Robson Square Renovations

[Klazu]

There is a pretty nice terrace garden on the south side of the Law Courts that one doesn't normally notice from the street level. Photo from July.

[EdinVan]

Lovely photo. Such an amazing structure.

[Hot Rod]

waste of space imo. I would prefer a taller, smaller footprint. Then highrise the rest of the site.

[VancouverOfTheFuture]

Originally Posted by Hot Rod

waste of space imo. I would prefer a taller, smaller footprint. Then highrise the rest of the site.

that is what was originally planned. even taller then the Shangri-La. though they changed their minds and ended up with a high-rise placed on its side. you can take a look at this website and it mentions the 1966 proposal for a big building.
http://voony.wordpress.com/2012/10/24/bl...use-of-vancouver-a-short-history-part-1/
https://voony.wordpress.com/2012/10/22/v...osal-for-block-61-and-the-downtown-core/

i have mixed feelings about it personally. it is a unique building, but like you said it is what, 2/3 blocks long and only 7 floors? it does take up a ton of street space while leaving a whole lot of emptiness in the heart of the city.

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by Hot Rod

waste of space imo. I would prefer a taller, smaller footprint. Then highrise the rest of the site.

Originally Posted by VancouverOfTheFuture

that is what was originally planned. even taller then the Shangri-La. though they changed their minds and ended up with a high-rise placed on its side. you can take a look at this website and it mentions the 1966 proposal for a big building.
http://voony.wordpress.com/2012/10/24/bl...use-of-vancouver-a-short-history-part-1/
https://voony.wordpress.com/2012/10/22/v...osal-for-block-61-and-the-downtown-core/

i have mixed feelings about it personally. it is a unique building, but like you said it is what, 2/3 blocks long and only 7 floors? it does take up a ton of street space while leaving a whole lot of emptiness in the heart of the city.

Interesting that you both mention this, because, at the time, the purpose of Robson Square was to CREATE open space in the heart of the city.
It was then considered that a 55 storey building would be too tall and ugly, and that an open, accessible area with a lot of greenery was preferable.
Times change, and opinions and preferences certainly change with them.
It didn't really quite work out as planned, but was applauded in 1979 when it opened.

[wrenegade]

Personally I'd like to see the thing knocked down and re-done. The roof is cool, but the street feel is horrible. I'd move all the density to the Smithe-Nelson block and leave the Robson-Smith block free to create an actual Robson Square.

[Jebby]

Originally Posted by wrenegade

Personally I'd like to see the thing knocked down and re-done. The roof is cool, but the street feel is horrible. I'd move all the density to the Smithe-Nelson block and leave the Robson-Smith block free to create an actual Robson Square.

Yes, at street level it is extremely cold, isolating, and uninviting. It's ok inside and quite pretty from above, though.

What I'd do is knock the Smithe-Robson part down, build a tower on the southern portion of that block and build a true plaza on the northern half of that block fronting onto Robson. I'd build it with a glass canopy so it can be used year round. Something like the canopy built at the AT&T Performing Arts Center in Dallas would be cool.

Too bad that will never happen. It was designed by Arthur Erickson and he's given elevated on a pedestal in Vancouver.

[officedweller]

I think it just suffers from the change in elevation - people just don't go up or down levels to use plazas.
(and no one uses a plaza if there's no activity there).

Remember:
- the sunken plaza at Georgia & Seymour in front of the White Spot? Not used.
- the rooftop plaza at Vancouver Centre on what is now London Drugs? Not used (and since closed off).

Even the raised park/plaza at the Pennyfarthing development at Fisherman's Wharf (next to Go Fish) is devoid of people
- but has some of the best views of downtown in the City.

If the sunken part of Robson Square was covered over to create an at-grade plaza (maybe creating a conference area below) you'd actually have a huge "Robson Square" straddling the street, and it would be a huge gathering place if programmed well.

No need to eliminate anything else or move buildings - that would create a large enough space and people would filt up the stramps to look down on concerts, etc.

You could even line it with food and retail kiosks.

[s211]

Originally Posted by Jebby

Too bad that will never happen. It was designed by Arthur Erickson and he's given elevated on a pedestal in Vancouver.

Overheard some great commentary the other day that went something along these lines:

In the heady days of the Trudeau Liberals in the 70s, Robert Campeau was the emperor's court developer and Erikson was the emperor's court architect. Today, in the heady days of Vision Vancouver, Westbank is the new Campeau, and Henriquez is the new Erikson.

[djh]

Originally Posted by s211

Overheard some great commentary the other day that went something along these lines:

In the heady days of the Trudeau Liberals in the 70s, Robert Campeau was the emperor's court developer and Erikson was the emperor's court architect. Today, in the heady days of Vision Vancouver, Westbank is the new Campeau, and Henriquez is the new Erikson.

Out of interest, what was the context where you heard that statement?

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by wrenegade

Personally I'd like to see the thing knocked down and re-done. The roof is cool, but the street feel is horrible. I'd move all the density to the Smithe-Nelson block and leave the Robson-Smith block free to create an actual Robson Square.

I half-agree with you; For me the Hornby side street-feel is ok, even maybe pleasant, ..... but the Howe Street side makes me think of an atomic bomb shelter.

[Klazu]

Is the glass roof original or was it added later?

[officedweller]

Original - from the days when "space frames" were in.

i.e.
Buckminster Fuller's geodesic dome at Expo 67 in Montreal
Various 1970s sci-fi movies
Guildford Shopping Centre
former Plaza of Nations roof

[Klazu]

Damn that has looked very modern at that time, I bet! The glass roof very new even today!

Originally Posted by officedweller

If the sunken part of Robson Square was covered over to create an at-grade plaza (maybe creating a conference area below) you'd actually have a huge "Robson Square" straddling the street, and it would be a huge gathering place if programmed well.

No need to eliminate anything else or move buildings - that would create a large enough space and people would filt up the stramps to look down on concerts, etc.

You could even line it with food and retail kiosks.

I am with you if something needs to be changed. Even the current setup with all those rooftop gardens is fantastic (really, try it next summer!), but people are not finding it. Having a small square that would be at-grade would indeed serve Robson street life better at that corner than the current structure.

Demolishing this building would be a mistake and what would one added skyscraper bring to the city? Nothing. There are several places where tall skyscrapers could be built and it's just a matter of getting rid of one or two viewcones.

People complaining about the current building being only 7 floors should check out the streetscape along Howe Street. Yes, it is rather dead on that side, but the building is massive and certainly in the range of 12 floors. Together with 980 Howe they form a very urban corridor between Smithe and Nelson.

I cannot help it, but I like the Law Courts very much and I wish more people would discover it. There is nothing more nice than strolling the urban roof garden on a warm summer day.

[VancouverOfTheFuture]

whatever happened to the original threads purpose? i don't remember a big glass cover built for the Olympics. but that was a long time ago now. also, anyone have any renders of it? i didn't find any going back through the thread.

i personally have mixed feelings about the Law Courts building. it certainly is unique and doesn't look too bad at all. it needs a bit of a power wash and some landscaping work. i wish they always had the fountains on though. they make the building look a ton nicer.

[s211]

Originally Posted by djh

Out of interest, what was the context where you heard that statement?

Going from memory, I think the context was Westbank's apparent coziness with Vision, and what one person perceived as Westbank having an inside track with Vision and the bureaucracy.

[officedweller]

Originally Posted by VancouverOfTheFuture

whatever happened to the original threads purpose?

This thread was for the Georgia St. side.

[Hot Rod]

Originally Posted by Jebby

Yes, at street level it is extremely cold, isolating, and uninviting. It's ok inside and quite pretty from above, though.

What I'd do is knock the Smithe-Robson part down, build a tower on the southern portion of that block and build a true plaza on the northern half of that block fronting onto Robson. I'd build it with a glass canopy so it can be used year round. Something like the canopy built at the AT&T Performing Arts Center in Dallas would be cool.

Too bad that will never happen. It was designed by Arthur Erickson and he's given elevated on a pedestal in Vancouver.

I could not agree with you more.

We need to drop this small time stuff and let some towers go big. Shangri La isn't that tall and the world didn't come to an end with a 660 foot tower. I think Vancouver should shoot for 800-900 feet and maybe a 1000 footer on the waterfront, it wont block the mountains or cast a shadow or whatever other excuse. 1000 is not too much altitude from 660 but the skyline and density prospective (and skyline feel) would be HUGE. After all, this is downtown!

go big or go home.

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by Klazu

Is the glass roof original or was it added later?

The sloping glass roof was part of the original design. On the Hornby side, it's rather interesting and nice. It's the Howe Street side of the project that
I have the problem with. (dunno what was in Erickson's mind when he did that)!!!!

[Vanelevatorman]

Originally Posted by Hot Rod

I could not agree with you more.

We need to drop this small time stuff and let some towers go big. Shangri La isn't that tall and the world didn't come to an end with a 660 foot tower. I think Vancouver should shoot for 800-900 feet and maybe a 1000 footer on the waterfront, it wont block the mountains or cast a shadow or whatever other excuse. 1000 is not too much altitude from 660 but the skyline and density prospective (and skyline feel) would be HUGE. After all, this is downtown!

go big or go home.

This +1