Metro Vancouver Transit Discussion

[madog222]

Originally Posted by Meraki

From the example, I liked the old line announcement.

"This is an Expo Line train to King George" is longer (and more likely to be interrupted by other pushed announcements) compared to the old "<beep boop> Expo Line to... King George." The old one is also more simple to understand if you're a tourist who doesn't have the best grasp of English. Just an announcement of the line and destination.

The problem is that the Expo Line now (in a year) has two destinations, like the Canada Line.

[Meraki]

Originally Posted by madog222

The problem is that the Expo Line now (in a year) has two destinations, like the Canada Line.

So? You use the same style, with now two destinations.

<beep boop> Expo Line to... King George.
<beep boop> Expo Line to... Production Way-University.

It's not even a new thing, we already have the peak AM trains that have

<beep boop> Expo Line to... Edmonds.

I'm one of the biggest supporters of TransLink, but I feel that this is a case of fixing what isn't broken.

[officedweller]

Originally Posted by nname

This is the phrase TransLink seems to be using now.

Evergreen Extension makes sense to me.

[Tfreder]

Originally Posted by Pinion

I just negotiated with my wife to take the bus once a week in order to get a better work schedule. She gets the car that day. I haven't touched public transit in about five years after going five years without a car and hating it. omgomgomg

I hope buses actually show up these days.

I'd recommending checking your bus on Translink's mobile site ahead of time before you walk to your stop. Typically, I check it every few minutes on my phone starting from 15 minutes before my bus is scheduled to arrive. It's helped me avoid standing at the bus stop for ages if its late and avoid missing early buses by leaving home earlier since I know the bus will be early.

[Waders]

I heard the new announcement Sunday on a Mark II train heading to VCC.
'This is a Millennium train to VCC Clark'. When it approached Broadway station, the announcement simply said 'Change for Millennium'. I found that a bit confusing.
I personally like the old voice. The new voice has a higher pitch and woke me up multiple times on the train.

[Express691]

I have made a preliminary video regarding the updated announcements.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ocam6P8oIag&feature=youtu.be

[MIPS]

Originally Posted by DKaz

Translink also determined this years ago, but the BC Government threatened to slash Translink funding if they did not implement a fare gate system.

It's strange. A similar thing happened with the Scarborough RT when it was built instead of the CLRV line. As a result it had major reliability problems from being....pushed on the TTC.

[deasine]

Originally Posted by Waders

I personally like the old voice. The new voice has a higher pitch and woke me up multiple times on the train.

That was my thought hearing the Youtube (always count on SSP for bringing the quickest updates!).

[Kisai]

Originally Posted by MIPS

It's strange. A similar thing happened with the Scarborough RT when it was built instead of the CLRV line. As a result it had major reliability problems from being....pushed on the TTC.

Yet the RT is the most reliable piece of transit infrastructure the TTC has ever had, even through they ran it in the least efficient manner and made it cost more to operate than it needed to.

The Vancouver Skytrain is the same technology implemented "as designed" and thus runs far more efficiently.

Faregates however...

You probably won't find many defenders of it, like yes, it does have the potential to save money in the long run, but since the Expo line was never designed for them, some of the stations need to be rebuilt (eg Metrotown, Main Street) and other stations like Burrard don't have the space to efficiently use them. So a huge expense is being incurred and covered up with "oh we need to renovate anyways"

Grandville has enough space, because there is an entire concourse between the escalators and the trains, where as Burrard has one tiny space that they cut across, so that is going to be a major issue during rush hours.

And Vancouver isn't the first city to get these Faregates and readers, nor is it the last. The only thing that seems unique about the Compass card system is that the contractor was unable to deliver a system as promised, be it slow/poor hardware radios, wireless service, or connectivity.

[WarrenC12]

It will be interesting to see what happens when the fare gates are closed. 2 stations that I frequent (Yaletown and Waterfront-Canada Line) do not have nearly enough gates for the routine rush-hour traffic. I think the problem is worse when they are 2-way, as people will be lining up and fighting over who gets to use which gate in which direction.

[CanSpice]

Originally Posted by Kisai

The only thing that seems unique about the Compass card system is that the contractor was unable to deliver a system as promised, be it slow/poor hardware radios, wireless service, or connectivity.

Calgary cancelled theirs. Compass is hardly unique in its issues.

[CanSpice]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

It will be interesting to see what happens when the fare gates are closed. 2 stations that I frequent (Yaletown and Waterfront-Canada Line) do not have nearly enough gates for the routine rush-hour traffic. I think the problem is worse when they are 2-way, as people will be lining up and fighting over who gets to use which gate in which direction.

They will remain open as long as people tap in and tap out before going through. If someone tries to get through without tapping in, the doors will close. [Source]

[Stanford85]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

It will be interesting to see what happens when the fare gates are closed. 2 stations that I frequent (Yaletown and Waterfront-Canada Line) do not have nearly enough gates for the routine rush-hour traffic. I think the problem is worse when they are 2-way, as people will be lining up and fighting over who gets to use which gate in which direction.

I'd also imagine that for a couple of hours before and after the peak rush that the gates would be switched into one way mode. but that would still mean that stations with only 3 gates like brentwood would only have one gate operating in a certain direction. somehow i don't believe translink when they say that their analysis shows that this is sufficient

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by CanSpice

They will remain open as long as people tap in and tap out before going through. If someone tries to get through without tapping in, the doors will close. [Source]

Yes I would assume they work the same way as other systems. This is more of a human nature issue, but also organization, unless as noted, some gates go "one way" in rush times.

[ssiguy]

I don't get why people have to tap out, what the hell is the purpose?

[jsbertram]

Originally Posted by CanSpice

Calgary cancelled theirs. Compass is hardly unique in its issues.

Calgary killed the project after several years of trying to get it to work as expected.

The contractor returned saying the problems were fixed, want to try again?

Calgary spent another year or so futzing with the "new and improved" system, and killed it again.

[jsbertram]

Originally Posted by ssiguy

I don't get why people have to tap out, what the hell is the purpose?

database of point-to-point per-person traffic.
Also neatly date & time -stamped and correlated to You and your card.

Makes it easier to decide on distance- and time-of-day- fares rather than just zones.

Longer distance = higher fare deducted on tap-out

Outside rush-hours = lower fare

[officedweller]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

It will be interesting to see what happens when the fare gates are closed. 2 stations that I frequent (Yaletown and Waterfront-Canada Line) do not have nearly enough gates for the routine rush-hour traffic. I think the problem is worse when they are 2-way, as people will be lining up and fighting over who gets to use which gate in which direction.

People will just have to get used to "restricted" access.

The status quo right now is at the extreme end of accessibility - as open as you could possibly imagine.

Just imagine you're walking into a Canadian Tire store... or worse - exiting one without buying anything.

[queetz@home]

Originally Posted by jsbertram

database of point-to-point per-person traffic.
Also neatly date & time -stamped and correlated to You and your card.

Makes it easier to decide on distance- and time-of-day- fares rather than just zones.

Longer distance = higher fare deducted on tap-out

Outside rush-hours = lower fare

Correct me if I'm wrong but hasn't it been decided that for buses, they opted to make all of them one zone? If so, then shouldn't a single tap be enough for the database?

For Skytrain or any rail system, its easier to tap out simply because you can always have the faregate at the station to capture those that are coming out. This is common practice even for those using low tech paper fare cards. So the tapping out is really an issue for the buses. Since buses are one zone only, there really is no need to tap out.

[Kisai]

Originally Posted by queetz@home

Correct me if I'm wrong but hasn't it been decided that for buses, they opted to make all of them one zone? If so, then shouldn't a single tap be enough for the database?

For Skytrain or any rail system, its easier to tap out simply because you can always have the faregate at the station to capture those that are coming out. This is common practice even for those using low tech paper fare cards. So the tapping out is really an issue for the buses. Since buses are one zone only, there really is no need to tap out.

If you think about it. It's relying on two "tap ins" instead of "tap-in/tap-out + tap-in/tap-out" which is similar to what the previous paper tickets did. The difference now is how they are tracking it, which I speculate they weren't tracking very much. Everyone who travels somewhere on a bus, undoubtedly needs to take that same bus back if it's a short trip or for work. The wildcard in using that data are sources like BC Ferries, VIA/Amtrack, and YVR where people may only tap once and then disappear for days/weeks before tapping back. This is where the "Compass card" connects those two data points.

If you only ever buy cash tickets and wish to remain anonymous, then that tracking is just as useless.