Post some pictures of your city! II

[TorontoDrew]

Originally Posted by rousseau

I'm divided on it too. Cityplace looks intriguing, but I have trouble getting past the fake organic look that large developments normally end up with.

And this, this looks like Zeus rammed a large plastic clothes pin in between those two buildings.

I actually went to a Christmas party in that sky bridge and it's pretty cool inside I must admit.

[MonkeyRonin]

Its all in your head by tomms, on Flickr


My Favourite DeSoto by Michael Mitchener, on Flickr


Gerrard Street East - Flying Pony by William Self, on Flickr


Constant Condos by nickkernick, on Flickr


Rainbow LEDs in the Village by nickkernick, on Flickr


Busy Dundas Street by nickkernick, on Flickr


Spadina with Global Rainbow by nickkernick, on Flickr


Car Light Streaking @ Bloor and Church by nickkernick, on Flickr


Yonge Street during Toronto Buskerfest by nickkernick, on Flickr


Toronto Buskerfest 2014 by nickkernick, on Flickr


looking to the west by @416Shots, on Flickr


Nightlife by JoshuaKG, on Flickr


streetcars. by Antoine Demé, on Flickr


white.elephant by jonathancastellino, on Flickr


https://www.flickr.com/photos/44304877@N00/15742096451/


Condivergence by StephenCaissiePhoto, on Flickr


314/365 by Yewbert The Omnipotent, on Flickr


Sunny November day by GBaker63, on Flickr


https://www.flickr.com/photos/lunati...e/10041979203/


Untitled by William Self, on Flickr


The City by Ben Roffelsen Photography, on Flickr

[SignalHillHiker]

Originally Posted by rousseau

This is awesome. You've got the total SignalHllHiker package here.

Unknown St. John's person who turns out to be a world famous leader in something? Check.
Claim that St. John's shares fundamental traits in common with a major city, this time New York? Check.
Preening put-down of Toronto, this time for not offering an "enriching quality of life"? Check.

Does the Toronto angst have legs, I wonder? Because it seems like your years-long rumination on each and every exquisite detail of how dreadful Winnipeg was for you is now finally over. Perhaps even you found it to be over the top after a while?

I can only imagine a conversation with you:

Hi! A visitor to St. John's! So, do you like it here? Yeah? Oh, what's that you say? You like it better than Toronto?

Ho ho ho, hee hee hee...you don't say! What's that, you think people here are friendlier than people in Toronto? Ha ha...tell me more! This is going to make a terrific SSP post!

Oops, did I just say that out loud? Never mind, it was nothing. Anyway, aren't we all just so quaint and charming here? What's that you say? More so than in Toronto?

Hah hah...you make me so happy!

Fair enough, but...

You see, this is exactly the sort of the thing that I'd never expect from NYC.

He is very well-known - perhaps not outside the theatre community, but he gets top billing everywhere he goes on the mainland as well, from Stratford to the National Arts Centre in Ottawa. And he just got back from a tour of Italy, Austria, Germany, and France.

Of course it makes me happy. Given my views, it's always wonderfully encouraging when someone with no particular interest in doing so believes we have more in common with New England and surrounding states than Central Canada. Especially when the alternative is... this.

It's the same when Giles Coren came and said our accents were Irish and we were so close to Ireland in every way we're practically joined. That's much more flattering than how we're typically viewed and described by Canadians. So it makes me happy. It's validating. And, yes, the fact he was horrified by Toronto's fashion sense and thought it the worst-dressed place he's ever been does make the compliment a little sweeter.

In a city this small, one doesn't often compete directly with the big boys in anything - it's just a given. So when people from the big boys, or who've made it big and live abroad, find things they love more about here, it's lovely. Especially when that's not the norm.

Take this headline from the Huffington Post yesterday. Great way to frame what is actually a story about economic power in Canada shifting to the West. The headline is intended to be shocking or possibly shameful to Torontonians, but get a nod and a wink from us (and, to a lesser extent, the rest of the federation). It's just the way things work.



That's not the way the conversation went, by the way, as you've described - I'm not a caricature. It was just one small part of a long conversation - and I even stood up for Toronto and said it's not really my cup of tea either but it's big and varied enough that I'm sure everyone can find a niche and have a great life. But it's the part that I loved most.

But I do always ask visitors I meet what they think of it here, which restaurants they've been to, and if they've been out clubbing. They never mind, and I know the place well enough to provide any recommendations they may request.

And, as for Winnipeg... it's clear to me now I was genuinely depressed living there, clinically. I really should've sought help. It took months to heal, and once I started feeling emotions again, they were limited to anger and hatefulness. I even had a couple of hissy fits about hating it here, I was still that far gone from myself. Dropped my keys once walking Fort Amherst with jeddy1989 and was ready to pack up and move to Toronto. I spent those months on SSP. I don't have that baggage anymore now so it just doesn't come up. And it's been long enough now that it's easier to just remember the things I liked.

[SignalHillHiker]

A few quick and dirty mobile pics in the West End. I had to go to the mall. I hate it out there, or anywhere outside Empire Avenue to be honest.

Prince Phillip Drive through Memorial University's main campus. One of these skywalks has the cafeteria and restaurants in it. I love big skywalks like that.



The Village Mall off Topsail Road is at such a high elevation that it has the same type of sunset as the prairies - red on one side, blue on the other. Don't often see that here. Usually one side is just black. Also, yes, this mall is so bad that Dollarama is kind of an anchor tenant. I think Rossy is the other. Still a few decent stores inside, though, but it's known as skeet headquarters.



And the new Waterford Valley High School, which will replace a couple of the smaller, more run-down schools at the western edge of the downtown.

[Gerrard]

Originally Posted by SignalHillHiker

Fair enough, but...

You see, this is exactly the sort of the thing that I'd never expect from NYC.

Except he's not from Toronto. Albeit as a Torontonian it was one of the most well thought out putdowns I've seen on this forum.

Originally Posted by SignalHillHiker

Of course it makes me happy. Given my views, it's always wonderfully encouraging when someone with no particular interest in doing so believes we have more in common with New England and surrounding states than Central Canada. Especially when the alternative is... this.

What alternative? You're the one constantly throwing shade at Toronto when it truly doesn't even care about you. Your ever increasing need to sling barbs at a city that really doesn't give two craps about you seems like one huge exercise in insecurity and near obsession.

Originally Posted by SignalHillHiker

It's the same when Giles Coren came and said our accents were Irish and we were so close to Ireland in every way we're practically joined. That's much more flattering than how we're typically viewed and described by Canadians. So it makes me happy. It's validating. And, yes, the fact he was horrified by Toronto's fashion sense and thought it the worst-dressed place he's ever been does make the compliment a little sweeter.

Why does it make it sweeter? What do accents have to do with people wearing shorts in the city in summer. And I venture to guess he hadn't made it across Canada or to St. John's yet if he thought Torontonians were the worst dressed people in the world. I happen to disagree with him about being badly dressed but do agree with him that shorts aren't for the city.

Originally Posted by SignalHillHiker

In a city this small, one doesn't often compete directly with the big boys in anything - it's just a given. So when people from the big boys, or who've made it big and live abroad, find things they love more about here, it's lovely. Especially when that's not the norm.

Take this headline from the Huffington Post yesterday. Great way to frame what is actually a story about economic power in Canada shifting to the West. The headline is intended to be shocking or possibly shameful to Torontonians, but get a nod and a wink from us (and, to a lesser extent, the rest of the federation). It's just the way things work.

I'm not so sure schadenfreude is an endearing Irish-lite quality outsiders naturally gravitate to.


I think Rousseau's point and really I'd rather not speak for him, he's much better at that than I am, is that you've become another SSP caricature. It's a bit tiresome and even though you'd probably not like to hear it -thoroughly Canadian.

And really for all your claims of distinctiveness culturally, you spend an awful lot of time comparing yourself to Ireland and New England (in New England's case, rather erroneously but whatever), which is something I never see Quebeckers do...

[SignalHillHiker]

Can any city really care about anyone? I'd doubt it - unless they're a celebrity. St. John's doesn't care about me any more than Toronto does. It's not an unusual trait, or some - as you seem to be implying - symptom of inherent superiority.

You, though, cared enough to present Jan Morris' comparison of St. John's to a "primitive San Francisco" as exemplary of her negative impression of the city. I believe your exact words were she did not intend it as a compliment. I liked that - it was a good burn.

But it turns out that line was just one phrase from a lovely homage to her favourite city:

She says in the book that of all the cities she has written about - anywhere in the world - none has given her more enjoyment than St. John's, the capital of Newfoundland, which she describes as "the most entertaining town in North America."

http://www.booksincanada.com/article_view.asp?id=2941

I'm not constantly putting down Toronto either - I don't post often about anywhere other than here at all, actually - which is the norm for most SSPers, as far as I can tell.

I've no idea what the ratio of positive to negative comments regarding Toronto from me are, but I do know I've made both. It's an urban forum subdivided by citizenship - Toronto is going to come up often enough for everyone here, no matter where they're from. And they're free to discuss something whether they like it or not.

And it's not as though I'm seeking it out. There's a Canada section with lots of TO representation, so we interact. If there wasn't, and we had only the regional sections, you'd probably never see me in the Ontario section, ever. I don't believe I've ever posted there, though I wouldn't be surprised to have done so once or twice over the years.

It's not an obsession for me. I'd be all over the TO local if it were. My only weird SSP obsession is Balkan music.

As it stands, I pop into the MB/SK section from time to time because I spent years there, likewise the Maritime portions of the Atlantic section. And I dip into Quebec every so often because I love it. But I don't even lurk in the Ontario ones, the way I do for the northeast U.S.

It's just not a particular interest of mine. Which is, in turn, one of the nice things about the Canada section. You get exposed to TO without having to look for it. And my impression has improved tremendously as a result. I could still sketch from memory a picture MonkeyRonin (I think) posted from somewhere in TO with brown brick buildings with bright-painted wood accents around the windows and doors. It looked formerly residential, now a mix with commercial. It was just gorgeous. And it's probably the only place I ever hear anything about Vancouver, which is welcome.

So you can cry caricature and be horrified that I find it worth sharing that a well-travelled celebrity prefers NYC than TO. But it's not that weird or unusual, I think, especially when it ties into what I hope my own little city is and feels.

[Gerrard]

So my Jan Morris quote, taken out of context, still burns huh?

Diagnosis - obsessed.

I get that you have a somewhat bunker mentality when it comes to all things Toronto. A lot of Canadians do. It's part of the whole insecurity thing that most citizens here are born with. It's called tall poppy syndrome. It's cool. I get it.

[SignalHillHiker]

It doesn't burn, it just disappoints. I love a good burn, and "primitive San Francisco" is actually really good in that regard, if she genuinely hated the city. It's not TOO insulting because it associates us with a respected, beautiful city - but it hints at all of the shitty things, from overhead power lines, to shitty sidewalks, to the... well, Coren again. He talked about how we were what would result from Ireland having an empire, and that passage was mostly positive. But then in reviewing one restaurant, he noted they served him a raw scallop and added, "There's that Irish Empire thing I'm talking about, see?" - or something to that effect.

That's a good burn. And the Morris quote implied the same sort of... "Dear God..." if it was indeed an insult.

So it's a lost, great insult, because it was actually intended as a realistic compliment.

As for inferiority, of course. How could anyone ever think a city of 200,000 isn't inferior to a city of whatever millions? (If you're urban-minded, I mean. Obviously lots can if they want less). But it's not a complex, it's just... when people find a thing they prefer about here, then it's EXTREMELY complimentary if they've experienced the big boys.

I'd never care if someone from Corner Brook flew out of Pearson two times and likes anything about St. John's more than TO. That's meaningless. But when someone like Munro does, it's a compliment - because they're well-travelled, they're the type of person you'd normally expect to have the opposite view.

If someone from London spent a few years in TO, NYC, and Tokyo and wrote an article praising X, Y, or Z about Toronto, you should appreciate it too. If not, get over yourself. It's a compliment, and worth enjoying.

[Gerrard]

Originally Posted by SignalHillHiker

It doesn't burn, it just disappoints. I love a good burn, and "primitive San Francisco" is actually really good in that regard, if she genuinely hated the city. It's not TOO insulting because it associates us with a respected, beautiful city - but it hints at all of the shitty things, from overhead power lines, to shitty sidewalks, to the... well, Coren again. He talked about how we were what would result from Ireland having an empire, and that passage was mostly positive. But then in reviewing one restaurant, he noted they served him a raw scallop and added, "There's that Irish Empire thing I'm talking about, see?" - or something to that effect.

That's a good burn. And the Morris quote implied the same sort of... "Dear God..." if it was indeed an insult.

So it's a lost, great insult, because it was actually intended as a realistic compliment.

As for inferiority, of course. How could anyone ever think a city of 200,000 isn't inferior to a city of whatever millions? (If you're urban-minded, I mean. Obviously lots can if they want less). But it's not a complex, it's just... when people find a thing they prefer about here, then it's EXTREMELY complimentary if they've experienced the big boys.

I'd never care if someone from Corner Brook flew out of Pearson two times and likes anything about St. John's more than TO. That's meaningless. But when someone like Munro does, it's a compliment - because they're well-travelled, they're the type of person you'd normally expect to have the opposite view.

If someone from London spent a few years in TO, NYC, and Tokyo and wrote an article praising X, Y, or Z about Toronto, you should appreciate it too. If not, get over yourself. It's a compliment, and worth enjoying.

If this were the 1980s I might care. A lot of Torontonians did. But for argument's sake I suppose if I combed the internets for unfavorable comments about St. John's and posted them here, would you not think I had a screw loose? I mean, wtf should I care?

And as far as negativity goes, Toronto isn't your only target. So maybe it's just you?

[Martin Mtl]

McGill U by Gilles Desjardins on Flickr

[SignalHillHiker]

What's that flag?

Nevermind, found it. Flag of McGill, obvs. Cool!

[SignalHillHiker]

A little blast from the recent past to mourn freezing for the first time this year.

All of this isn't far off again...

• Video Link















• Video Link

But then the fog will always return and give the snow a cutting. Hopefully WAY more this year than last.

[rousseau]

A few things...

Originally Posted by SignalHillHiker

And, yes, the fact he was horrified by Toronto's fashion sense and thought it the worst-dressed place he's ever been...

There you go again. What on earth are you talking about? Who is this? How is this even possibly plausible? I don't care about fashion, but while it's obvious that neither Toronto nor any North American city outside of Montreal is going to measure up to European cities in this area, it's also obvious that Toronto is more or less the same as New York when it comes to what people look like on the streets. Or maybe even better. Did no one see that 10-hour walking in NYC video?

Originally Posted by SignalHillHiker

That's not the way the conversation went, by the way, as you've described - I'm not a caricature.

You are on this forum.

Originally Posted by SignalHillHiker

And, as for Winnipeg... it's clear to me now I was genuinely depressed living there, clinically...I spent those months on SSP.

Fuck off already about Winnipeg. Why do we need to be your gestalt therapy circle? Who do you think you are that you have to post every last thing that crosses your mind each and every day?

You've turned SSP into your personal journal.

[MolsonExport]

why can't I read Rousseau's posts?

[matt602]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

why can't I read Rousseau's posts?

I can see them fine. Maybe you've checked the "don't show posts from registered drug user's" option in your control panel?

[MolsonExport]

Nope, I have never blocked posts or used the ignore list. I can't see any of his posts. I enjoy reading his comments.

[softee]

Originally Posted by rousseau

There you go again. What on earth are you talking about? Who is this? How is this even possibly plausible? I don't care about fashion, but while it's obvious that neither Toronto nor any North American city outside of Montreal is going to measure up to European cities in this area, it's also obvious that Toronto is more or less the same as New York when it comes to what people look like on the streets. Or maybe even better. Did no one see that 10-hour walking in NYC video?

Yep. From what I've seen on my visits to NYC, people there are by and large no better dressed than people in Toronto. If I had to rank one over the other I'd give Toronto the edge.

[SignalHillHiker]

Oh, he wasn't comparing TO and NYC.

One of the TO forumers, I forget who it was, posted a video of him (Giles Coren) ranting about Toronto fashion. We all chatted about it for a few pages of some thread, I forget which - I assumed you guys were in on it too and knew what I was talking about.

• Video Link

I happened to say I was glad he wasn't coming here - because, presumably, someone that famous wouldn't be. But then he did - which was flattering, but terrifying. That's why it was nice that he didn't have too much bad to say.

That's where that reference came from.

****

And, Rousseau... I'm free to overdo the personal anecdotes if I wish, just as you're free to be absolutely miserable every other post to every other person if you wish. Personally, I'd rather a forum with more personal anecdotes than... whatever this conversation is - but it takes all kinds.

[softee]

^ All I think after watching that video is that he is an insufferable blowhard who loves the sound of his own voice.

What city in North America that has hot summers isn't full of people wearing shorts?

I personally don't wear shorts, they're just not my style -- but I don't see anything wrong with people that do, especially when it's steaming hot and muggy as hell outside.

[Nouvellecosse]

Originally Posted by SignalHillHiker

And, Rousseau... I'm free to overdo the personal anecdotes if I wish, just as you're free to be absolutely miserable every other post to every other person if you wish. Personally, I'd rather a forum with more personal anecdotes than... whatever this conversation is - but it takes all kinds.

In all fairness, I have zero doubt that many people from NY would be more than willing to call you out if you took the same attitude toward it as you currently do toward Toronto. And if anyone showed the same attitude toward St. John's or NFLD in general that you do toward a variety of places in Canada you'd be irritated as well and add it to the ever growing collection of anecdotes.

Who knows, maybe there's a Winnipeger out there who's saved some of your posts as part of his "Newfoundlander attitudes" anecdote collection. That would be pretty funny.