The Great Canadian Transit Thread

[Beedok]

Originally Posted by ssiguy

Funding 100% of Hamilton's LRT is patently unfair.

Why should LRT in GTHA get built free and grata from the province while Kitchener and Ottawa have to fork over local money for their own systems?

Hamilton is semi-bankrupt and the GTA is seriously over-congested thus harming the Province's tax base? (That's not a sarcasm question, its an honest one.) I do think Ottawa needs more funding, congestion has to be hurting the Province's coppers there too, but I'm not sure what KWC's congestion levels are like.

[Innsertnamehere]

I get the feeling Wynne is going to go on a bit of a spend thrift and give 100% funding to Ottawa for phase 2, kitchener phase 2, london BRT, etc.

[1overcosc]

Originally Posted by Innsertnamehere

I get the feeling Wynne is going to go on a bit of a spend thrift and give 100% funding to Ottawa for phase 2, kitchener phase 2, london BRT, etc.

There's certainly enough money in the $14B non-GTHA pot to do so.

[lrt's friend]

Originally Posted by 1overcosc

The Confederation Line's capacity is so high that we're not going to run into problems there. Nobody's going to be turned away from Confederation Line trains because they're overloaded, even as far in as Bayview. On opening day (20tph + 96m trains yielding a capacity of 12,000pphpd) even on the busiest trip of the day at the busiest point on the line the train will still only be 90% full. Not to mention capacity can be increased from 12,000 to 18,000 by increasing to 30tph, which can be done with no capital work as the system can grow to 30tph out of the box. After that capacity can be increased to 22,000 by lengthening the platforms to 120m (which are roughed in already, so very minimal work to do), and further increased to 30,000 by installing ATC allowing an increase to 40tph (also roughed in).

To summarize the numbers, ridership on the Confederation Line would have to literally triple from the 2018 start numbers, before people would start being turned away at Bayview because of full trains.

It will be a very long time, until at least 2050, before Bayview starts to have the crush load problems that Bloor-Yonge has.

I am sure there is enough capacity on the line but will they actually buy enough trains? I remember when Edmonton opened their extension and they were begging people to change their schedules. And it is not as if you can quickly order more trains. The economics of trains almost demand crush loading them.

[ssiguy]

Originally Posted by Beedok

Hamilton is semi-bankrupt and the GTA is seriously over-congested thus harming the Province's tax base? (That's not a sarcasm question, its an honest one.) I do think Ottawa needs more funding, congestion has to be hurting the Province's coppers there too, but I'm not sure what KWC's congestion levels are like.

That's hardly the point.

Is one taxpayer somehow more important than another?

If you want to go by congestion, London has them all beat. No city in the country under 1 million has London's traffic woes, it's not even a competition. This decision is made worse by the fact that London has higher real transit ridership and much higher per-capita ridership than Hamilton {or Miss for that matter}. Ham and Kit are also getting GO rail upgrades free of charge.

This really makes a mockery of equality for all Ontarians and reinforces {and correctly so} that Wynne and company are completely preoccupied with the GTHA over the rest of the province. These kinds of decisions make the divide between GTHA and the rest of the province even more pronounced.

The people of Ott/Kit/Lon have a right to be furious.

[Beedok]

Originally Posted by ssiguy

That's hardly the point.

Is one taxpayer somehow more important than another?

If you want to go by congestion, London has them all beat. No city in the country under 1 million has London's traffic woes, it's not even a competition. This decision is made worse by the fact that London has higher real transit ridership and much higher per-capita ridership than Hamilton {or Miss for that matter}. Ham and Kit are also getting GO rail upgrades free of charge.

This really makes a mockery of equality for all Ontarians and reinforces {and correctly so} that Wynne and company are completely preoccupied with the GTHA over the rest of the province. These kinds of decisions make the divide between GTHA and the rest of the province even more pronounced.

The people of Ott/Kit/Lon have a right to be furious.

It's not about tax payers, it's about businesses. Large companies exist or can be drawn to the large urban area of the GTHA which would simply ignore smaller cities. While there is definitely some efforts to win cheep votes from the high density of the region giving Hamilton free stuff would prove that they're not just about votes because Hamilton's about as safely NDP as is possible in Ontario. A dense urban area of 6+ million people with good transit attracts large companies and whatnot that mean more money for Ontario. If it were about favouritism of voters then Kingston, Ottawa, and Kitchener would get money decades before anyone thought about Hamilton.

[GreaterMontréal]

The LRT project will be at surface level. on Peel or on R-B boul.

[begratto]

Originally Posted by GreaterMontréal

The LRT project will be at surface level. on Peel or on R-B boul.

Where/when was this announced?

[1overcosc]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

I am sure there is enough capacity on the line but will they actually buy enough trains? I remember when Edmonton opened their extension and they were begging people to change their schedules. And it is not as if you can quickly order more trains. The economics of trains almost demand crush loading them.

Ottawa bought enough trains (including necessary spares) in the Phase 1 contract for 2min headways.

[GreatTallNorth2]

Well, for the first time in London, there is starting to be talk about Light Rail Transit as an option for the city. For the past several years, it has all been talk about BRT, but now they are using the phrase "rapid transit" instead. It could end up being BRT, LRT or a mix of both.

Our new mayor today announced Shift London (shiftlondon.ca) as a collaboration between the city and citizens to focus on rapid transit. He is saying shovels will be in the ground in 4 years or less.

http://www.lfpress.com/2015/01/27/london-mayor-matt-brown-announces-beginning-of-lrt-plan

[manny_santos]

London Mayor Matt Brown spoke this morning about his vision for London's mass transit system, and he's hoping Queen's Park contributes a third of the cost.

[MolsonExport]

LRT in London would be the greatest thing since....well, the greatest thing ever to happen in London. By far.

[Nouvellecosse]

I didn't realise London had such bad traffic. Sounds like a pretty busy place!

[MolsonExport]

The city expanded, but the arterials never did. Half the major roads end abruptly right in the heart of the city (partly due to the River, but also to NIMBYism). This, plus an absence of freeways (except the 401/402 on the Southern fringe) pushes traffic onto a handful of throughways that are woefully inadequate and also, due double/triple duty as commercial strips (and/or residential corridors, in addition to through traffic/commuting). And the bus system uses this crappy infrastructure, made even more wretched by stopping at every opportunity and a lack of bus bays on the major roads (thus getting boxed in by cars/trucks, and halting almost everything in the lane behind...a typical London arterial [e.g., Richmond st.] may have a bus blocking the right lane while picking up passengers whereas the left lane is blocked by some shithead that wants to make a left-hand turn into a driveway...traffic stops).

[Nouvellecosse]

I wonder if there's a suitable corridor for an LRT to have a right of way. Not sure a mixed traffic "streetcar style" LRT would help much...

[GreaterMontréal]

Originally Posted by begratto

Where/when was this announced?

Radio Canada Téléjournal

[le calmar]

Originally Posted by GreaterMontréal

The LRT project will be at surface level. on Peel or on R-B boul.

The LRT will run on a East-West axis, so how can Peel be an option?

[SkahHigh]

Originally Posted by le calmar

The LRT will run on a East-West axis, so how can Peel be an option?

Well to enter Downtown from Brossard it has to come from the South...

[le calmar]

Damn, yes it makes sense, I thought we were talking about the other LRT project here.

[eemy]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

LRT in London would be the greatest thing since....well, the greatest thing ever to happen in London. By far.

I think it would be great if London got LRT, but in the interim, from what you've said, it sounds like some sort of express bus system might be worth looking into. It requires minimal expenditures but greatly improves service quality (imo anyway) and can help transition the transit system into one that is centred on an LRT corridor before the corridor is ever in place. I know that here in KW a lot of intensification had already occurred along the LRT corridor before construction even started on it and I think it's in part due to things like the iXpress and planning changes were set in place ages ago already.