Metro Vancouver Transit Discussion

[st7860]

Originally Posted by GlassCity

Speaking of which, do you or anybody else here know how Translink's image problems got started? I only really started actively following transit like a year or two ago, and that point the negative perception was firmly entrenched. Was there a point where Translink rapidly lost popularity, or what's the reason for its issues?

Skytrain issues, management issues, etc. and... changing the CEO during an upcoming vote?

Something else I just thought of. sometimes translink runs billboard ads at stations saying things like "pet peeves " or 'report this" but "dont report that" - The ad space would better be used instead with hundreds of examples(with the actual person in the picture if they are willing) what skytrain attendants and transit police do. such as perform first aid, help lost people, etc. there is a very negative perception that attendants dont do anything.

lots of little stuff like that, that won't necessarily cost that much, could do a lot towards improving the perception of translink.

[GlassCity]

Originally Posted by st7860

Skytrain issues, management issues, etc. and... changing the CEO during an upcoming vote?

Something else I just thought of. sometimes translink runs billboard ads at stations saying things like "pet peeves " or 'report this" but "dont report that" - The ad space would better be used instead with hundreds of examples(with the actual person in the picture if they are willing) what skytrain attendants and transit police do. such as perform first aid, help lost people, etc. there is a very negative perception that attendants dont do anything.

lots of little stuff like that, that won't necessarily cost that much, could do a lot towards improving the perception of translink.

But that's now. I'm just curious...how did it all start? It seems like there must have been something to start it all off, and then now the media reports on every little thing, because people love to read about TransLink messing up, which leads to a snowball effect.

[dpogue]

Originally Posted by GlassCity

But that's now. I'm just curious...how did it all start? It seems like there must have been something to start it all off, and then now the media reports on every little thing, because people love to read about TransLink messing up, which leads to a snowball effect.

I think it was within the past year or two, I don't remember if there was a specific event that started it, but there were stories about Compass card issues, closing Main Street station and possibly closing Metrotown for renovations, the Main Street Poodle, and then the SkyTrain issues last summer. Now TransLink's just an easy target.

[nname]

Originally Posted by GlassCity

But that's now. I'm just curious...how did it all start? It seems like there must have been something to start it all off, and then now the media reports on every little thing, because people love to read about TransLink messing up, which leads to a snowball effect.

When transit expansion is no longer free, and they start ask for more money to fund the expansions. This was between 2009 and 2010.

Before 2009, TransLink was collecting more taxes than what it spent, so they were rapidly expanding services. In 2009, they ran out of money, and is not able to sustain existing service due to the rapid expansion from previous years. They made plans to cut service, or ask for funding to maintain/expand. Some money were given in 2010 (in the range of 20~30M), but it was only enough to maintain services that were added in the previous years. The promised expansions (Evergreen Line, Surrey B-Lines) where not delivered. People were not happy as the money did not produce any new service. In fact, services were cut in some area due to "service optimization".

Every year after that, TransLink asked for more money to expansion, and it was turned down every year except 2012 (which delivered Evergreen Line, 96 B-Line, Hwy 1 rapid bus, etc.) I guess this gives people the impression of "TransLink keep asking for more money".

[GlassCity]

Originally Posted by nname

When transit expansion is no longer free, and they start ask for more money to fund the expansions. This was between 2009 and 2010.

Before 2009, TransLink was collecting more taxes than what it spent, so they were rapidly expanding services. In 2009, they ran out of money, and is not able to sustain existing service due to the rapid expansion from previous years. They made plans to cut service, or ask for funding to maintain/expand. Some money were given in 2010 (in the range of 20~30M), but it was only enough to maintain services that were added in the previous years. The promised expansions (Evergreen Line, Surrey B-Lines) where not delivered. People were not happy as the money did not produce any new service. In fact, services were cut in some area due to "service optimization".

Every year after that, TransLink asked for more money to expansion, and it was turned down every year except 2012 (which delivered Evergreen Line, 96 B-Line, Hwy 1 rapid bus, etc.) I guess this gives people the impression of "TransLink keep asking for more money".

Yeah, what I hear most often from people is that TransLink is simply wasteful. Their executive pay is definitely brought up the most, plus that one empty office they have somewhere. The impression is that since TransLink has the right to ask for more tax, they never look to save any money; instead, they just ask for more as soon as they run out.

Even though that's exactly what service optimization is, of which I've only been a victim, never a beneficiary. But I guess that's what I get for living in the suburbs

Another factor is that people don't believe how much it costs to operate a transit system. I've read out the numbers from TransLink's budgets to some people I argue with about this, and they remain convinced that TransLink either spends more money than they should be on operation, or that they're simply lying about how much it costs them.

[red-paladin]

It's a (partly deserved) image created by the media cause it riles up the unwashed masses.

[Kisai]

Originally Posted by GlassCity

Yeah, what I hear most often from people is that TransLink is simply wasteful. Their executive pay is definitely brought up the most, plus that one empty office they have somewhere. The impression is that since TransLink has the right to ask for more tax, they never look to save any money; instead, they just ask for more as soon as they run out.

Even though that's exactly what service optimization is, of which I've only been a victim, never a beneficiary. But I guess that's what I get for living in the suburbs

Another factor is that people don't believe how much it costs to operate a transit system. I've read out the numbers from TransLink's budgets to some people I argue with about this, and they remain convinced that TransLink either spends more money than they should be on operation, or that they're simply lying about how much it costs them.

As I've said before. The only single line item that could be cut to get "250 million" in savings would be to cut the bus service in half. So think about how often you use the bus right now. I'll bring this up again:


So we could cut everyone's service in half, or we can eliminate the entirety of Vancouver/UBC, or the entirety of Burnaby+NewWest+SoF+NorthEast to get that kind of savings. When the Evergreen line starts up, you'll see a down-tick in bus service for sure, just like with Richmond and the Canada Line. Think about how much bus hours will be freed up by the Broadway line, and then think about how much it will cost to operate the proposed Surrey LRT.


You could mothball the Expo/Millenium Line and the WCE and not even get half of the 250 million. That's how efficient the Skytrain is, because most of it's capital costs have been paid off.

[MIPS]

Their total lack of maintenance that really annoys me. There's been grafitti sprayed across Stadium's platform 3 for months. Rails are being improperly repaired and leaving noisy flat spots/requiring trains to slow down to avoid excessive noise. They held out on power rail replacement until the system was literally about to fall apart. The switches see a nightly greasing but that's about it and now they want to contract maintaining those out to a third party.

I'm not even going to touch any (if any) QA they've done on Main Street, given how half the window panels don't line up and I could care less about their humiliating controller breakdown where they had a replacement but incompatible board. How the hell can you manage to screw that up and still insist it was not your fault??

[GlassCity]

Originally Posted by Kisai

As I've said before. The only single line item that could be cut to get "250 million" in savings would be to cut the bus service in half. So think about how often you use the bus right now. I'll bring this up again:


So we could cut everyone's service in half, or we can eliminate the entirety of Vancouver/UBC, or the entirety of Burnaby+NewWest+SoF+NorthEast to get that kind of savings. When the Evergreen line starts up, you'll see a down-tick in bus service for sure, just like with Richmond and the Canada Line. Think about how much bus hours will be freed up by the Broadway line, and then think about how much it will cost to operate the proposed Surrey LRT.


You could mothball the Expo/Millenium Line and the WCE and not even get half of the 250 million. That's how efficient the Skytrain is, because most of it's capital costs have been paid off.

Yep, this is why I think the Brodway extension is so crucial. The amount of service that can be redistributed across the entire region would be huge. That's why I'm not happy about it only going to Arbutus; it wouldn't have the same effect. Now if you send it out all the way to UBC, you can reduce the 9 and then have a whole lot of buses from the 99 left over. You could even reduce many other east-west routes (49, 41, 33, 25, 84) if you wanted to.

Regardless, SkyTrain expansion doesn't only help those living in the catchment area, but for people all over the region as buses are redistributed.

[Sheba]

A police incident has Edmonds Station Bus Loop closed. Please board 106,112,116,129,C5,C7 service at the back of the station on Station Hill Drive at the cross walk.

[MIPS]

I've always wondered why since the beginning of time Edmonds had that ugly empty lot in front of it. It's the only thing you see from the main road and one of the first things you see when you leave the station. Is buddy waiting for the right moment to develop? A condo tower with street level shops might be somewhat nice in comparison.

[Sheba]

Originally Posted by MIPS

I've always wondered why since the beginning of time Edmonds had that ugly empty lot in front of it. It's the only thing you see from the main road and one of the first things you see when you leave the station. Is buddy waiting for the right moment to develop? A condo tower with street level shops might be somewhat nice in comparison.

BC Hydro owns it. They were going to expand and build on it, but nothing's happened. I wish they'd do something with it, even if it was just take down the fences so people could use it as a park like they do with the rest of the Hydro land there.

[memememe76]

Originally Posted by MIPS

I've always wondered why since the beginning of time Edmonds had that ugly empty lot in front of it. It's the only thing you see from the main road and one of the first things you see when you leave the station. Is buddy waiting for the right moment to develop? A condo tower with street level shops might be somewhat nice in comparison.

Maybe the people on Arbutus can have a new project?

[Mac Write]

How many bus routes would be eliminated and reduced with the UBC line? 99, 84, 43?

The 49 is needed for Langara so that can't be reduced. Hopefully UBC its self would get new bus routes so 90%+ of buildings would be less then 100m from a bus stop to help the disabled and people who can't walk a mile to class form the bus loop.

[deasine]

Originally Posted by Mac Write

How many bus routes would be eliminated and reduced with the UBC line? 99, 84, 43?

The 49 is needed for Langara so that can't be reduced. Hopefully UBC its self would get new bus routes so 90%+ of buildings would be less then 100m from a bus stop to help the disabled and people who can't walk a mile to class form the bus loop.

84 will probably be eliminated as potentially with the 44. The 43 serves a slightly different market of passengers as a lot of passengers are originating from South Vancouver as opposed to the SkyTrain at Joyce. I don't see conditions for the 49 will significantly improve: 49 also serves a very different market.

[Rico]

I know I don't need to tell people here that there are more than just operational benefits to a lot of these capital projects, but it is important to realize even for the best one (Broadway) the analysis was a net operational savings of 8 to 20 million a year (my memory is getting glitchy and can't remember which it is anymore without looking it up). That is good...and more than the 'waste' found by the CTF but still small compared to the overall needs.

[WarrenC12]

http://www.cknw.com/2015/02/19/65908/

Every little bit helps I suppose... if people set their hair on fire about a $500k salary, surely they'll love a $500k revenue bump.. right?

[st7860]

http://bc.ctvnews.ca/transit-cops-ask-for-5-5-per-cent-wage-hike-retroactive-pay-1.1655444

[CanSpice]

Originally Posted by st7860

http://bc.ctvnews.ca/transit-cops-ask-for-5-5-per-cent-wage-hike-retroactive-pay-1.1655444

That was from over a year ago.

[gkz]

There was originally an agreement between the City of Vancouver, Translink, and MoT to stop passenger vehicle traffic through Stanley Park and the Lions Gate bridge by 2030, after the construction of a third bridge across Burrard Inlet. However, there are no plans and no funding for the crossing and so the agreement will have to be rescinded.

How big of an affect would a Skytrain line to the North Shore have? Could it be a potential solution to the problem, rather than a new vehicle crossing, which seems unlikely to ever be built?