[Halifax] Nova Centre | 65-58-58 m | 16-15-14 fl | Completed

[Agricola]

Not to let this become another Us vs. Them thing, but this...


images from Citylab.com

[Hali87]

Originally Posted by Keith P.

Only the lunatic zealot fringe will cycle to any extent here because of the hills and climate. We are spending way to much catering to the cycling lobby by putting in some very poorly thought-out lanes that are largely unused.

I know dozens of people who bike to work or school downtown every day. People tend not to move to Halifax and expect to stay dry all the time, and a lot of people like the challenge/workout aspect of dealing with hills. Adding more bike lanes (in perhaps a more thoughtful and deliberate way) and making the system more interconnected would increase usage on the existing lanes since it would make cycling more practical/safe for a greater number of people. This (and investing in public transit, and as much as you'll hate this, things like the new library) will help attract the 20/30-somethings that are considering Halifax as one of many options.

[OldDartmouthMark]

Originally Posted by Agricola

Not to let this become another Us vs. Them thing, but this...


images from Citylab.com

Not sure if they made their intended point or not, but IMHO that sure is ugly.

[Drybrain]

Originally Posted by Hali87

Adding more bike lanes (in perhaps a more thoughtful and deliberate way) and making the system more interconnected would increase usage on the existing lanes since it would make cycling more practical/safe for a greater number of people. This (and investing in public transit, and as much as you'll hate this, things like the new library) will help attract the 20/30-somethings that are considering Halifax as one of many options.

Yep.

And for what it's worth, I think Halifax is a great city to cycle in. The urban core is small and it's easy to get almost anywhere quickly, even with out a proper cycling network. A good network, of course, will make it even easier, and safer. Hills aren't that big a deal. If I have to contend with a couple of really hilly blocks, I walk and then hop back on the bike.

[OldDartmouthMark]

Originally Posted by Hali87

I know dozens of people who bike to work or school downtown every day. People tend not to move to Halifax and expect to stay dry all the time, and a lot of people like the challenge/workout aspect of dealing with hills. Adding more bike lanes (in perhaps a more thoughtful and deliberate way) and making the system more interconnected would increase usage on the existing lanes since it would make cycling more practical/safe for a greater number of people. This (and investing in public transit, and as much as you'll hate this, things like the new library) will help attract the 20/30-somethings that are considering Halifax as one of many options.

As one who biked all over the city as a student in my twenties (back when it was far less popular to do so), Halifax is no problem for somebody who is fit and enjoys the excitement and challenge of climbing hills, especially in the driving rain and snow. And, since I was 'invincible' back then the idea of a car or truck clipping me because they couldn't see me in the blinding rain or slid into me on the ice wasn't a worry. I had a number of near misses but almost got a bit of a rush from it every time I swerved or braked to avoid death or injury.

Now that I'm beyond my twenties and thirties and have a busy and hectic life, the challenge of cycling has been replaced by other challenges - these ones more taxing and severe - and it's difficult to see cycling as a practical way of getting around to take care of the needs of career, family, etc. Cycling has instead morphed to something to be done for the pleasure of doing it rather than for practicality.

So, although I would love to see cycling take off and be a major source of transportation, I see it still as a more limited form of mass transit than it would be in other areas with easier weather and flatter terrain.

So at this point I am starting to see things a little from the other side, in that there is a ceiling limit to how much use cycling lanes will get. By all means we should build them (hopefully we can find a practical way to separate them from motor vehicle traffic a little), but we should keep in mind that in Halifax it might never be the all-encompassing solution to traffic congestion and mobility that we hope it will be.

I applaud all who get around using 2 wheels and a heartbeat, but still look forward in hope that we will get a true dedicated and efficient mass transit system, usable by people of all ages and ranges of physical ability.

[halifaxboyns]

As someone who is not fit - the hills would kill me. So I'd walk my bike up them - but once I was on the flats, I'd be happy.

[hokus83]

Originally Posted by halifaxboyns

As someone who is not fit - the hills would kill me. So I'd walk my bike up them - but once I was on the flats, I'd be happy.

thats what gears are for. going up any hill in the city in low gear with a good bike is like putting a knife through butter

[worldlyhaligonian]

Dedicated lanes are still needed, not paint, real curbs to separate cyclists from the suburban maniacs.

[counterfactual]

I'm more often biking cross town, rather than up and down Citadel Hill.

Other than that, it's actually pretty flat.

[Duff]

Yesterday from the hill

[fenwick16]

Ziobrop has some great close-up shots of the assembly method of the tub girders. In this picture, there are vertical gusset plates that bolt the tub girders together. There is also a plate on the bottom that has a hole pattern: will this plate also be bolted? It looks like a significant amount of work to bolt each tub girder together.

On a different topic, the Chronicle Herald quoted Joe Ramia stating that the glass curtain wall could start being installed by March 2015 - http://thechronicleherald.ca/business/1246372-taylor-action-on-nova-centre-welcomed.


(source: Ziobrop, http://novacenter.builthalifax.ca/)

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by worldlyhaligonian

Dedicated lanes are still needed, not paint, real curbs to separate cyclists from the suburban maniacs.

Ottawa does this Downtown to great effect.

[Ziobrop]

Originally Posted by fenwick16

Ziobrop has some great close-up shots of the assembly method of the tub girders. In this picture, there are vertical gusset plates that bolt the tub girders together. There is also a plate on the bottom that has a hole pattern: will this plate also be bolted? It looks like a significant amount of work to bolt each tub girder together.

On a different topic, the Chronicle Herald quoted Joe Ramia stating that the glass curtain wall could start being installed by March 2015 - http://thechronicleherald.ca/business/1246372-taylor-action-on-nova-centre-welcomed.


(source: Ziobrop, http://novacenter.builthalifax.ca/)

Yes. The guesset plates are bolted on the bottom and both sides.
I don't have a timeline for the curtain wall, but they can start once the tower is taller so the wall isn't damaged by the upper floors still under construction

[OldDartmouthMark]

Originally Posted by Ziobrop

Yes. The guesset plates are bolted on the bottom and both sides.
I don't have a timeline for the curtain wall, but they can start once the tower is taller so the wall isn't damaged by the upper floors still under construction

It was a little surprising to me when I looked at that photo that the cross-sectional area of the gusset plates appears to be less that that of the I-beam. Not a problem under load for the top of the "I", as it would be typically under compressive loads, and the webbing doesn't contribute much to the load capacity of the beam, but for the bottom it would appear that the gusset plate will be the weakest link under tension.

That said, people more in the know than I have done the calculations and inspections so I'm sure it is just fine. It just looks a little strange to me, as I don't get to see the nuts-and-bolts of a building such as this very often.

Great pics, by the way!

[fenwick16]

Originally Posted by OldDartmouthMark

It was a little surprising to me when I looked at that photo that the cross-sectional area of the gusset plates appears to be less that that of the I-beam. Not a problem under load for the top of the "I", as it would be typically under compressive loads, and the webbing doesn't contribute much to the load capacity of the beam, but for the bottom it would appear that the gusset plate will be the weakest link under compression.

I think they have matching gusset plates on both sides (which is what I think Ziobrop stated). In the picture below you can just make out a matching gusset plate on the inside of the tub girder so the two gusset plates are in effect double the thickness of the single gusset plate in the previous picture. It appears as though the two plates together are about the same thickness as the large steel plates that make up the tub girder assembly.

I wonder if the gusset plates will also be welded, or maybe that is an overkill? It is rare to get such an upclose view of such a complex construction project. Thanks again to Ziobrop.

(source: Ziobrop http://novacenter.builthalifax.ca/)

[OldDartmouthMark]

Originally Posted by fenwick16

I think they have matching gusset plates on both sides (which is what I think Ziobrop stated). In the picture below you can just make out a matching gusset plate on the inside of the tub girder so the two gusset plates are in effect double the thickness of the single gusset plate in the previous picture. It appears as though the two plates together are about the same thickness as the large steel plates that make up the tub girder assembly.

I wonder if the gusset plates will also be welded, or maybe that is an overkill? It is rare to get such an upclose view of such a complex construction project. Thanks again to Ziobrop.

(source: Ziobrop http://novacenter.builthalifax.ca/)

That makes sense, plus I'm sure the stress distribution will be a little different given that they are tub girders rather than the I-beam example that I was considering. Thanks for helping to clarify.

[ns_kid]

At an "update" event at the Delta Halifax, developer Joe Ramia disclosed today that the Nova Centre is behind schedule and over budget: probably unsurprising news but disappointing nonetheless.

The project is now set for completion by the end of September of 2016, nine months behind schedule. That's important because it displaces something like 17 conventions that had been booked into the facility during that period.

Trade Centre Limited CEO Scott Fergusons says he's confident every one of them can be retained and rescheduled. I suspect organizers of the remaining 13 conferences booked for after September are feeling a bit more nervous.

Ramia blamed harsh weather last winter (was it that much worse than usual?) and the lengthy consultation process (we can grant him that) for the delays. But he says that now that the hard part (the excavation and sub grade) is done, it should be smooth sailing from here on.

He says the project is "a little" over budget but didn't say what that means.

Ramia is still not disclosing any tenants or naming the hotel, though he says a brand has been secured. He says that announcement will be up to the hotel chain.

[hokus83]

All that shouldn't account for a +9 month delay

[Colin May]

Originally Posted by ns_kid

At an "update" event at the Delta Halifax, developer Joe Ramia disclosed today that the Nova Centre is behind schedule and over budget: probably unsurprising news but disappointing nonetheless.

The project is now set for completion by the end of September of 2016, nine months behind schedule. That's important because it displaces something like 17 conventions that had been booked into the facility during that period.

Trade Centre Limited CEO Scott Fergusons says he's confident every one of them can be retained and rescheduled. I suspect organizers of the remaining 13 conferences booked for after September are feeling a bit more nervous.

Ramia blamed harsh weather last winter (was it that much worse than usual?) and the lengthy consultation process (we can grant him that) for the delays. But he says that now that the hard part (the excavation and sub grade) is done, it should be smooth sailing from here on.

He says the project is "a little" over budget but didn't say what that means.

Ramia is still not disclosing any tenants or naming the hotel, though he says a brand has been secured. He says that announcement will be up to the hotel chain.

Canadian professional organisations such as doctors, nurses, lawyers, accountants hold a convention in each province on a rotating basis. The same groups which went to TCL 5 years ago will come to Halifax in 5 years.
Note that Ferguson does not tell you the new bookings as opposed to the regular returnees. Transparency has rarely been a word associated with the management of TCL.

[fenwick16]

Originally Posted by Colin May

Canadian professional organisations such as doctors, nurses, lawyers, accountants hold a convention in each province on a rotating basis. The same groups which went to TCL 5 years ago will come to Halifax in 5 years.
Note that Ferguson does not tell you the new bookings as opposed to the regular returnees. Transparency has rarely been a word associated with the management of TCL.

If someone can post a list of the (previously) scheduled conventions it would only require a simple internet search to determine which organizations have held meetings in Halifax before.

Did anyone actually pose this question to Scott Ferguson: How many events scheduled for the Nova Centre are new bookings as opposed to regular returnees?