Highways in Canada

[eemy]

The wikipedia page is close to my conception of Central Ontario, basically dividing Eastern Ontario from the GTA and Southwestern Ontario. The Ministry of Finance actually classifies something approximating the Greater Golden Horseshoe as Central Ontario. I actually find the districts they use make quite a bit of sense. Aside from the ones labeled Central Ontario, all the counties or districts undoubtably fall within their respective divisions of Ontario. This leaves the ones labelled Central Ontario. Wellington doesn't have a lot in common with Muskoka, but they are both very much connected to the GTA. The only area that I have a hard time seeing fitting with this is the Niagara area, even though it is commonly included in the Greater Golden Horseshoe.

[1overcosc]

Originally Posted by rousseau

Interesting. I've never heard of "central Ontario" before, and don't know where it would refer to. But Toronto is definitely the GTA, or Toronto, or the Big Smoke, etc. Nobody ever refers to the GTA as "central Ontario."

Basically in Ontario you've got Toronto/the GTA, the Niagara Peninsula, southwestern Ontario, eastern Ontario and northern Ontario. Those are the larger demarcations that your average person in Ontario will know. Maybe the area of central Ontario (where is it?) might refer to itself as such, but people in the rest of the province won't really know what it means.

Probably how a person in Toronto area would see it.

Here in Eastern Ontario, people generally assume everything from Toronto southwestward is one big blob of "south/central". A lot of people up here think of anything in the SW, even as far as Windsor, as just being bits of Toronto.

[middeljohn]

Originally Posted by 1overcosc

Probably how a person in Toronto area would see it.

Here in Eastern Ontario, people generally assume everything from Toronto southwestward is one big blob of "south/central". A lot of people up here think of anything in the SW, even as far as Windsor, as just being bits of Toronto.

That's a pretty common view in Alberta as well. Pretty much everything in Southern Ontario is just "Toronto". When I go home to visit I don't even bother saying Oakville anymore because people will just respond "oh you're going back home to Toronto?"

I think most Canadians don't realize that even without the GTA Ontario would still tied with Quebec as the most populous province.

[Trans Canada]

Here's a question, is Ottawa in Southern Ontario? Having lived in Ottawa I consider Southern Ontario to be a separate, distinct region. But I suppose if it's a binary Northern/Southern divide, Ottawa is certainly part of the South.

[haljackey]

Originally Posted by Trans Canada

Here's a question, is Ottawa in Southern Ontario? Having lived in Ottawa I consider Southern Ontario to be a separate, distinct region. But I suppose if it's a binary Northern/Southern divide, Ottawa is certainly part of the South.

Politically, Ottawa is east Ontario according to the MTO: http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/engineering/management/corridor/Provincial-Map.pdf

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Loco101

wasteland??? We have some of the largest gold mines in the world! LOL

I know, I know. But it's still a mindset that exists.

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by sonysnob

I work for the government, and there is specific guidance that when writing correspondence the 'n' in northern Ontario should not be capitalized in most situations.

Why does that anger people?

I would imagine "Northern Ontario" implies a form of political relevance, almost a separate political entity such as North Dakota or North Carolina.

The spelling "northern Ontario" on the other hand implies just a geographic region, similar to northern NS or northern NB.

I imagine the provincial government in Ontario doesn't want to encourage the northern separatists in any manner, shape or form, even down to the level of a single capitalized letter........

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

I would imagine "Northern Ontario" implies a form of political relevance, almost a separate political entity such as North Dakota or North Carolina.

The spelling "northern Ontario" on the other hand implies just a geographic region, similar to northern NS or northern NB.

I imagine the provincial government in Ontario doesn't want to encourage the northern separatists in any manner, shape or form, even down to the level of a single capitalized letter........

Hey, they even have their own team in the Brier! Spelled with a capital N to boot!

[1overcosc]

Originally Posted by Trans Canada

Here's a question, is Ottawa in Southern Ontario? Having lived in Ottawa I consider Southern Ontario to be a separate, distinct region. But I suppose if it's a binary Northern/Southern divide, Ottawa is certainly part of the South.

Many people in Eastern Ontario which includes Ottawa don't think of themselves as being in Southern Ontario. We typically divide the province into:
1) Northern Ontario - same as what everyone else thinks
2) Southern Ontario - GTA and the SW
3) Eastern Ontario - us! Generally everything east of the GTA

But within the context of the binary north/south divide Ottawa & Eastern Ontario as a whole are definitely within the South, and everywhere else in the province it's understood that East is subregion of South. Including in most government publications.

Although, terrain wise the East could sort of be paired with the North. Aside from the area extending from Ottawa to the QC border, much of the East is made up of hilly forested virgin wilderness, whereas in the rest of Southern Ontario a much greater proportion of rural land is flat and under cultivation.

[1overcosc]

Originally Posted by haljackey

Politically, Ottawa is east Ontario according to the MTO: http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/engineering/management/corridor/Provincial-Map.pdf

Each government ministry makes up their own regions based on what makes sense for their programs.

For example...

This is the Ministry of Natural Resources' regions:


.. and this is the the Ministry of Community and Social Services regions:

[eternallyme]

I try to avoid using "Central Ontario" as well. Southwestern, Eastern and Northern to me start where the influence of Toronto fades...hence Parry Sound and Muskoka I would place in the Northern region, for example. Eastern Ontario to me starts around Trenton and Southwestern Ontario starts around Woodstock.

[The_Architect]

Not that it's based on much, but for me personally Ontario is:

Northern Ontario - Sudbury/North Bay and up.
Eastern Ontario - Pembroke down to Belleville and everything east, but also reaching over to Cobourg.
"Cottage Country" - Barrie up to Algonquin Park, includes Muskoka, Kawartha Lakes, Haliburton, etc.
Golden Horseshoe - self-explanatory
Southern Ontario - Everything south and west of the Golden Horseshoe (KWCG is included here)

[manny_santos]

"Central Ontario" to me is the region surrounding the Golden Horseshoe that is north and east of the GTA, including Barrie-Orillia, Collingwood, Muskoka, Haliburton, Peterborough, and the Kawartha Lakes area.

"Eastern Ontario" to me is anything east of Cobourg.

[SignalHillHiker]

Originally Posted by middeljohn

I think most Canadians don't realize that even without the GTA Ontario would still tied with Quebec as the most populous province.

I didn't.

I think it's a symptom of just enlarging the GTA to encompass most of southern Ontario in one's mind. Hamilton and Ottawa seem to stand out but everything in between kind of gets lumped into GTA from this far away.

I have a vague notion where Sarnia is and kind of think of GTA as everything between there and Ottawa. I know it's not and if I think about it, I've got it down to Oakville to Oshawa now. But, still... old habits die hard. Asked with a — to my head, I'd stammer out Sarnia to Ottawa.

And on top of that, unless we've been there, our view of Ontario generally is shaped by the TO-based media, which treats the other cities as towns and villages. There are people here, I'm sure, who think of Kitchener and Sudbury as Mount Pearl and Paradise. Subconsciously, they must know the scale is far larger than our own - but I don't think it really clicks. I wouldn't be surprised to hear someone here moving to Sudbury for work and wondering if they have a Quizno's or public transit or whatever.

[Loco101]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

I would imagine "Northern Ontario" implies a form of political relevance, almost a separate political entity such as North Dakota or North Carolina.

The spelling "northern Ontario" on the other hand implies just a geographic region, similar to northern NS or northern NB.

I imagine the provincial government in Ontario doesn't want to encourage the northern separatists in any manner, shape or form, even down to the level of a single capitalized letter........

I was just about to respond to that question and saw your post.

YES, definitely a form of political relevance at play. Many and maybe most here identify with our homeland being Northern Ontario and not just "Ontario." We often don't want to associate ourselves with Southern Ontario for many reasons. I know when I travel across Canada I will always say I live in Northern Ontario. That usually gets me more respect. Otherwise if I said I'm Ontarian, they might judge me as the urban, know-it-all, arrogant Torontonian or Southern Ontario stereotype.

Northern Ontario is quite culturally different from the South. Many political issues are quite different as well. Look at how we vote compared to down South. And the thing we hate the most is when Southern politicians impose things on us that make no sense and are extremely out of touch. Often they will hurt us in severe ways and will be done to score political points in Southern communities. I say we are badly oppressed by the South. We only have about 6% of the province's population but the vast majority of the land. We need control of land use and resource development and to be able to define who we are.

Those are some of the reasons why we use a capital N in Northern Ontario. It is our home and our identity. And yes, quite a few people do want to create our own province. The Government of Ontario of course will do everything to stop it.

I would guess that most here want more power for Northerners but don't want immediate separation.

[Loco101]

Originally Posted by eternallyme

I try to avoid using "Central Ontario" as well. Southwestern, Eastern and Northern to me start where the influence of Toronto fades...hence Parry Sound and Muskoka I would place in the Northern region, for example. Eastern Ontario to me starts around Trenton and Southwestern Ontario starts around Woodstock.

Just out of curiosity, where do you live?

Parry Sound and Muskoka are only considered to be in the North by Southerners.

[sonysnob]

Originally Posted by Loco101

Just out of curiosity, where do you live?

Parry Sound and Muskoka are only considered to be in the North by Southerners.

While I agree with that, I would say that as soon as you get north of the Severn River on both Hwy 400 and 11, the topography takes on a distinctly northern feel, even if the region is still considered part of southern Ontario.

[eemy]

Culturally, Parry Sound/Muskoka is definitely linked to the south. Physiographically, they are northern. Politically, it's split; Parry Sound is a district with no municipal services outside of municipalities (basically no upper-tier municipal structure), like the rest of Northern Ontario, Muskoka, on the other hand, does have county-wide municipal services like the rest of Southern Ontario.

[Loco101]

Originally Posted by sonysnob

While I agree with that, I would say that as soon as you get north of the Severn River on both Hwy 400 and 11, the topography takes on a distinctly northern feel, even if the region is still considered part of southern Ontario.

The difference when you cross that river when heading North is that you are entering the Canadian (Precambrian) shield which has some of the oldest rock in the world.

But having travelled much of Northern Ontario, most of Northern Ontario does NOT resemble Parry Sound or Muskoka Districts!!

[manny_santos]

Originally Posted by SignalHillHiker

And on top of that, unless we've been there, our view of Ontario generally is shaped by the TO-based media, which treats the other cities as towns and villages. There are people here, I'm sure, who think of Kitchener and Sudbury as Mount Pearl and Paradise. Subconsciously, they must know the scale is far larger than our own - but I don't think it really clicks. I wouldn't be surprised to hear someone here moving to Sudbury for work and wondering if they have a Quizno's or public transit or whatever.

Even within Ontario, outside the GTA there's some strange conceptions people have of the world outside of their own immediate backyard. Just a couple days ago I was talking to a guy from Brockville and he was shocked that London is bigger than Kingston. He thought London had a population of 40,000, tops.

Likewise in Southwestern Ontario, some people I've talked to are surprised at Kingston's population. Some people think it's a lot smaller than it is, and some people think it's a lot bigger than it is. but few seem to know the actual ballpark it fits into.