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  #2921  
Old Posted May 15, 2015, 7:55 PM
st7860 st7860 is offline
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Several years ago when there was talk(it was not actually done) of dissolving the strata at 2528 east broadway(gardenia villa). instead, the strata petitioned BC assessment to cut their assessments in half while repairs were made to the building so changing assessments does affect the tax people pay and it is certainly not the same check every year(for Vancouver)
     
     
  #2922  
Old Posted May 15, 2015, 8:05 PM
lio45 lio45 is offline
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You don't live in BC or Vancouver right? Then explain why(in Vancouver) for people that plan to stay in their homes a long time it is said that those people do not want their property to increase in value because that will increase their annual tax bill?
That's very simple.

First off, though, you can remove that "(in Vancouver)" parenthesis. People EVERYWHERE generally don't want their property to increase in municipal evaluation if they can help it (while they of course would LOVE their property to increase in market value, which isn't the same thing).

In 2006, and in 2009, and especially in 2012 when everything nearly doubled, every time the new assessments came in in Sherbrooke I have been negociating with the City to get them to lower the evaluations of a few of my buildings, arguing that honestly, I couldn't see them realistically selling for THAT high a price.

In most cases, they eventually agreed with me. In one case, they actually dug up fresh sales for the area and they convinced me with solid evidence that it was indeed worth that much nowadays. My reaction was something like "oh, well, then I can't argue. I'll pay a bit more in taxes, but on the other hand, I'm now richer -- on paper -- than I thought."

So, obviously, on an individual property basis, given a tax rate already fixed by the city, the lowest the valuation is, the less you'll pay in taxes.

If I have a $2 million Vancouver SFH, and I manage to convince the City of Vancouver that it has some catastrophic flaw that only makes it worth $200,000, on it, my taxes will be really low.

On the other hand, if all identical houses are now considered to be worth $200,000 city wide, then my taxes will be back up to what they were.

Essentially, what matters is which percentage of the City's total valuation your house represents. If everything doubles, but your house only increases by 50%, your taxes will now be lower (assuming of course the City budget doesn't explode, but in any case, your taxes will increase less than your neighbors whose houses doubled).

If everything goes down, but your house goes down less than average, your taxes will be higher.

All of that of course applies to the part that's based on valuation. In many cities, there are items that are on a per-resident basis (correlated with unit size), like trash removal for example. Those don't fluctuate along with assessed value.
     
     
  #2923  
Old Posted May 15, 2015, 8:16 PM
st7860 st7860 is offline
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here's something that talks about people constantly having to appeal their assessments every year
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/brit...al-of-property-assessment/article563076/
     
     
  #2924  
Old Posted May 15, 2015, 8:27 PM
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niwell niwell is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by st7860 View Post
Several years ago when there was talk(it was not actually done) of dissolving the strata at 2528 east broadway(gardenia villa). instead, the strata petitioned BC assessment to cut their assessments in half while repairs were made to the building so changing assessments does affect the tax people pay and it is certainly not the same check every year(for Vancouver)
That happens all the time. Not sure the process in BC, but in Ontario you can appeal to the Municipal Property Assessment Corporation to re-evaluate your assessment. People's assessments go down all the time, at least temporarily.

This does affect the bottom line of the municipality but generally not too much as it is for a given year and the properties being granted a decrease are in the small minority. There was a case where several major office towers in Toronto appealed their assessment which would have resulted in the loss of tens of $millions for the City. It ended up in court and MPAC and the City won I believe. Something on this magnitude is rare though.

And of course assessment does affect your tax bill. Nobody is saying it doesn't. But it affects it within the bounds of the municipality in which you pay tax. Comparing a house in Vancouver to one in the United States, or even Surrey isn't an apples to apples comparison.

Quote:
Originally Posted by st7860 View Post
here's something that talks about people constantly having to appeal their assessments every year
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/brit...al-of-property-assessment/article563076/
Well, yeah. You want as low an assessment as possible compared to your neighbours and the city average. Again, this has no bearing on properties outside your municipality.

And straight from the article:

Quote:
An increase in assessment doesn't automatically mean an equivalent percentage increase in taxes.

But when an assessment on a house goes up more than the city average, the owner will end up with a bigger tax increase than what city councillors say they have set. And an assessment that goes up more than the regional average will mean the owner ends up paying more school taxes and regional taxes. Residents of Metro Vancouver will also have more TransLink taxes shifting to the high-assessed dunes.
     
     
  #2925  
Old Posted May 17, 2015, 5:35 AM
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More good news from BC............

There has been a surge in discontent recently in Vancouver due to the housing demolitions and soaring house prices and a call to stop foreign ownership. There is a petition on change.org with about 20,000 signatures.

The other day Christy said foreign ownership rules would cause prices to drop and now our Minister of Housing has weighed in. Minister Coleman stated that he not only doesn't think foreign ownership is an issue and said that he has nor any part of the provincial government have any intention of even studying the effects of foreign ownership little alone do anything about.

He even had the audacity to say that he thinks Vancouver real estate is "quite reasonable" if you compare it to London or Tokyo. You couldn't make this stuff up.
     
     
  #2926  
Old Posted May 17, 2015, 5:39 AM
matthew6 matthew6 is offline
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So how much more affordable would Vancouver real estate be without foreign ownership?
     
     
  #2927  
Old Posted May 17, 2015, 1:59 PM
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He even had the audacity to say that he thinks Vancouver real estate is "quite reasonable" if you compare it to London or Tokyo. You couldn't make this stuff up.
Comparing Vancouver to London or Tokyo is ludicrously hilarious.
     
     
  #2928  
Old Posted May 17, 2015, 2:16 PM
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Comparing Vancouver to London or Tokyo is ludicrously hilarious.
Yes it is. A better comparison would be San Francisco, Hong Kong or the old city boundaries of Toronto.

I thought Vancouver was still quite a bit more affordable that London and Tokyo.

Positive things Vancouver and the provincial government could do include getting of the height restrictions on building in Vancouver, make incentives for laneway houses more attractive, maybe don't include the extra value in calculating property tax for the first 10 years. or something.

Improve public transit between downtown Vancouver and Bowen Island and the Sunshine Coast while allowing more subdivisions and single family home construction in those areas. Bowen Island could house almost as many people as Burnaby today.
     
     
  #2929  
Old Posted May 17, 2015, 2:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Berklon View Post
Comparing Vancouver to London or Tokyo is ludicrously hilarious.
You are ludicrously hilarious
     
     
  #2930  
Old Posted May 17, 2015, 2:39 PM
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Originally Posted by ssiguy View Post
More good news from BC............

There has been a surge in discontent recently in Vancouver due to the housing demolitions and soaring house prices and a call to stop foreign ownership. There is a petition on change.org with about 20,000 signatures.

The other day Christy said foreign ownership rules would cause prices to drop and now our Minister of Housing has weighed in. Minister Coleman stated that he not only doesn't think foreign ownership is an issue and said that he has nor any part of the provincial government have any intention of even studying the effects of foreign ownership little alone do anything about.

He even had the audacity to say that he thinks Vancouver real estate is "quite reasonable" if you compare it to London or Tokyo. You couldn't make this stuff up.
Its well known that Vancouver is priced appropriately compared to Shanghai, London, or Tokyo.

http://www.expatistan.com/cost-of-living/comparison/vancouver/tokyo

http://yourvancouverrealestate.ca/real-estate-news/2014/10/debunking-foreign-investors/
"One of the issues I see coming up often is in regards to foreign investors. In the minds of many Vancouverites, and probably in the minds of many people watching the market, all empty houses in the city are owned by buyers from Asia, who are merely letting the lots waste away, as an investment property. That's certainly the opinion of this blog, Beautiful Empty Homes of Vancouver. And while this is probably true in some cases, I think the vast majority of these homes have other stories behind them (it takes a long time to get the permits to renovate and/or redevelop a lot), and the idea that so much of Vancouver is owned by foreign investors is vastly over blown."
     
     
  #2931  
Old Posted May 17, 2015, 2:55 PM
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Originally Posted by st7860 View Post
You are ludicrously hilarious
Looks like I got the real estate agent all upset.
     
     
  #2932  
Old Posted May 17, 2015, 3:01 PM
st7860 st7860 is offline
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Takes 1 to know 1
     
     
  #2933  
Old Posted May 17, 2015, 6:01 PM
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  #2934  
Old Posted May 17, 2015, 6:12 PM
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Originally Posted by casper View Post
Yes it is. A better comparison would be San Francisco, Hong Kong or the old city boundaries of Toronto.

I thought Vancouver was still quite a bit more affordable that London and Tokyo.

Positive things Vancouver and the provincial government could do include getting of the height restrictions on building in Vancouver, make incentives for laneway houses more attractive, maybe don't include the extra value in calculating property tax for the first 10 years. or something.

Improve public transit between downtown Vancouver and Bowen Island and the Sunshine Coast while allowing more subdivisions and single family home construction in those areas. Bowen Island could house almost as many people as Burnaby today.
Part of the problem too is that salaries/wages in Vancouver are quite low. People don't get paid much here for similar work compared to cities like San Francisco, Hong Kong, Toronto, or even Calgary, Edmonton and Ottawa.
     
     
  #2935  
Old Posted May 17, 2015, 6:18 PM
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niwell niwell is offline
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Originally Posted by Berklon View Post
Looks like I got the real estate agent all upset.
The real estate agent who doesn't understand how property taxes work!
     
     
  #2936  
Old Posted May 17, 2015, 6:30 PM
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Originally Posted by matthew6 View Post
So how much more affordable would Vancouver real estate be without foreign ownership?
Since there is no good data on foreign ownership, and since the word "affordability" is a vague term that relies on assumptions of people's willingness to pay for certain products over others, I'm going to say that your question cannot be answered.
     
     
  #2937  
Old Posted May 17, 2015, 7:03 PM
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I also don't follow about the complaining about foreigners
Really? Because you seem to pop up to defend against it with your stilted syntax every time someone dares to comment about it. That is when you are not enlightening with us with bon mots like "it takes 1 to know 1" or demonstrating your naivete about property taxes.

We've all got your number, might as well take your ball and go home.
     
     
  #2938  
Old Posted May 17, 2015, 7:12 PM
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Originally Posted by ozonemania View Post
Part of the problem too is that salaries/wages in Vancouver are quite low. People don't get paid much here for similar work compared to cities like San Francisco, Hong Kong, Toronto, or even Calgary, Edmonton and Ottawa.
https://www.google.com/#q=cmhc+wage+growth+vancouver+low+risk
"Low Risk — Despite high Vancouver home prices, demand for housing across the price spectrum is supported by a growing population and growth in personal disposable income. "
     
     
  #2939  
Old Posted May 17, 2015, 7:13 PM
st7860 st7860 is offline
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Originally Posted by whatnext View Post
Really? Because you seem to pop up to defend against it with your stilted syntax every time someone dares to comment about it. That is when you are not enlightening with us with bon mots like "it takes 1 to know 1" or demonstrating your naivete about property taxes.

We've all got your number, might as well take your ball and go home.
Rude words won't change anything(American Wedding, 20023)
     
     
  #2940  
Old Posted May 17, 2015, 7:14 PM
blueandgoldguy blueandgoldguy is offline
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Originally Posted by ssiguy View Post
More good news from BC............

There has been a surge in discontent recently in Vancouver due to the housing demolitions and soaring house prices and a call to stop foreign ownership. There is a petition on change.org with about 20,000 signatures.

The other day Christy said foreign ownership rules would cause prices to drop and now our Minister of Housing has weighed in. Minister Coleman stated that he not only doesn't think foreign ownership is an issue and said that he has nor any part of the provincial government have any intention of even studying the effects of foreign ownership little alone do anything about.

He even had the audacity to say that he thinks Vancouver real estate is "quite reasonable" if you compare it to London or Tokyo. You couldn't make this stuff up.
Ssiguy, can you tell me where and in what type of home the typical young professional couple/family live in in the greater Vancouver area - condos? Houses? Renting basement suites? Square footage? How far from downtown? I'm thinking of those who are making reasonable salaries in the early to early/mid-stages of their career...say combined income of 100,000 - 125,000.

Offhand, i remember the last time I was in Vancouver (9 years ago) I saw advertisements for new condos starting at 300 or 350,000. I would think those would have been pretty small and I can only imagine how expensive they would be nowadays.
     
     
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