan )
HKG ( Hong Kong, China )
TPE ( Taipei, Taiwan )
PEK ( Beijing, China )
PVG ( Shanghai, China )

Those, I would say are the major Asian hubs. You can get almost anywhere in Asia from Tokyo/Seoul/Taipei. There are also a few secondary hubs like Kuala Lumpur and other Chinese cities. Singapore used to be a good hub to fly into, but they no longer fly to Vancouver.

[SFUVancouver]

The international hubs that I fly primarily through for work abroad are London Heathrow (LHR) and Hong Kong (HKG). Interestingly, when I was working on a project in South Africa, I would fly through either one of those hubs before connecting on to Johannesburg. Travel time would be nearly identical, with BA and CX arriving within 5 minutes(!) of one another at JNB, so price would be the deciding factor. Both had good long daytime layovers in London and Hong Kong, respectively, so there were opportunities for a quick jaunt into the city.

I've also flown through hubs in Dallas, LA, and Frankfurt, but those were one-offs.

Alpine, interesting that and your family have travelled with frequency to Addis. I have family who lived there for the better part of a decade but I missed the opportunity to visit and I'm kicking myself now.

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by Alpine

... And both times the flight to Ethiopia was BA6565, which was operated by BMED back when it still existed, using an aging A321 that didn't even had seatback TVs (okay, summer of 2006, AVOD hadn't come yet)..

Sounds like Air Canada Rouge, circa right now!

[Klazu]

Originally Posted by Alpine

I know that Vancouver is missing a lot of longhaul destinations.

I on the other hand think we are very well-connected to almost all world hubs and have an amazing number of destinations for an airport of our size. From larger hubs I think we are only missing a few, like Singapore (used to have), Dubai (not convenient from us), Madrid, maybe Copenhagen and Johannesburg (again, not convenient from us). You can get almost everywhere from Vancouver with just one stop.

I don't think for example Seattle fairs as well as we do destination wise.

[ACT7]

Interesting tweet put out by YVR today, showing the 20 longest long haul destinations in the world. YVR-SYD came in at 17th but the interesting part was the tweet said that this list will need to be updated after "emirates announcement". Is Emirates expected to start YVR? Has the bilateral been opened up? I would also suspect if it has been that EK will begin YYZ daily and possibly YUL 3 times a week.

Or was this some cheeky tweet based on aspirations?

[nname]

Originally Posted by ACT7

Interesting tweet put out by YVR today, showing the 20 longest long haul destinations in the world. YVR-SYD came in at 17th but the interesting part was the tweet said that this list will need to be updated after "emirates announcement".

Emirates to launch Dubai - Panama City service in Feb 2016, which will become world's longest route, beating current #1 (SYD-DFW) by 11 miles.

[ACT7]

Originally Posted by nname

Emirates to launch Dubai - Panama City service in Feb 2016, which will become world's longest route, beating current #1 (SYD-DAL) by 11 miles.

Ah. Wishful thinking then that Canada-UAE had signed something recently.

[osirisboy]

Originally Posted by nname

Emirates to launch Dubai - Panama City service in Feb 2016, which will become world's longest route, beating current #1 (SYD-DAL) by 11 miles.

I thought it was SYD-DFW

[nname]

Originally Posted by osirisboy

I thought it was SYD-DFW

Fixed

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by Klazu

I on the other hand think we are very well-connected to almost all world hubs and have an amazing number of destinations for an airport of our size. From larger hubs I think we are only missing a few, like Singapore (used to have), Dubai (not convenient from us), Madrid, maybe Copenhagen and Johannesburg (again, not convenient from us). You can get almost everywhere from Vancouver with just one stop.

I don't think for example Seattle fairs as well as we do destination wise.

I think that's right on, Klazu. The only "Big Time" destination Seattle has over us is DBX. And that's not necessarily a good thing. EK can charge lower prices if they want to fill up a plane, and, once given landing rights in an given city, can take people BACKWARDS into Europe, (always changing planes at DBX, not usually O/D.) or on into India, China, and Oceania from the DBX hub. This, in effect siphons off traffic that other airlines might offer, and cause them to leave Seattle. Air France started flying there, but pulled out, and Delta had to takeover the Paris route. SAS, longtime visitor at Seattle, (back to the 60s) pulled out. (Icelandic sort of moved in to fill the void one must admit.)

However, Vancouver has a bigger direct flight footprint in Asia than Seattle, a direct footprint in Oceania that SEA does not have at all, and an equal or better footprint to Europe and even Mexico.

So we seem to end up with more foreign tails taking us mostly where we want to go.
São Paulo? Lima? Santiago? Seems to be on the distant YVR horizon, (with the TWV plan) and I don't believe SEA is slated for anything like that. Yet.
The only 2 that are really missing are DEL (Delhi) (much discussed) and IST, a perfectly great destination for Middle Eastern, Caucasus and Central Asian, as well as Mediterranean destinations, but only After the Big 4 European Lines are solidly established, and this will not have the "Dubai Effect." I really think IST, could work out. It's closer to anywhere east of Oman, to which it's east OVER THE PACIFIC from YVR.... Jo'burg nonstop? I think that's many decades away, if ever.

[PaperTiger]

I travel to South America somewhat frequently. Typically I use IAH, or IAD as a transfer hub.

In my mind the lack of South American service is the biggest gap in YVR's network, but then I haven't any family in Africa or Middle East.

[SFUVancouver]

Originally Posted by trofirhen

[snip]

...from YVR.... Jo'burg nonstop? I think that's many decades away, if ever.

YVR-JNB is a 16,462km flight. That's really pushing the boundaries of this current generation of ultra long-range aircraft and I'm not sure if any could manage it in commercial service. A 777-200LR could potentially do it, and its planned successor the 777-8X should have the legs, and a high gross weight-configured A340-500 could squeak by, but I think that's it.

As convenient as that route would have been for me, I don't think that it would ever be warranted even if it were technically possible.