Lansdowne Park Redevelopment Phase 1 | Completed

[Radster]

Originally Posted by rocketphish

Parking isn't the only problem for Chernushenko.

He said at Lansdowne, like on Elgin St., pedestrians are starting to feel "squeezed" by patios. Restaurants have been building patios -- in some cases, pulling up new paving stones for infrastructure -- that jut from their storefronts.

"They are very, very big patios. I'm really getting the feeling like there's a new building," Chernushenko said.

Really? Complaining about patios now? They're not even finished building them yet. For now its kind of an illusion I think with the big construction fences making it feel like they are taking up lots of space. Wait till the patios are open and in full swing to pass judgment. I feel confident the parking issue will be fixed as well in time. But even now, with the small issues, I feel there is ample space for pedestrians at Lansdowne. This is just needless nitpicking!

[ars]

Originally Posted by loga0082

In my opinion, people should just take the bus, walk, or cycle instead to Lansdowne park. I knew from the beginning that parking at Lansdowne park will be a problem. Who needs a car anyway in Ottawa, when there is a good transportation system. It is NOT Los Angeles!

Loga0082

Having visited Western Europe and Tokyo, the public transportation in Ottawa isn't good. LA is a very low standard to be measured against.

You definitely need a car in this city to get around. Perhaps if we had a more robust rail system, it would be easier to ditch cars, but we don't(yet).

[Boxster]

Originally Posted by Radster

Really? Complaining about patios now? They're not even finished building them yet. For now its kind of an illusion I think with the big construction fences making it feel like they are taking up lots of space. Wait till the patios are open and in full swing to pass judgment. I feel confident the parking issue will be fixed as well in time. But even now, with the small issues, I feel there is ample space for pedestrians at Lansdowne. This is just needless nitpicking!

[1overcosc]

Originally Posted by ars

Having visited Western Europe and Tokyo, the public transportation in Ottawa isn't good. LA is a very low standard to be measured against.

You definitely need a car in this city to get around. Perhaps if we had a more robust rail system, it would be easier to ditch cars, but we don't(yet).

You can get around without a car pretty easily in the inner city and along the suburban areas immediately adjacent to the Transitway trunk.. but that only covers maybe a quarter of the city. The remaining 3/4, yes, you need a car unless you're very dedicated to carfree living.

I'd say that Western Europe and Japan, which are way denser and compact by geographic density and history, are not good benchmarks against Ottawa.. the comparison will always be unfair.

On the other hand, benchmarking against American cities is not fair either due to the extremely car-centric nature of the USA... Canadian cities are probably the fairest benchmarks. I'd say we do poorly compared to the big 3 but we compare well with Calgary or Edmonton.

[teej1984]

Originally Posted by rocketphish

[B]City worried about Lansdowne car 'culture'

Parking isn't the only problem for Chernushenko.

He said at Lansdowne, like on Elgin St., pedestrians are starting to feel "squeezed" by patios. Restaurants have been building patios -- in some cases, pulling up new paving stones for infrastructure -- that jut from their storefronts.

"They are very, very big patios. I'm really getting the feeling like there's a new building," Chernushenko said.

http://www.ottawasun.com/2015/05/11/city-worried-about-lansdowne-car-culture

REALLY? Are we REALLY being squeezed by patios? Places people can go and enjoy being outside? Or is the REAL problem that we're squeezed by on street parking? Bingo.

[ars]

Originally Posted by 1overcosc

You can get around without a car pretty easily in the inner city and along the suburban areas immediately adjacent to the Transitway trunk.. but that only covers maybe a quarter of the city. The remaining 3/4, yes, you need a car unless you're very dedicated to carfree living.

I'd say that Western Europe and Japan, which are way denser and compact by geographic density and history, are not good benchmarks against Ottawa.. the comparison will always be unfair.

On the other hand, benchmarking against American cities is not fair either due to the extremely car-centric nature of the USA... Canadian cities are probably the fairest benchmarks. I'd say we do poorly compared to the big 3 but we compare well with Calgary or Edmonton.

I agree that Tokyo and Western Europe are probably extreme examples on the other end of the scale, but I would characterize the public transportation in those places as good/great. LA would probably fall under the poor end of that scale, Ottawa probably falls under average/adequate/mediocre.

As long as buses run the show, I think cars will always be preferred over public transportation here. It's really not that surprising that people are choosing to drive over taking other forms of transportation to Landsdowne.

[Radster]

Originally Posted by teej1984

REALLY? Are we REALLY being squeezed by patios? Places people can go and enjoy being outside? Or is the REAL problem that we're squeezed by on street parking? Bingo.

EXACTLY! I think they should temporarily remove some of the on street parking in front of Lavazza and South Street Burger/NYF as well as in front of the future Italian restaurant so that these places can also have patios. Then reinstate those parking spots come winter time.

[lrt's friend]

City worried about Lansdowne car 'culture'

Isn't this exactly what I have been talking about? I am waiting for the 'good' alternative.

[phil235]

Originally Posted by ars

As long as buses run the show, I think cars will always be preferred over public transportation here. It's really not that surprising that people are choosing to drive over taking other forms of transportation to Landsdowne.

Hold on a second. We don't have any information suggesting that people are choosing to drive to Lansdowne over other forms of transportation. What we do know is that for big sports events, the majority of people are not coming by car, and we know that they are using regular transit service rather than the dedicated shuttles.

It's just a guess based on surveys done in other places and relatively low parking utilization numbers, but I suspect that generally speaking, the majority of people going to Lansdowne at other times aren't driving either.

[ars]

Originally Posted by phil235

Hold on a second. We don't have any information suggesting that people are choosing to drive to Lansdowne over other forms of transportation. What we do know is that for big sports events, the majority of people are not coming by car, and we know that they are using regular transit service rather than the dedicated shuttles.

It's just a guess based on surveys done in other places and relatively low parking utilization numbers, but I suspect that generally speaking, the majority of people going to Lansdowne at other times aren't driving either.

Just speaking about the people that ARE choosing to drive over taking public transportion to Landsdowne, I'm not surprised that they are choosing to do so.

There's certainly more cars in Landsdowne than the planners were anticipating, as the article says, and I think a lot of that has to do with the nature of the public transportation in this city. Currently, to bus from Barrhaven to Landsdowne, it takes an hour and that involves at least two transfers. A 20 minute drive and taking 10 mins to search for parking is far more appealing than that.

[1overcosc]

Originally Posted by ars

Just speaking about the people that ARE choosing to drive over taking public transportion to Landsdowne, I'm not surprised that they are choosing to do so.

There's certainly more cars in Landsdowne than the planners were anticipating, as the article says, and I think a lot of that has to do with the nature of the public transportation in this city. Currently, to bus from Barrhaven to Landsdowne, it takes an hour and that involves at least two transfers. A 20 minute drive and taking 10 mins to search for parking is far more appealing than that.

From Barrhaven to Lansdowne, if park & riding in Barrhaven, you can get there in one transfer. 99 to Billings then 1 to Lansdowne, or 94/95 to downtown then 1 or 7 to Lansdowne. It becomes two if taking a local route within Barrhaven. Can't see a scenario in which it would take more than 2.

Also is it really only 20 minutes from Barrhaven to Lansdowne? I'm surprised at that (not disputing your point though), I would have thought it takes a lot longer than that.

[ars]

Originally Posted by 1overcosc

From Barrhaven to Lansdowne, if park & riding in Barrhaven, you can get there in one transfer. 99 to Billings then 1 to Lansdowne, or 94/95 to downtown then 1 or 7 to Lansdowne. It becomes two if taking a local route within Barrhaven. Can't see a scenario in which it would take more than 2.

Also is it really only 20 minutes from Barrhaven to Lansdowne? I'm surprised at that (not disputing your point though), I would have thought it takes a lot longer than that.

Sorry, meant two buses not two transfers

But yeah, driving to Landsdowne from Barrhaven is only 15-20 mins, unless you're trying to go in the morning rush hour.

[phil235]

Originally Posted by ars

Just speaking about the people that ARE choosing to drive over taking public transportion to Landsdowne, I'm not surprised that they are choosing to do so.

There's certainly more cars in Landsdowne than the planners were anticipating, as the article says, and I think a lot of that has to do with the nature of the public transportation in this city. Currently, to bus from Barrhaven to Landsdowne, it takes an hour and that involves at least two transfers. A 20 minute drive and taking 10 mins to search for parking is far more appealing than that.

Fair enough. But there aren't more cars than planners were anticipating. There are just more cars on the surface than was anticipated. Utilization rates in the garage are not particularly high, other than during big events.

Part of the problem is that the market square was intended to be a pedestrian area, and it is being used as a thoroughfare/parking. The question for me is the willingness to address that.

[OTSkyline]

In my opinion there should be no "onstreet" or surface parking at Lansdowne.. The underground parking is more than enough to accomodate the daily people who will visit shops, whole foods, restaurants and the movie theatre.. We have this nice high tech parking (which can also be free depending on validation). So why should we allow people to park on the streets at Lansdowne?

[Boxster]

Originally Posted by OTSkyline

In my opinion there should be no "onstreet" or surface parking at Lansdowne.. The underground parking is more than enough to accomodate the daily people who will visit shops, whole foods, restaurants and the movie theatre.. We have this nice high tech parking (which can also be free depending on validation). So why should we allow people to park on the streets at Lansdowne?

I fully agree.

[Mulder]

Originally Posted by phil235

Hold on a second. We don't have any information suggesting that people are choosing to drive to Lansdowne over other forms of transportation. What we do know is that for big sports events, the majority of people are not coming by car, and we know that they are using regular transit service rather than the dedicated shuttles.

It's just a guess based on surveys done in other places and relatively low parking utilization numbers, but I suspect that generally speaking, the majority of people going to Lansdowne at other times aren't driving either.

I live 3km south of Lansdowne. When I go, other than sporting events, I drive. Went to 2 67's games and drove also.

I am also driving there tonight.

[loga0082]

In my opinion, people should only park underneath in the garage, not near the Aberdeen Pavilion. They do give free parking for some shops. Over a month ago, when I went to Lansdowne park on a Sunday to eat at Teriyaki and go see a movie, I thought there were too many cars. People were going in to park near the Aberdeen Pavilion. I know that they had the Farmer's market inside the building then. Personally, I much rather walk by foot or take the bus. Too bad, the LRT will not be going pass Lansdowne park. It is supposed to go from Tunney's pasture to Blair Station. They were thinking of building a phase 2 LRT from Orleans to Kanata.

Loga0082

[phil235]

Originally Posted by Mulder

I live 3km south of Lansdowne. When I go, other than sporting events, I drive. Went to 2 67's games and drove also.

I am also driving there tonight.

And your point is? Do you have any evidence that you are in the majority? I'm not sure that you aren't, but what we do know suggests that a lot of people are not driving.

[loga0082]

I, for example; never drive a car. I always walk to Lansdowne park, but only during the day. To me, cars are expensive, causes pollution, and dangerous. That is what I think. None of you guys have to agree with me. You can drive to Lansdowne park, if you want to.

loga0082

[Radster]

Originally Posted by loga0082

I, for example; never drive a car. I always walk to Lansdowne park, but only during the day. To me, cars are expensive, causes pollution, and dangerous. That is what I think. None of you guys have to agree with me. You can drive to Lansdowne park, if you want to.

loga0082

I take my bike most of the time to Lansdowne (to see a Fury game, to go eat/drink, to see a movie etc), but when its cold out, or raining, or if I will be buying many things at Whole Foods or the Farmers Market, then I prefer to drive, because taking the bus is no fun when you have tons of bags and have to transfer. But its different for everyone.

Anyone been to the Farmers Market since they set it up outdoors in the square? Just wondering what the choice of products is like compared to say, Parkdale Market, or Byward? I need to buy a bunch of annuals, herbs, veggie planst, etc to plant at home, and wanted to know whether I should bother with Lansdowne or just stick to my usual one which is Parkdale?