PHILADELPHIA | Highrise Development Thread IX

[Philly Fan]

Originally Posted by 1487

http://centercityphila.org/docs/CCR15_housing.pdf

this a document outlining residential development in and around center city. At least 3 projects discussed as "proposed" are already under construction. Almost 3700 units underway right now. Hopefully the market can bear all this new product.

Inquirer article about this:

Center City District: Housing boom continues

http://www.philly.com/philly/news/20150218_Center_City_District__Housing_boom_continues.html

[Frontst17]

This was a cool read from philly mag showing where we are compared to other cities revitalization efforts.

Judging by naked philly posts with all the new housing and empty lots being swallowed up it should be no surprise but the number is still staggering

http://www.phillymag.com/citified/2015/02/17/insane-surge-philadelphia-gentrification/

[Philly Kid]

"The millennials will get older and there's not a whole lot behind them," Levy said. "We've got to fix the basics."

The author of the article goes on to say the following: "Eventually, without significantly higher job creation and a schools system that is strong enough to convince young families with the means to move elsewhere that they should stay, housing demand will dry up, development will slow and Center City's ascendancy will stall out."

I'm hoping the city takes this seriously. Too much progress has been made in the past decade plus to have any kind of reversion.

[iheartphilly]

Originally Posted by Philly Kid

"The millennials will get older and there's not a whole lot behind them," Levy said. "We've got to fix the basics."

"Eventually, without significantly higher job creation and a schools system that is strong enough to convince young families with the means to move elsewhere that they should stay, housing demand will dry up, development will slow and Center City's ascendancy will stall out."

I'm hoping the city takes this seriously. Too much progress has been made in the past decade plus to have any kind of reversion.

If they can't fix the whole school system, then fix it incrementally and geographically. In this day and age, it's unbelieveable you cannot get a high quality education from K-12 without moving to the burbs. A partial solution is better than no solution. It also needs to be the priority of the next Mayor to solve the school problem with the right people in place willing to accept change and go against the status quo. Imagine if the word got out that Philly has a really good public school system and people actually wanted to raise and school their kids within Philly. This would attract and ensure a sustained and growth in population and a continued residential building boom.

[FiggyOlive]

W/Element now showing on SPG Hotel Directory, opening Jan. 1st, 2018.

http://www.starwoodhotels.com/preferredguest/directory/hotels/all/list.html?language=en_US

[1487]

Originally Posted by Philly Kid

"The millennials will get older and there's not a whole lot behind them," Levy said. "We've got to fix the basics."

The author of the article goes on to say the following: "Eventually, without significantly higher job creation and a schools system that is strong enough to convince young families with the means to move elsewhere that they should stay, housing demand will dry up, development will slow and Center City's ascendancy will stall out."

I'm hoping the city takes this seriously. Too much progress has been made in the past decade plus to have any kind of reversion.

CCD has an agenda and it presents facts in a way that supports its agenda. I don't buy the doom and gloom predictions at all. CCD (nor anyone else) can accurately predict what will happen in 5 years. The notion that all of these people are simply going to pull up stakes and move to the "superior" suburbs ignores many facts. Housing in suburban areas with "good" schools isn't cheap, many of these folks own one car or no car and they MUST have one car per adult in the suburbs and there are decent school options in and arount center city currently in spite of the PSD's overall position. It also must be noted that under the current system the mayor has limited power over the district. The structure of the SRC and the fact that the PSD gets about half its money from Harrisburg basically ensures that the state has a say in every major decision made by the PSD.

[PhiLaw]

http://www.phillymag.com/property/2015/02/17/divine-lorraine-will-reborn-just-hotel/

[cafeguy]

What are the chances Temple will actually make something that is urban and contributes to the north broad development process and neighborhood instead of just creating a large swath of dead zone?

http://www.newsworks.org/index.php/local...r-down-former-william-penn-high-building

[PhiLaw]

Originally Posted by cafeguy

What are the chances Temple will actually make something that is urban and contributes to the north broad development process and neighborhood instead of just creating a large swath of dead zone?

http://www.newsworks.org/index.php/local...r-down-former-william-penn-high-building

I don't understand this question. The dead zones up North Broad are the result of white flight/urban decay generally, and the Columbia Ave Riots more specifically and acutely. But for Temple, North broad and surroundings would be Fallujah.

[AbortedWalrus]

Originally Posted by cafeguy

What are the chances Temple will actually make something that is urban and contributes to the north broad development process and neighborhood instead of just creating a large swath of dead zone?

http://www.newsworks.org/index.php/local...r-down-former-william-penn-high-building

All of their developments have been pretty urban designs as far as I can tell. Their new tower meets the street and looks great from the sidewalk.

[Outta here]

Originally Posted by PhiLaw

I don't understand this question. The dead zones up North Broad are the result of white flight/urban decay generally, and the Columbia Ave Riots more specifically and acutely. But for Temple, North broad and surroundings would be Fallujah.

Forgive my ignorance on this issue but , was North Broad predominantly
white 55 years ago ??
Was the urban decay a result of " white flight " ?
Are you saying , 50 years after a senseless riot , there has been no incentives to regain a neighborhood .... for some senseless reason ??

[Insoluble]

Originally Posted by iheartphilly

If they can't fix the whole school system, then fix it incrementally and geographically.

This is already happening. Slowly but surely more and more public elementary schools near Center City are improving. As more affluent families chose to locate in the neighborhoods surrounding Center City, you see more investment in these schools. Everyone knows that Meredith, Greenfield, McCall, and Penn Alexander are good school options. But Slightly further out you have Nebinger and Chester A. Arther slowly making gains. I believe there's a school in the Passayunk Square area for which this is true as well, but don't recall the name. Don't be surprised if these schools in the next ring of neighborhoods out from Center City are performing much better.

Originally Posted by 1487

CCD has an agenda and it presents facts in a way that supports its agenda. I don't buy the doom and gloom predictions at all. CCD (nor anyone else) can accurately predict what will happen in 5 years. The notion that all of these people are simply going to pull up stakes and move to the "superior" suburbs ignores many facts. Housing in suburban areas with "good" schools isn't cheap, many of these folks own one car or no car and they MUST have one car per adult in the suburbs and there are decent school options in and arount center city currently in spite of the PSD's overall position. It also must be noted that under the current system the mayor has limited power over the district. The structure of the SRC and the fact that the PSD gets about half its money from Harrisburg basically ensures that the state has a say in every major decision made by the PSD.

^^^This. I love the CCD, but I don't pretend that they aren't heavily biased towards serving their own interests. And while the millennial generation is rather large, it still doesn't justify the statement "The millennials will get older and there's not a whole lot behind them," especially considering the next generation of early 20 somethings is just as likely to continue the trend for increased preference for urban living.

[cafeguy]

Originally Posted by PhiLaw

I don't understand this question. The dead zones up North Broad are the result of white flight/urban decay generally, and the Columbia Ave Riots more specifically and acutely. But for Temple, North broad and surroundings would be Fallujah.

Universities tend to create buildings that don't really "activate" a corridor with anything other than school related things. Take the CHOP building in graduate hospital that was going to be an isolated building until the neighborhood suggested certain tweaks and adjustments.

North broad between city hall and temple is pockmarked with block-long dead zones all about, this being one of them. Although they are looking to build a job training component in it, my question is if anyone might know or have inside info on whether they would make this a building which would activate the corridor more...ie, retail, housing, etc etc.

[iheartphilly]

Possible 30th St Station Upgrades:

http://www.bizjournals.com/philadelphia/...rades-to-30th-street-station.html?page=2

Besides bathrooms and retail stores, any ideas of what other upgrades to improve the interior of this station? Also, where will funding come from?

Just wandering if this is a realistic goal for Amtrak?

[ScreamShatter]

Originally Posted by cafeguy

What are the chances Temple will actually make something that is urban and contributes to the north broad development process and neighborhood instead of just creating a large swath of dead zone?

http://www.newsworks.org/index.php/local...r-down-former-william-penn-high-building

This space is going to be used to relocate athletic fields from Ambler campus. So no big time urban development in this location...

[cafeguy]

Originally Posted by ScreamShatter

This space is going to be used to relocate athletic fields from Ambler campus. So no big time urban development in this location...

But the article says "no football", implying something other than fields.

[ScreamShatter]

Originally Posted by cafeguy

But the article says "no football", implying something other than fields.

This isn’t a football stadium. It’s for Softball, Soccer, Field Hockey, etc. It’s going to be Temple’s version of Penn Park.

[PhiLaw]

Originally Posted by Outta here

Forgive my ignorance on this issue but , was North Broad predominantly
white 55 years ago ??
Was the urban decay a result of " white flight " ?
Are you saying , 50 years after a senseless riot , there has been no incentives to regain a neighborhood .... for some senseless reason ??

North Broad was predominantly white until the mid/late 60s. It had a very large black population, but a plurality of whites. Ridge Avenue and C.B. Moore Avenue (formerly Columbia Ave) were rife with Jewish, Irish, German and Black-owned small businesses. Further east was a small red-light district. The Columbia Ave riots accelerated the macro-demographic movement out of the city.

I do agree re Temple to the extent they continue to build off-grid. But they are a god-send for North Broad. All of the developments you see today would be a tough sell from a financing perspective without the presence of Temple.

[josef]

Originally Posted by Philly Kid

"The millennials will get older and there's not a whole lot behind them," Levy said. "We've got to fix the basics."

The author of the article goes on to say the following: "Eventually, without significantly higher job creation and a schools system that is strong enough to convince young families with the means to move elsewhere that they should stay, housing demand will dry up, development will slow and Center City's ascendancy will stall out."

I'm hoping the city takes this seriously. Too much progress has been made in the past decade plus to have any kind of reversion.

Nothing's behind millennials except the next... generation... of humans...

Seriously, this is some weird reporting. While I understand the sentiment, it lacks a global view. If one generation moves out but is replaced by the next group of young people coming in, then you've built a successful place.

My case in point is thus: who in their right minds thinks that every young person who lives in Boston while in school up there stays in the city? If they all stayed in the city, the population would be like, 12 million. Some of them stay, but many of them do not; they move out to a more affordable suburb outside the immediate city area (Watertown, Waltham, Newton, or even further out; remember, Boston is extremely expensive), while a new cohort of young people move in. It's the circle of life in a successful place. Those who love the city and can afford to live there do, and people who want to be connected to the city but on its periphery do that instead. And honestly, those who love Philly and are committed to it will stay, and the half-hearted will leave no matter how good the schools are, because that's not 100% of life (especially if your world view extends beyond the heterosexual, nuclear family model).

Of course the schools have to get better, but this is a function of so many more things than just an elected official or two pushing a "make schools better" button. You can't "make the schools better" until you make the city better as a whole, and we're just starting to do that.

[PhiLaw]

Originally Posted by josef

Nothing's behind millennials except the next... generation... of humans...

Seriously, this is some weird reporting. While I understand the sentiment, it lacks a global view. If one generation moves out but is replaced by the next group of young people coming in, then you've built a successful place.

My case in point is thus: who in their right minds thinks that every young person who lives in Boston while in school up there stays in the city? If they all stayed in the city, the population would be like, 12 million. Some of them stay, but many of them do not; they move out to a more affordable suburb outside the immediate city area (Watertown, Waltham, Newton, or even further out; remember, Boston is extremely expensive), while a new cohort of young people move in. It's the circle of life in a successful place. Those who love the city and can afford to live there do, and people who want to be connected to the city but on its periphery do that instead. And honestly, those who love Philly and are committed to it will stay, and the half-hearted will leave no matter how good the schools are, because that's not 100% of life (especially if your world view extends beyond the heterosexual, nuclear family model).

Of course the schools have to get better, but this is a function of so many more things than just an elected official or two pushing a "make schools better" button. You can't "make the schools better" until you make the city better as a whole, and we're just starting to do that.

Agreed. But let me add. The problem with the Philadelphia public school system is a pipeline problem. You can't "make the schools better" until you make its people better, in the aggregate. We are currently infilling the city's row homes, apartment and condos with a lot of people who take a different approach to parenting and education than some of the existing residence. This is truly how you change the public school system. Unfortunately, money, teachers and other structural changes will only marginally make a difference. The silver bullet is the residence themselves.