The Great Canadian Transit Thread

[Nouvellecosse]

Wouldn't SmartTrack serve a similar route to the DRL and be able to help with relieving the Bloor-Yonge choke point?

[SkahHigh]

I'm curious, what opinion do you guys have of SmartTrack? I find it to be a really interesting project.

[matt602]

Originally Posted by SkahHigh

I'm curious, what opinion do you guys have of SmartTrack? I find it to be a really interesting project.

I don't think it will do anything to address the congestion on the Yonge line downtown like the DRL would, but at this point I'm a fan of anything in Toronto that actually gets built.

[MalcolmTucker]

I always thought the east Danforth line should be diverted into the DRL, to force people to transfer if they want to take the more congested route.

Has any detailed modeling been done, or would that be at a later phase?

[SteelTown]

Mississauga has no money to pay for planned $1.6-billion LRT

http://www.mississauga.com/news-story/52...oney-to-pay-for-planned-1-6-billion-lrt/

Mississauga’s mayor and city manager made a stunning admission Wednesday, stating that a planned $1.6-billion LRT along the city’s main thoroughfare is likely to be cancelled if the province can’t pay the full cost.

“I think there would be a very serious review of the feasibility of that project, from our perspective,” city manager Janice Baker said after Wednesday’s council meeting when asked why no money was being set aside for the project in the city’s 2015 budget, currently being presented to council.

If the province decides Mississauga must pay for even one-third of the cost, a common model, “I would say as the city manager my recommendation to city council would be that the impact of that on the property tax payer would be so onerous as to be impossible,” Baker said.

Mayor Bonnie Crombie said that “at the very least, it would be significantly delayed.” If the LRT isn’t 100 per cent externally funded, “There would be a very serious discussion with our council on if we want to proceed with it.”

[1overcosc]

Sounds to me like prostrating to get the province to pay 100%. The province should say screw it, and offer two-thirds, Mississauga can either take it or leave it.

We need consistency with the $29B transit fund. Province can't be paying full cost of some projects and only a third of others.

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by 1overcosc

Sounds to me like prostrating to get the province to pay 100%. The province should say screw it, and offer two-thirds, Mississauga can either take it or leave it.

We need consistency with the $29B transit fund. Province can't be paying full cost of some projects and only a third of others.

Damn right! Ottawa (or any city outside the GTA) could never pull something like that.

[Beedok]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

Damn right! Ottawa (or any city outside the GTA) could never pull something like that.

Hamilton has been attempting to because it sees the GTA doing it. (Doesn't seem to be having much luck though.)

[1overcosc]

If Wynne announces that the province is funding $1.2B of the Hurontario-Main LRT, with the remaining $400M to come from Mississauga & Brampton, and that the project requires that $400M to continue, the political price for delaying or cancelling will be paid by Crombie. This could backfire horribly for her.

Wynne could theoretically 'force' Mississauga/Brampton to pay for it by instituting a provincial property tax in the two cities and raising $400M from it, but that would be horrible optics.

[lrt's friend]

The provincial double standard we are seeing here, when they knowingly paid less than 1/3 for Phase 1 of the Confederation Line in Ottawa. Why should Mississauga and Brampton get 100%?

[MalcolmTucker]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

The provincial double standard we are seeing here, when they knowingly paid less than 1/3 for Phase 1 of the Confederation Line in Ottawa. Why should Mississauga and Brampton get 100%?

Well, because Ottawa vastly expanded and changed the scope of the project, leaving the original 2/3rds budget as 1/3rd no? When Toronto changes the scope on its projects the provincial envelope haven't changed iirc.

[Beedok]

Ottawa tends to get more federal money as well doesn't it?

[MalcolmTucker]

Originally Posted by Beedok

Ottawa tends to get more federal money as well doesn't it?

Not as of late. But the way federal dollars flow is rather complicated, so it can seem inequitable in certain years even when the allocations over the long term works out to a near identical per-capita contribution.

[Innsertnamehere]

the 2/3rds part is likely because Ottawa isn't ponying up nearly as much money as the province is. Ottawa likely won't factor into all projects, only some, as QP is going to be giving out more money than the feds.

[miketoronto]

Mississauga is acting like this, because they have serious financial issues they will be facing in the coming years. This is from decades of trying to keep taxes low, and now they are facing massive infrastructure renewals and large tax increases.

[niwell]

^Specifically non-residential taxes. Mississauga was able to lure so much employment from the inner-suburbs of Toronto with lower commercial tax rates and finance everything with development charges. Now they are basically out of greenfield land. Good luck to them - commercial taxes will be a bitch to change at this point.

[wg_flamip]

Originally Posted by 1overcosc

If Wynne announces that the province is funding $1.2B of the Hurontario-Main LRT, with the remaining $400M to come from Mississauga & Brampton, and that the project requires that $400M to continue, the political price for delaying or cancelling will be paid by Crombie. This could backfire horribly for her.

I'm not sure it will. I'm not so sure the majority of Mississauga residents even know that this project is in the pipeline, or that the majority of those who do really care all that much about it going forward.

[caltrane74]

The province could pay for the entire project scaled back by about 30% of its length.

A portion in MCC and a portion in Brampton CC. When the city's come up with the cash, they could pay to connect the two lines down the road.

[1overcosc]

Originally Posted by caltrane74

The province could pay for the entire project scaled back by about 30% of its length.

A portion in MCC and a portion in Brampton CC. When the city's come up with the cash, they could pay to connect the two lines down the road.

Given that Brampton is throwing hissy fits about the alignment, an option that has been discussed by many is truncating the line to Mississauga only as a first step.

[1overcosc]

Originally Posted by wg_flamip

I'm not sure it will. I'm not so sure the majority of Mississauga residents even know that this project is in the pipeline, or that the majority of those who do really care all that much about it going forward.

Huh. Big contrast to Ottawa then. Here in Ottawa everyone knows about the Confederation Line and almost everyone is giddy about it. When politicians propose to cancel or downscale it, we lash out in fury against them. The Ontario PC Party and mayoral candidate Mike Maguire both learned this the hard way.

Last civic poll I saw said that 76% of Ottawans felt the Confederation Line was a very important civic project.