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  #1941  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2014, 6:03 PM
awholeparade awholeparade is offline
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Am I the only one who buys shampoo, toilet paper, toothpaste, etc. at the grocery store?! I have a car, but I would never even consider driving all the way to a Target (I live in Capitol Hill) for those things. I'm a single guy, not buying quantities for a family, so maybe that's the difference? Basic socks and underwear? I go to H&M or TJ Maxx, both downtown, and I ride my bike or walk there. Again, this is probably easier for me as a single guy, but I'm really not sure why I'm supposed to feel the need to go to Target.
     
     
  #1942  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2014, 6:35 PM
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No I buy those items at a co-op. Or wherever is cheap. The appeal of a Target probably stems from 1. a greater variety of options for the same thing and 2. the ability to pick up an item that might not be available at a similar store, I.e. one stop shopping.

I can get socks at Ross or Target. If I just need socks, I'll go wherever is cheap. If I need socks and a trashcan, now I need to go to Ross and Office Depot. Or I could go to Target.

Any event, someone fix Denver.gov so we can argue about something more concrete.
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  #1943  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2014, 6:56 PM
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Continuum 9th + Colorado

Let me know if that works.
     
     
  #1944  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2014, 7:04 PM
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Ty Ty kind sir
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  #1945  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2014, 7:15 PM
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Continuum 9th + Colorado

Let me know if that works.
Thanks for providing that. How do you link to an attachment on SIRE so it doesn't end up broken? Is there a permalink option?
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  #1946  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2014, 7:56 PM
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Continuum 9th + Colorado

Let me know if that works.
Broken again....
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  #1947  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2014, 8:16 PM
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  #1948  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2014, 8:30 PM
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"Whoops! There was a problem previewing the document."
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  #1949  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2014, 8:45 PM
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For shame. You should really be doing all that at Whole Foods.
ok, we get it. You and Bunt think Whole Foods is only for rich people. As with many things in life, you get what you pay for. That's fine: you don't have to like it and you don't have to shop there, but it is an amazing grocery store and it has a remarkable effect on property values and attracting other retailers. If other people in Union Station share your sentiment, they can easily shop at KS instead.

You and Bunt take everything you do not agree with and go "whole hog" on it with some ridiculous statement. Case in point: the toilet paper argument. A person can buy regular, unbleached, extra cushy, double-ply Charmin toilet paper at King Soopers. Plenty of people do. Target and Walmart are not the only retailers who sell Toiler paper. Many things you can get at Target you can also get at King Soopers.


Did car2go and Uber exist when you lived downtown? Between those 2, walking and biking, and the car my wife and share, we have many modes to choose from. Car2go in particular has really changed the way people view car ownership in Denver. Denver is also one of the most ride-share friendly cities in the country. Were there grocery stores when you lived downtown?
     
     
  #1950  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2014, 8:49 PM
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"Whoops! There was a problem previewing the document."
Well then it's just not meant to be. Learn how to use SIRE!
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  #1951  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2014, 9:04 PM
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No I buy those items at a co-op. Or wherever is cheap. The appeal of a Target probably stems from 1. a greater variety of options for the same thing and 2. the ability to pick up an item that might not be available at a similar store, I.e. one stop shopping.

I can get socks at Ross or Target. If I just need socks, I'll go wherever is cheap. If I need socks and a trashcan, now I need to go to Ross and Office Depot. Or I could go to Target.

Any event, someone fix Denver.gov so we can argue about something more concrete.
I'd love to see a Costco end up somewhere downtown so you can buy one large skid of toilet paper and be done with it for the year. I routinely drop several hundred bucks every time I visit the one in Aurora - even though my only intention is to get some bulk fruits/veggies. It's amazing how many things your realize you "need" once you're in that store. I would think they'd fit nicely in along Brighton Blvd somewhere.

Speaking of retail; do people realize that Cherry Creek has increased their sales tax substantially within the last month? I think it's up to 13% now..

That's insane..
     
     
  #1952  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2014, 9:05 PM
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I've read or heard on several occasions developers say (proudly) that they are doing X multi-family project with fewer parking spaces than required. I don't recall which ones exactly, but I've definitely heard this several times.

let's hope this results in some natural price reduction....certainly should.
     
     
  #1953  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2014, 9:08 PM
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From the PDF:

9th + Colorado

     
     
  #1954  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2014, 9:14 PM
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  #1955  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2014, 9:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Stonemans_rowJ View Post
ok, we get it. You and Bunt think Whole Foods is only for rich people. As with many things in life, you get what you pay for. That's fine: you don't have to like it and you don't have to shop there, but it is an amazing grocery store and it has a remarkable effect on property values and attracting other retailers. If other people in Union Station share your sentiment, they can easily shop at KS instead.
It's absolutely an amazing grocery store with some excellent products that I go to regularly. I also recognize that it pulls in people from a far larger footprint than a King Soopers does along with serving as a catalyst for additional retail development. The King Soopers that's going in at Union Station is targeted at the population in a smaller radius than the Whole Foods but will serve the role of providing a place to pick up everyday goods, have a prescription filled, buy some cigarettes, pick up a transit pass book, etc. That Whole Foods will be pull from as far away as Berkeley and will make bank, especially off of the Highlands crowd- though I'm fairly sure that all of those people will be driving to Whole Foods.

Quote:
You and Bunt take everything you do not agree with and go "whole hog" on it with some ridiculous statement. Case in point: the toilet paper argument. A person can buy regular, unbleached, extra cushy, double-ply Charmin toilet paper at King Soopers. Plenty of people do. Target and Walmart are not the only retailers who sell Toiler paper. Many things you can get at Target you can also get at King Soopers.
What, you dare accuse me of employing inflammatory rhetoric to argue that while car-free living is possible DT, it's certainly not the utopia that some people are suggesting? You, sir, have offended me to the core! I demand the chance to address this offense via pistols at dawn.

People can always buy extra cushy, double-ply toiler paper at the grocery store. I do. Now I don't buy that overpriced feel-good hippie crap toilet paper from Whole Foods, but that's a preference and reflective of my price sensitivity when it comes to substitute goods. The argument for the retail situation DT seems to boil down to some of us arguing that the retail scene in DT is inadequate for 24-hour city with a distinctive lack of consumer choice (such as you would find in any retail district in the suburbs) and other's arguing that it's enough to make a car-free life possible. But this is merely rehashed from a couple years ago when it was argued that the Vitamin Cottage was enough of a grocery store to make a car-free life possible. No rational person would agree. There's also the employment argument, though that's outside this current discussion (but I would still like to get a rough idea of how many people reverse commute of of DT).

Quote:
Did car2go and Uber exist when you lived downtown? Between those 2, walking and biking, and the car my wife and share, we have many modes to choose from. Car2go in particular has really changed the way people view car ownership in Denver. Denver is also one of the most ride-share friendly cities in the country. Were there grocery stores when you lived downtown?
No they did not, unlike you late-comers, I was a "true" urban pioneer that did the one-car lifestyle before it was cool and trendy, it also shows my highly advanced age. These consumer products have made car-free urban living more realistic for Denver, but I still argue that they are not the preferred substitute for additional retail choices in downtown which are vital to making the car-free lifestyle option a viability along with increased transit options.
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  #1956  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2014, 9:22 PM
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I'd love to see a Costco end up somewhere downtown so you can buy one large skid of toilet paper and be done with it for the year. I routinely drop several hundred bucks every time I visit the one in Aurora - even though my only intention is to get some bulk fruits/veggies. It's amazing how many things your realize you "need" once you're in that store. I would think they'd fit nicely in along Brighton Blvd somewhere.

Speaking of retail; do people realize that Cherry Creek has increased their sales tax substantially within the last month? I think it's up to 13% now..

That's insane..
I think that the first Costco in Denver, it's shocking that one isn't here yet, will end up at Stapleton given that it's one of the only places left in the city where a large-format retailer the size of Costco can fit without having to get creative with the layout.
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Last edited by wong21fr; Nov 19, 2014 at 9:33 PM.
     
     
  #1957  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2014, 9:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Fritzdude View Post
I'd love to see a Costco end up somewhere downtown so you can buy one large skid of toilet paper and be done with it for the year. I routinely drop several hundred bucks every time I visit the one in Aurora - even though my only intention is to get some bulk fruits/veggies. It's amazing how many things your realize you "need" once you're in that store. I would think they'd fit nicely in along Brighton Blvd somewhere.

Speaking of retail; do people realize that Cherry Creek has increased their sales tax substantially within the last month? I think it's up to 13% now..

That's insane..
Cherry Creek sales tax revenue is up 13% from last year, but I'm pretty sure their sales tax rate is still 7.6%.
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  #1958  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2014, 10:36 PM
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Wong, that was funny. Seriously, I got a good chuckle out of that.

Living car-free is most definitely not a utopia. The people I know do it either for cost-saving or environmental reasons, or a combination of the two. Living with 1 car per household is more doable, and entirely reasonable for people downtown if they do not have 2 jobs that require driving.

Let's not underestimate the increasing trend of having things delivered, especially in urban areas. We're not just talking J Crew mailorder here. Liquor, milk, produce, groceries, coffee makers, socks What doesn't amazon sell? Amazon prime is free 2 day shipping. Here's an example, I needed a new water filter for my Samsung fridge. The only place that I have found them is Lowe's. I used to once a year drive to Lowe's in Lakewood since the Lowe's off of Alameda in Denver closed. I would buy 2 water filters at like $50 apiece and be good for a year. This time, I ordered two from amazon for about $35 each, free 2 day shipping, no more than 2 minutes out of my day. That my friend is the wave of the future. Just look at Lowe's and Home Depot: they themselves have set up expensive web stores. The web sales side of most retail business has been the sector that has grown, usually at some expense to the brick and mortar. This will enable more city residents to have items at their fingertips quickly, even if Union Station never has a home improvement store. These services are not a "preferred substitute" for retail, they will ultimately work in conjunction with brick and mortar stores in downtown.

With that being said, more and more retail is, in fact, coming to downtown which will provide even more of the multitude of products that we would desire and/or require. Realistically Denver is not big enough to support many of the retailers having two locations, and frankly, Cherry Creek is a great location from a business standpoint and is well established. When the need arises, a downtown resident can easily get to CC to go shopping, whether it be by car, bike, bus, etc. It was only a mere 4 years ago that the whole Union Station buildout was just starting and look at it now. We are not pining for some utopian car-free city 20 years from now. The infrastructure for a great downtown is being laid as we speak, and with it will surely come more retail. As you admitted yourself, just since you lived downtown, Denver has added car share, bike share, and ride share.

Car-free living in Denver? I am not sure anyone is really saying that is realistic for more than the niche group of hardcore people. Having to use a car for the majority of your daily needs living downtown? No, I don't think so.

Last edited by Stonemans_rowJ; Nov 19, 2014 at 11:37 PM. Reason: grammar
     
     
  #1959  
Old Posted Nov 20, 2014, 1:37 AM
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I was car free in Denver all the way up to 1994 when I left. It was a serious pain in the ass. The only way that made it worth the effort was that a bus pass was only $24 then and parking alone at the hotel I worked at was $100/month.
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  #1960  
Old Posted Nov 20, 2014, 6:15 AM
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Major projects spreadsheet finally updated. Of note:

2099 Chestnut - 2014D00258 - 5-story Office/restaurant
C-MX-12
Mixed-Use
Greg Savage

2475 W 26th Ave - 2014D00179 - new 12 story mixed use
C-MX-12
Mixed-Use
Doug Jones *** This is right across the street from La Loma Mexican Restaurant

Apartments @ 7th & Grant - 2014D00306 - Mixed Use: Retail; Multi-family dwelling
C-MX-8
Mixed-Use
Steve Olive

California Tower - 2014D00334- 622 16th St Mixed Use: Office; Lodging Accomm
D-C
Mixed-Use
Steve Oliver **** This was posted before

Cardona Townhomes - 2014D00338 - Arkings Court 23 units, 5 buildings
C-MX-12
Muti-Family Residential
Greg Savage

Lumberyards Apartments - 2014D00461 - 1805 S Bannock
C-MX-8
Multifamily
Olga Mikhailova
     
     
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