DENVER | Main Development Thread #6

[Denver]

Originally Posted by BG918

The list of proposed but not necessarily "real" projects includes 999 17th - 28 story apartment tower and 9 story office tower; Tabor II - 31 story office tower, Block 162 - 30 story hotel and 30 story office tower, Four Seasons 2 - 32 story apartment tower, The Coloradan condo tower at Union Station - 19 stories, Hilton Garden Inn at Union Station - 12 stories and 16Chestnut - 18 stories.

Four Seasons 2...really? No way that project will even be considered until 1144 15th and 1401 Lawrence are finished up (unless you know something we don't)

[BG918]

Originally Posted by Denver

Four Seasons 2...really? No way that project will even be considered until 1144 15th and 1401 Lawrence are finished up (unless you know something we don't)

Latest I've heard is that the tower is on hold but the parking podium is still in play which would be built to eventually hold a 30 story tower above. The developers are in no hurry with all that's going on around there so we'll see..

I noticed today they are demolishing the Sinclair station at Alameda & Downing. Anyone know what's planned there?

[DenvertoLA]

Does anyone have an update on the progress of the Alexan Uptown project? I just realized with that building and Skyhouse there is going to be + 700 res in that area!

[TakeFive]

Colorado Proud
DigitalGlobe, a Colorado born and bred young growing company was recently featured by Greg Avery in the DBJ HERE:

Full story on the Front Range Thread.

[The Dirt]

Last time I checked, it was still in the midst of construction the below grade parking level. It's probably above grade by now.

[DownhomeDenver]

Originally Posted by The Dirt

What's going on at 17 Ave and Lafayette?

Yeh that two story medical building is now gone. I would post the rendering from years ago, but I got spanked by Kenny at DI.COM the last time I did . So, I can tell you that it's going to be a new building of some sort...but that's about all I know. LOL

[Stonemans_rowJ]

Originally Posted by TakeFive

Just a guess as I can't really know.

How many of you pay retail for anything? At least for the great majority of humanity nobody pays "sticker;" everything is marked off to some degree. I'll assume that the advertised or internet price is the sticker price.

Likely when prospective tenants stop by they are offered one special or another, a move-in or "Look and Lease" special for example. Perhaps for a few who are transferring in with a good job they may want to secure their living space ahead of time, sight unseen and may pay retail.

My sense is that landlord strategies whether leasing an apartment or a full floor of office space is to maintain "high" street or retail asking rates and then make it easy and tempting for tenants to make a decision through various discounts upfront. Nothing radical here but it all has become more sophisticated or software driven just like the internet in general where prices can change constantly.

I still sense that the market has peaked or is peaking. Some projects are starting to show some wear and tear already. Hard to predict accurately the future but one question is how much will Cherry Creek inventory compete with downtown inventory? How much will Lower Highlands compete as it continues to become an attractive alternative?

The good news is that the market appears to remain strong enough that the pipeline should remain active, at least for awhile.

Cherry Creek may be luxury but it doesn't have the hip factor with younger people.

In my opinion Cherry Creek apartment inventory and downtown inventory may have some crossover but not much more than that. I just don't know many millennials who would want to live in Cherry Creek, but every one of them would like to live downtown, union station, riverfront, or lohi. Lohi is still arguably the hottest neighborhood in town and has been for awhile, both for rentals and for sale product.

[RyanD]

Mmmmm winter....


G0094341 by RyanDravitz, on Flickr

[DownhomeDenver]

Originally Posted by The Dirt

Last time I checked, it was still in the midst of construction the below grade parking level. It's probably above grade by now.

Nope. Went by today. Looks like they're almost done with shoring but it's still below street level.

[Scottk]

Article today in the Denver post about how downtown Denver's development boom has created a "lack" of parking downtown. Features quotes from our beloved Ken, AKA Denverinfill.

http://www.denverpost.com/business/ci_27...ent-boom-adds-vibrancy-subtracts-parking


some of the comments bitching about "rampant overdevelopment" are pretty funny.

[Stonemans_rowJ]

Originally Posted by Scottk

Article today in the Denver post about how downtown Denver's development boom has created a "lack" of parking downtown. Features quotes from our beloved Ken, AKA Denverinfill.

http://www.denverpost.com/business/ci_27...ent-boom-adds-vibrancy-subtracts-parking


some of the comments bitching about "rampant overdevelopment" are pretty funny.

First off, we have a long long way to go before we have a "lack of parking." Look at the prices of parking downtown. It's (relatively) cheap. That means there is still a huge oversupply.

There was also this gem, "It's time to take our city back"

http://www.denverpost.com/guestcommentary/ci_27610607/guest-commentary-its-time-take-our-city-back

[Scottk]

the comments on that article made me very upset

[mr1138]

The argument that anybody who supports density MUST clearly be getting paid off by developers is one that seems to be rampant these days. It is nothing more than an unsubstantiated slur, but one that the "aesthetic environmentalists" have spread around to the point that I think a lot of people now accept it as self-evident, even though there is absolutely NO evidence that this is going on. It really is infuriating. Everybody knows that density is inherently "ugly," and nobody could possibly support it if they don't have a direct financial interest... right? But I have to say that this rhetoric is 500% worse in Boulder than it is in the comments on the DP. A lot of people now say the word "developers" the way they have talked about "Wall Street Bankers" since the recession. And it's based purely on unexamined assertions and populist hatred(/jealousy) of "monied interests" like people who happen to own valuable land.

[enjo13]

The headline picture says it all really.

The comments made me chuckle more than anything else. I'm finding that the folks living down south are becoming a bit nervous about Denver these days. The south suburbs have long been convinced that the city would always sort of migrate towards them. Clearly the opposite is happening and I think these "oh I'm glad I never go downtown" comments are the sour grapes you'd expect.

[The Dirt]

Some new (to me) renderings of Alexan Uptown from the developer's website:









http://www.kephart.com/kephart-gallery/mid-to-high-rise/alexan-uptown-3

[seventwenty]

Originally Posted by Stonemans_rowJ

There was also this gem, "It's time to take our city back"

http://www.denverpost.com/guestcommentary/ci_27610607/guest-commentary-its-time-take-our-city-back

Wasn't he the lead plaintiff's attorney for the Lowry infill lawsuit?

ETA: Yuuppppppp.

[EngiNerd]

HA! Well look at that, lol...good find 720

[Stonemans_rowJ]

There has been so much published lately about how expensive rents are. This is entirely true. However, in many cases it is actually cheaper to rent than buy right now in Denver.

Take this example, apples to apples.

In my building, a 2/2 unit just rented for $2150/month (1140 ft.)

Well, units in the building (all the same size) are selling in the high 400's. The last one to close this week sold for $500,000, and there are three other units for sale between $470,000-$514,000.

If you were to buy one of these, put 20% down (about $100,000), your mortgage, tax, and insurance, would be around $2000/month. Then add in the HOA of almost $400/month. Renting the same unit saves you $200/month. This assumes you put down 20% and don't PMI.

This is playing out all over town.

I looked at a Cheesman Denver square the other day. Asking price on rent was $2300. Easily a $550,000 house. Do the math. Cheaper to rent it.

Then if you ever want to move or need to move, just finish the lease and turn the keys in. All these townhomes in Jefferson Park etc. Those buyers, if they need to sell in the next 2 years, they'll be lucky to break even. They might even take a loss.

[DownhomeDenver]

Originally Posted by Stonemans_rowJ

Then if you ever want to move or need to move, just finish the lease and turn the keys in. All these townhomes in Jefferson Park etc. Those buyers, if they need to sell in the next 2 years, they'll be lucky to break even. They might even take a loss.

Why do you think that's the case?

[bcp]

selling in the next two years is not what buying is about - gotta think 5 years minimum and ride the cycles...we may not see a quick-flip market for another decade.

i like the analysis, but you're also leaving out the tax benefit of owning - that 20k in interest payments comes right off taxable income, and you're looking at $5k each year in refunds easily (if you have a normal-ish return).