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  #941  
Old Posted Dec 23, 2014, 4:35 AM
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Wonderland South plan (Preliminary Road Design PDFs)

https://www.london.ca/residents/Environment/EAs/Pages/Wonderland-Road-South.aspx

Quite interesting. I especially like the 3-way roundabout. The initial plan for 6 lanes all the way to the 401 was a bit overkill, this plan shows 6 to Exeter and 4 to the 402 and 401.
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  #942  
Old Posted Dec 23, 2014, 7:19 PM
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Interesting indeed, seems like a fairly well laid out plan. I really like the roundabout idea at Dingmen.
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  #943  
Old Posted Dec 24, 2014, 1:41 AM
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@haljackey I don't believe there were ever plans to 6 lane Wonderland to the 401, just the 402.. Never know how the area between 402 and 401 will develop, whether it will be industry or more retail sprawl.

While the plans are quite well done, it's unfortunate the triangle of doom seems to have no improvement or change to it. It had been proposed in SWAP for Wharncliffe to swing west before Wonderland, and connect to Kilbourne Rd. as a northern bypass of Lambeth and new alignment of Highway 2. But I guess them Lambeth folk got in a stink about Highway 2 passing "downtown" and put the kibosh to it...

Bit surprised that it calls for Wharncliffe also being 6 lanes at Wonderland, didn't know there were plans to do any expansion to Wahrncliffe. It would be the first 6 lane x 6 lane intersection in London, whenever it's built.
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  #944  
Old Posted Dec 24, 2014, 4:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Pimpmasterdac View Post
@haljackey It had been proposed in SWAP for Wharncliffe to swing west before Wonderland, and connect to Kilbourne Rd. as a northern bypass of Lambeth and new alignment of Highway 2. But I guess them Lambeth folk got in a stink about Highway 2 passing "downtown" and put the kibosh to it....
It's far more likely that the the complications (and there are many) of trying to construct such a link west of Col.Talbot to Longwoods Rd. simply made it simpler to not discuss the matter in this plan release. Such a link will not be needed for a very long time and a lot can happen between now and then, so why kick the hornet's nest now for no real reason? When it is needed, it will be re-addressed. Right now, the current road network in that area is used mainly as a commuter route for folks in the Delaware area and west of there. It's not near as busy now as it was before the 402. Lots of capacity compared to 30 years ago.
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  #945  
Old Posted Jan 3, 2015, 12:10 AM
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I just spent a week in London. I'm pleased to see the progress on Hyde Park Road, including the widened CNR overhead. Also very pleased with how well Southdale now moves west of Wharncliffe...that used to be a slow drive.

I see Lord Gainsborough is still in business.
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  #946  
Old Posted Jan 4, 2015, 4:42 AM
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Still serving Liver & Onions. Price has gone up, I understand.
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  #947  
Old Posted Feb 27, 2015, 1:35 PM
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LFP: London undertaking $55 million in road projects this summer

Quote:
THE BIG PROJECTS

Widening of Hyde Park Rd. between South Carriage Rd. and Fanshawe Park Rd. (phase 2)
•Cost: $14.5 million
•When: April to July 2016 (phase 1 of project between Oxford St. and South Carriage Rd. scheduled to be finished in September)

Widening of Commissioners Rd.. between Wonderland and Wharncliffe roads
•Cost: $11.5 million
•When: June until November 2016

Riverside Drive, between Wharncliffe Rd. and Woodward Ave.
•Cost: $2 million
•What: sewer, water, road
•When: May to September; road closing mid-July to mid-August

Highbury bridge rehabilitation (north of Trafalgar St.)
•Cost: $4 million
•When: May to November

Bruce St. east of Wharncliffe Rd.
•Cost: $3 million
•What: Sewer, road
•May to November; one week closing in July

Wonderland Rd. at Hamlyn St.
•Cost: $8.5 million
•What: Sewer, water road
•When: April to December, one-week closing of Wonderland in spring

Burbrook St.
•Cost: $10 million
•What: sewer
•When: May to November reduced lanes

Colborne St. S. (north of the Thames River)
•Cost: $5 million
•What: sewer, water, road, streetscape
•When: April to November

Dingman Creek erosion control
•Cost: $4.5 million
•No traffic impact

Upper Queens/Ridout St.
•Cost: $2 millon
•What: streetscape/bikepath
•(After Bruce-Wharncliffe project)

DEVELOPMENT PROJECTS AFFECTING TRAFFIC
•1643-1653 Richmond St, south of Hillview Boul.
•Commercial development at Wonderland Rd. and Oxford St.
•Commercial development at Wonderland and Wharncliffe roads
I live in Liver&Onions, and I am counting down the days to the completion of the Hyde Park(ing lot) Rd. widening.
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  #948  
Old Posted Feb 27, 2015, 3:12 PM
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Haha I was about to post this

I take Commissioners every weekday to and from work. It's goona be painful through this stretch. However its something that should have been done like 20 years ago, so I welcome it with open arms.

The Wonderland / 401 interchange may open by the end of the year too if we're lucky.
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  #949  
Old Posted Apr 14, 2015, 4:17 PM
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The CN overpass rehabilitation on Highbury started today.

A lot of snarls this morning, caught me off guard and made me late for work. Down to one lane in each direction. Going to be a headache until October: http://apps.london.ca/RightOfWay/Details.aspx?GIS_ID=3816

Avoid if possible. I am happy its finally going to get fixed but just sucks its going to take a while.

Top 10 infrastructure projects this year: http://www.london.ca/residents/Roads-Tra...Pages/Top10-Infrastructure-Projects.aspx
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  #950  
Old Posted Apr 27, 2015, 1:47 PM
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http://www.lfpress.com/2015/04/26/quiet-...-to-citys-plans-until-a-couple-weeks-ago

Classic. Who knew that Londoners opposed walkability in their neighbourhoods.
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  #951  
Old Posted Apr 27, 2015, 5:44 PM
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Dear god typical people complaining just to complain...I bet those same people who signed the petition would be screaming if someone got hit by a car while walking asking why the city does not have sidewalks.

Did a quick street view and most of the driveways look quite long (like 3-4 cars deep) so adding sidewalks should not affect people parking.
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  #952  
Old Posted Apr 28, 2015, 6:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrSlippery519 View Post
Dear god typical people complaining just to complain...I bet those same people who signed the petition would be screaming if someone got hit by a car while walking asking why the city does not have sidewalks.

Did a quick street view and most of the driveways look quite long (like 3-4 cars deep) so adding sidewalks should not affect people parking.
Agreed. There are a number of streets in the older sections of Byron (built prior to City of London annexation) that have no sidewalks, and growing up in that area I had wished there were sidewalks for safety. Griffith Street, for example, between Byron Baseline Road and Commissioners is a collector but has no sidewalks but is not particularly wide and is busy with frequent London Transit buses along with collector and local traffic. There needs to be a sidewalk there, at least on the side that has the buses. Additionally several of the streets that serve Jorgenson Park and the Optimist Centre have no sidewalks, including Norman Ave and Brock Street, despite them getting traffic leading to/from Boler Road. As was common with residential areas built in the 1950s, there are very large setbacks from the roadway to the houses in all these cases, so there's lots of room for sidewalks.

Nearby Byron Baseline Road - an arterial - only has a sidewalk on the north side between Griffith and Brock Streets. That has always been a safety concern for me too. I'm surprised that was not addressed several years ago when the electrical utilities were replaced along there, as the poles continue to be in the way of where a sidewalk could go.
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  #953  
Old Posted Apr 28, 2015, 10:44 PM
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Originally Posted by manny_santos View Post
http://www.lfpress.com/2015/04/26/quiet-...-to-citys-plans-until-a-couple-weeks-ago

Classic. Who knew that Londoners opposed walkability in their neighbourhoods.
This isn't a London-only issue. It's a common issue in many, many cities. Installing sidewalks where there currently are none in established neighbourhoods is one of the most contentious issues surrounding infrastructure and transportation. Those against it will talk about a waste of taxpayers dollars, disruption, etc., when in the end it's never more than NIMBYism. They will often say that they support a good transportation network, alternative modes of transportation, and good walkability in their city - just not in front of their house, because although it's certainly needed elsewhere placing one in front of their house is just wrong and unnecessary. I've heard some folks against a sidewalk on their street argue that it would be bad for the environment, or that installing one would open up the possibility that "strangers" would then walk down their street, including "undesirables". When I challenged that it was in fact a public right-of-way, a response I got once was then a request to close their street and gate it off to all but the residents. Problem of keeping the strangers and undesirables out solved.
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  #954  
Old Posted Apr 28, 2015, 11:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snark View Post
This isn't a London-only issue. It's a common issue in many, many cities. Installing sidewalks where there currently are none in established neighbourhoods is one of the most contentious issues surrounding infrastructure and transportation. Those against it will talk about a waste of taxpayers dollars, disruption, etc., when in the end it's never more than NIMBYism. They will often say that they support a good transportation network, alternative modes of transportation, and good walkability in their city - just not in front of their house, because although it's certainly needed elsewhere placing one in front of their house is just wrong and unnecessary. I've heard some folks against a sidewalk on their street argue that it would be bad for the environment, or that installing one would open up the possibility that "strangers" would then walk down their street, including "undesirables". When I challenged that it was in fact a public right-of-way, a response I got once was then a request to close their street and gate it off to all but the residents. Problem of keeping the strangers and undesirables out solved.
I've never heard of opposition to a new sidewalk, ever, anywhere.
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  #955  
Old Posted Apr 29, 2015, 8:05 PM
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Having a sidewalk on just one side of the road for side streets is fine if you ask me.

If there's two, then that should be a bonus!
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  #956  
Old Posted Apr 30, 2015, 7:24 PM
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Snark’s right, you can read newspaper articles about suburbanites livid that the municipality is going to install a sidewalk on their street in most cities in the country. Not too long ago, there was an article in the Hamilton Spectator about a woman who had planted a butterfly garden on the city property in front of her house, and parked her SUV on it to prevent staff from installing a sidewalk. The hypocrisy can be astounding- in that case, what the City was doing was variously bad for the environment by increasing impermeable area (but creating a car-dependent neighbourhood isn’t), a waste of tax dollars (but wasting a city crew’s time is not), dangerous (unlike walking on the road itself), and so on and so on. In London, at least the issue of snow clearing can’t be brought up- in other cities, homeowners are responsible for clearing their own sidewalks, and so can get vehement when the city wants to “force” one of them.

Shame on the Free Press for publishing garbage like this, referring to “one of those quiet London streets.” When one of Ms. Schmidt’s elderly neighbours has to walk in the street because the snow is piled two feet high along the side, I doubt they’ll have a news article about that. But it’s somehow necessary to print a story about how Schmidt and her neighbours don’t want to lose that fourth parking spot in their driveways.

Last edited by HillStreetBlues; Apr 30, 2015 at 7:40 PM. Reason: Spelling error
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  #957  
Old Posted Apr 30, 2015, 8:49 PM
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Originally Posted by HillStreetBlues View Post
But it’s somehow necessary to print a story about how Schmidt and her neighbours don’t want to lose that fourth parking spot in their driveways.
From what I can gather this is actually the real reason for them not wanting sidewalks, there is really no other logical thought process I can come up with.
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  #958  
Old Posted May 1, 2015, 1:02 AM
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Bunch of busy body cluckers. Good thing council and their ward councillor didn't listen to their shit. Probably been in the plans for years but they didn't bother to know it until they're literally shovel ready.
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  #959  
Old Posted May 1, 2015, 2:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Pimpmasterdac View Post
Bunch of busy body cluckers. Good thing council and their ward councillor didn't listen to their shit. Probably been in the plans for years but they didn't bother to know it until they're literally shovel ready.
Now that is definitely a common problem, people are woefully ignorant about future plans for their neighbourhood. Just recently a bunch of trees were taken down on the south side of Byron near Boler Road, and some neighbours on Longview Court were shocked there was development happening there and were getting angry at Vito Frijia's company. Even though that area has been targeted for residential development pretty much since the 1993 annexation.

Citizens need to get more involved in Official Plan processes and zoning amendments. That is when decisions are made about what might go in what places, not the day before the bulldozers show up. We had a similar situation in Kingston a couple years ago where an area shown as low-density residential on that city's Official Plan became the site of a new greenfield development of single-family homes, and nearby neighbours were up in arms claiming they didn't know houses would "ever" go in that location.

I do seriously wonder if real estate agents that sell homes even bother talking about the Official Plan as it relates to the area surrounding the homes they sell.
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  #960  
Old Posted May 3, 2015, 5:20 PM
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The issue being discussed here serves as an excellent example for those on the outside looking in on how it can be damn difficult to both govern and provide public service in our modern environment of "transparency" and "democracy". It's a rare day anymore when one can get 10 randomly selected people in a room and unanimously agree on anything, yet this sort of process is becoming more and more commonplace in the process of governance, and concurrently less and less is getting done as a result.

50 years ago, the publicly elected representatives set policy and made high-level decisions. Staff then took that direction and converted it into action. If you didn't like it, you voted for someone else in the next election who would set different policy that was closer to your liking. Today, we have multiple public input sessions, environmental assessment processes for just about anything, a media process that can give a voice that is far disproportionate to the size of the opinion holders, and a political class that thinks astoundingly short-term and is cripplingly risk-adverse. First result: any group who is against anything can now hold up or kill an initiative because in their opinion it's a bad thing. Second result: things that need to happen get delayed, end up costing more, or just don't happen at all. Expert opinion and product is disregarded in favor of the wants of local know-it-alls and NIMBYS. What was referred to earlier as those "busy body cluckers" now have a voice - and a bigger one than they ought to. Third result: decision makers spend inordinate time on and become bogged down in relatively small matters such a garbage collection cycles or whether a tree should be cut down on some street instead of focusing on truly important strategic development and decision making. This little issue with sidewalks is a representative microcosm of a much larger problem: if staff and council spend more than 5 minutes on this matter instead of trying to grow and improve a city, it's too much effort. Yet that's what is going to happen with this and hundreds of other issues that would have been considered small stuff not worth sweating in the past.

Big issues such as rapid transit, intensification, what sort of public amenities should be provided, environmental issues, limiting urban sprawl, urban design standards, etc. rapidly become mired in discord and strife these days because everyone, and I mean everyone must have a voice in the process. Many such initiatives die a slow stillborn death as a result, or are watered down to the point of being ineffectual. To give but one quick example: can anyone imagine trying to get highway 401 constructed in today's environment?

Other countries don't have such processes, and things move at a relatively astounding speed as a result. New rapid system for our city? Decided and constructed. Need a new downtown? Decided and constructed. Want a dam for tourist and recreational use? Decided and constructed. Sidewalks on both sides of the street everywhere? Decided and constructed.

Most of those countries however are far less transparent, democratic, or sensitive to the wants and needs of the minority. They're also outpacing us at an alarming rate - in part because of that. So, in the end, it begs the question: can there be too much transparency? Too much democracy? Too much public input and control of the process?



Quote:
Originally Posted by manny_santos View Post
Now that is definitely a common problem, people are woefully ignorant about future plans for their neighbourhood. Just recently a bunch of trees were taken down on the south side of Byron near Boler Road, and some neighbours on Longview Court were shocked there was development happening there and were getting angry at Vito Frijia's company. Even though that area has been targeted for residential development pretty much since the 1993 annexation.

Citizens need to get more involved in Official Plan processes and zoning amendments. That is when decisions are made about what might go in what places, not the day before the bulldozers show up. We had a similar situation in Kingston a couple years ago where an area shown as low-density residential on that city's Official Plan became the site of a new greenfield development of single-family homes, and nearby neighbours were up in arms claiming they didn't know houses would "ever" go in that location.

I do seriously wonder if real estate agents that sell homes even bother talking about the Official Plan as it relates to the area surrounding the homes they sell.

Last edited by Snark; May 3, 2015 at 5:37 PM.
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