PITTSBURGH | Development Rundown II

[Austinlee]

Old article from April but... Shit....

Kraftown or our town? Sprawling campus, new efficiencies may be too much for Heinz to pass up
Apr 10, 2015, 6:00am EDT Updated Apr 10, 2015, 9:13am EDT



http://www.bizjournals.com/pittsburgh/pr...wn-or-our-town-sprawling-campus-new.html

[greg42]

Originally Posted by Private Dick

Never went there... but I think something like Lucky Strike all the way up in Kittanning was doomed to failure. I never realized they put one there... very weird. Strange that the company ever considered locating there (a place that checks zero of the demographic boxes they look for I imagine) in the first place.

Is this forum code for too far away? Next up, Monroeville Mall is in Latrobe and South Hills Village in Waynesburg. LOL Roughly equivalent to putting Pittsburgh Mills in Kittanning.

It actually probably ticked a fair few demo boxes by their usual formula but they overlooked the typical Pittsburgh geography/topography vs travel issues. But it's not at all unrealistically far from the affluent north and west burbs or city by typical standards. It's just not so easy to reach from some of those areas that would otherwise seem close enough by those looking only at numbers.

Anyway, personally I'm not feeling the bowling alley downtown thing, but I could be wrong.

[Private Dick]

Originally Posted by greg42

Is this forum code for too far away? Next up, Monroeville Mall is in Latrobe and South Hills Village in Waynesburg. LOL Roughly equivalent to putting Pittsburgh Mills in Kittanning.

It actually probably ticked a fair few demo boxes by their usual formula but they overlooked the typical Pittsburgh geography/topography vs travel issues. But it's not at all unrealistically far from the affluent north and west burbs or city by typical standards. It's just not so easy to reach from some of those areas that would otherwise seem close enough by those looking only at numbers.

Anyway, personally I'm not feeling the bowling alley downtown thing, but I could be wrong.

Yes, I don't know about forum code, just Private Dick code for too far away. And right, I know it's not really all that far away (particularly from wealthier areas like Fox Chapel), but it seems very isolated to me (even by Pittsburgh standards). The isolation aspect is the main thing. I imagine that these types of bowling lanes have mainly located in downtown/urban areas to attract the demographic they aim to attract (young, urban professionals). I know they have suburban mall locations too, but I believe those are in far more developed suburban areas than Pittsburgh Mills is -- like the "town centre" type suburban malls located near affluent suburbs.

All I really know is that I would have zero interest in going to some fancy bowling alley at a suburban mall, but I would go to one if it was located downtown. I'm not suggesting that this should be the linchpin in redeveloping Kaufmann's downtown or anything, just that I've been to a few of these (South Beach, Cleveland, and Manhattan) and they were fun, lively places... and would offer something in downtown Pittsburgh that doesn't exist currently.

[Evergrey]

Originally Posted by Private Dick

Yes, I don't know about forum code, just Private Dick code for too far away. And right, I know it's not really all that far away (particularly from wealthier areas like Fox Chapel), but it seems very isolated to me (even by Pittsburgh standards). The isolation aspect is the main thing. I imagine that these types of bowling lanes have mainly located in downtown/urban areas to attract the demographic they aim to attract (young, urban professionals). I know they have suburban mall locations too, but I believe those are in far more developed suburban areas than Pittsburgh Mills is -- like the "town centre" type suburban malls located near affluent suburbs.

All I really know is that I would have zero interest in going to some fancy bowling alley at a suburban mall, but I would go to one if it was located downtown. I'm not suggesting that this should be the linchpin in redeveloping Kaufmann's downtown or anything, just that I've been to a few of these (South Beach, Cleveland, and Manhattan) and they were fun, lively places... and would offer something in downtown Pittsburgh that doesn't exist currently.

I suppose a Downtown Lucky Strike would be a nice complement to the new Howl at the Moon.

[Topher51]

When I read about Macy's closing the first thing I thought of was that they ought to build something like DC's Gallery Place in that space. First floor restaurants (Clyde's, Bar Louie and an Asian place) with Lucky Strike and movie theaters on the second floor.

[Private Dick]

Originally Posted by Evergrey

I suppose a Downtown Lucky Strike would be a nice complement to the new Howl at the Moon.

I had no idea that Pittsburgh had one of these awful places... though any place that features the sweet sounds of the Keytar is alright in my book.

[Minivan Werner]

Does downtown have any movie theater? That would not be a bad idea.

[SWPA]

There is a small movie theater on Liberty Avenue called the Harris that shows art and independent films. The last commercial movie house closed in the late 1980s, but a developer is studying the feasibility of putting a movie theater on Sixth Street in an existing building that, ironically, was at one time the Gateway Theater.

[themaguffin]

Kraftown or our town? Sprawling campus, new efficiencies may be too much for Heinz to pass up

Kraft is abandoning its suburban campus for downtown Chicago next year. I'm not sure what this means for the future of the company or Pittsburgh though.
It does clarify that Pgh isn't competing against a modern suburban complex, but against downtown Chicago....

[Evergrey]

Originally Posted by themaguffin

Kraft is abandoning its suburban campus for downtown Chicago next year. I'm not sure what this means for the future of the company or Pittsburgh though.
It does clarify that Pgh isn't competing against a modern suburban complex, but against downtown Chicago....

The more recent development is that the merged company's executive leadership is about 95% Heinz and 5% Kraft (general counsel).

[BrianTH]

Originally Posted by themaguffin

I'm not sure what this means for the future of the company or Pittsburgh though.

Downtown Chicago sucks, so it means Pittsburgh wins!

Actually no, I quite like Downtown Chicago. But I am pretty sure it is way more expensive, and if they are thinking at all about future expansion (which is a big if), that would seem to be a significant factor.

Of course various efficiencies and opportunities still lead plenty of companies to locate their main offices in very expensive places. I'm just not sure what those would be in this case.

[Don't Be That Guy]

Originally Posted by BrianTH

Downtown Chicago sucks, so it means Pittsburgh wins!

Actually no, I quite like Downtown Chicago. But I am pretty sure it is way more expensive, and if they are thinking at all about future expansion (which is a big if), that would seem to be a significant factor.

Of course various efficiencies and opportunities still lead plenty of companies to locate their main offices in very expensive places. I'm just not sure what those would be in this case.

'Efficiencies and opportunities' often translate to, "where the CEO and senior executives prefer to live." That, and the local corporate environment, will have as much impact on the decision as the air connections. And both of those weigh more than real estate costs, which really only a concern for back-office and non-HQ locations.

[Private Dick]

Originally Posted by Don't Be That Guy

'Efficiencies and opportunities' often translate to, "where the CEO and senior executives prefer to live." That, and the local corporate environment, will have as much impact on the decision as the air connections. And both of those weigh more than real estate costs, which really only a concern for back-office and non-HQ locations.

The senior execs and ownership prefer to live in Brazil, NYC, and Switzerland (and I guess Omaha for Warren Buffett). The Heinz guys are not currently and are not going to be actual Pittsburgh or Chicago residents.

[GeneW]

Pretty cool time-lapse footage of the Bakery Square Bridge over Penn Avenue.

[BrianTH]

Originally Posted by Don't Be That Guy

'Efficiencies and opportunities' often translate to, "where the CEO and senior executives prefer to live."

Sometimes, but increasingly many C-level executives for global companies don't live full time anywhere particularly near the corporate HQ. They are doing a lot of their personal work remotely, and to the extent they do need to be somewhere in person, they often have access to private jets and such.

That is not to say this is never an important consideration, but it certainly doesn't have to be. It really depends on the work habits and preferences of the C-level executives, combined with the nature of the company.

(Edit: or what Private Dick already said)

[photoLith]

A new brewery just opened up in millvale about two blocks away from where I live and it's pretty sick. Slowly but surely millvale is sort of turning around, now new people just need to move here and the junkies and public pajama wearers need to move out.







Draai Laag Brewery.

[BrianTH]

Personally, I've never had any doubts about Millvale being pulled gradually into the Hipster Belt also forming across the river.

The Gardens (or whatever it is called now) is a pretty imposing building from street level. It seems massive if you are walking along Forbes next to it. From the east, it fits into the Fourth Avenue buildings in a way that makes them all more prominent (it is amazing what adding a second layer can do to the perception of mass). Interestingly it is probably least imposing from Market Square due to the step down, but along with PNC Tower it has still served to wall off and enclose the Square.

[Private Dick]

Originally Posted by BrianTH

And the other dude has a 924, which the first dude constantly makes fun of. They then put on pastel t-shirts and white suits, and cruise over to Monsters of Rock to offer rides to metal chicks in acid-wash jeans.

Yeah, he probably also rags on the other dude for still wearing Nikes to the court, because he of course sports the K-Swiss.

[Austinlee]

Originally Posted by photoLith

A new brewery just opened up in millvale about two blocks away from where I live and it's pretty sick. Slowly but surely millvale is sort of turning around, now new people just need to move here and the junkies and public pajama wearers need to move out.

I went to this brewery a few weeks ago. It was awesome! Millvale is FINALLY starting to have a decidedly Lawrenceville vibe. Perhaps not surprisingly, it's right across the 40th street bridge. It has multiple nice murals; The amazing Grist House Brewery; Record store; Awesome music venue and recording studio. I am not exaggerating when I say it IS becoming a hip neighborhood. Also it has that dense, townhouse/rowhouse housing verncaular.

Cheers!

[Austinlee]

Originally Posted by BrianTH

Downtown Chicago sucks, so it means Pittsburgh wins!

Actually no, I quite like Downtown Chicago. But I am pretty sure it is way more expensive, and if they are thinking at all about future expansion (which is a big if), that would seem to be a significant factor.

Of course various efficiencies and opportunities still lead plenty of companies to locate their main offices in very expensive places. I'm just not sure what those would be in this case.

I love Pgh, but the biggest of big wigs almost ALWAYS choose the largest cities: NYC, Chicago, etc. I am pessimistic. Best case scenario, there will be some type of dual HQ but I am even doubtful of that.