Calgary Public Transit II

[Full Mountain]

Originally Posted by outoftheice

What I would like to see is Calgary Transit take steps to elevate the BRT network into a true primary transit network in the minds of Calgarians. To do this I think that they should take several steps to put it on par with the service standards of the LRT.

- Change the large format LRT maps that are posted at all of Calgary's LRT stations to large format Rapid Transit maps that include all of Calgary's BRT network. This would broaden public awareness of the BRT services. Maps would not necessarily need to show every stop along the BRT routes but should at the very least show how interchanges between the LRT and BRT services can be made. I think this will become much more important once we see the north and south crosstown services implemented as well as the Green Line BRT.

- Install heated shelters (or at the very least shelters) at all of Calgary's BRT stops. This helps to elevate the services beyond the rest of the bus network and brings the standard of a BRT stop closer to what is offered at Calgary's LRT stations. I think it will also help increase ridership as one of the only things that keeps me riding the LRT network in the winter is the knowledge that heated shelters are available at a large number of the stations and I would be more than happy to extend this ridership to the BRT network if I knew I wouldn't freeze my butt off at the stop.

- Install real time "Next Bus" signs at all of the BRT network stops. I think this system has dramatically improved the user experience for the LRT network and would do the same to the BRT network. I agree with others that a mobile app would be sufficient for the rest of the network but information for the BRT network should be accessible to all users and not just locals with mobiles who have knowledge of an app. Keeping with this train of thought, I think the schedules of the BRT routes as well as any regular bus routes that make use of the stop should be displayed.

- Install local area maps at all BRT stops. This is done at the LRT stations and is great for orienting oneself to the area when getting off the train. I think having this information readily accessible would make a huge difference in people's confidence levels when it comes to the whether or not they will be able to locate their intended destination once they've taken the bus to the general area where they want to be.

I'm not too sure how much implementing these things would be but my guess is that it would probably be in the $5-10 million range. While it is a large expense, I think the investment would be well received by transit users and go a long way to bringing Calgary's transit network into the "world class" realm. Now is also the time to do it as Calgary Transit gets ready to roll out seven major BRT corridor projects over the next few years.

I agree, additionally I would suggest:

- Moving the BRT to dedicated infrastructure at key points this would significantly help it become a proper part of a rapid transit network.

-With the implementation of real time data, moving to a frequency based system rather than a time based one would help to, this way you know there will be a bus every x minutes rather than it coming at a specific time. The drivers would then aim to be x minutes behind the bus in front of them rather than aiming for a specific time at a specific stop. This would reduce the bunching that is seen now. This requires dedicated infrastructure though for proper implementation.

[VIce]

Originally Posted by outoftheice

What I would like to see is Calgary Transit take steps to elevate the BRT network into a true primary transit network in the minds of Calgarians. To do this I think that they should take several steps to put it on par with the service standards of the LRT.

- Change the large format LRT maps that are posted at all of Calgary's LRT stations to large format Rapid Transit maps that include all of Calgary's BRT network. This would broaden public awareness of the BRT services. Maps would not necessarily need to show every stop along the BRT routes but should at the very least show how interchanges between the LRT and BRT services can be made. I think this will become much more important once we see the north and south crosstown services implemented as well as the Green Line BRT.

- Install heated shelters (or at the very least shelters) at all of Calgary's BRT stops. This helps to elevate the services beyond the rest of the bus network and brings the standard of a BRT stop closer to what is offered at Calgary's LRT stations. I think it will also help increase ridership as one of the only things that keeps me riding the LRT network in the winter is the knowledge that heated shelters are available at a large number of the stations and I would be more than happy to extend this ridership to the BRT network if I knew I wouldn't freeze my butt off at the stop.

- Install real time "Next Bus" signs at all of the BRT network stops. I think this system has dramatically improved the user experience for the LRT network and would do the same to the BRT network. I agree with others that a mobile app would be sufficient for the rest of the network but information for the BRT network should be accessible to all users and not just locals with mobiles who have knowledge of an app. Keeping with this train of thought, I think the schedules of the BRT routes as well as any regular bus routes that make use of the stop should be displayed.

- Install local area maps at all BRT stops. This is done at the LRT stations and is great for orienting oneself to the area when getting off the train. I think having this information readily accessible would make a huge difference in people's confidence levels when it comes to the whether or not they will be able to locate their intended destination once they've taken the bus to the general area where they want to be.

I'm not too sure how much implementing these things would be but my guess is that it would probably be in the $5-10 million range. While it is a large expense, I think the investment would be well received by transit users and go a long way to bringing Calgary's transit network into the "world class" realm. Now is also the time to do it as Calgary Transit gets ready to roll out seven major BRT corridor projects over the next few years.

The same contractor that builds Calgary's transit shelters builds these for Winnipeg:


Doors, heaters, reasonable amounts of space. Add a next bus (even if just for the BRT route) LED display and a transit system map and you're set.


Edit: And Edmonton has borrowed an old Go Transit design:

[DizzyEdge]

I think one problem with the BRT is since it's not really a BRT, it doesn't really improve on normal bus service. For example, during morning rushhour at 7am, according to google maps, to go from Beddington to downtown is 28 mins on the 3, and 25 min on the 301, and to go from Seton to downtown is 63 mins on a bus-> LRT, and 69 mins on the BRT.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Full Mountain

I agree, additionally I would suggest:

- Moving the BRT to dedicated infrastructure at key points this would significantly help it become a proper part of a rapid transit network.

-With the implementation of real time data, moving to a frequency based system rather than a time based one would help to, this way you know there will be a bus every x minutes rather than it coming at a specific time. The drivers would then aim to be x minutes behind the bus in front of them rather than aiming for a specific time at a specific stop. This would reduce the bunching that is seen now. This requires dedicated infrastructure though for proper implementation.

The only problem with that is that if the first bus gets backed up, others end up holding back. If the first bus is full, then you end up with people waiting for the next bus. In the old situation, it may be there in 1 minute. This system has it coming in 5 or 10.

[Full Mountain]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

The only problem with that is that if the first bus gets backed up, others end up holding back. If the first bus is full, then you end up with people waiting for the next bus. In the old situation, it may be there in 1 minute. This system has it coming in 5 or 10.

With a proper implementation you would have every bus stop at each stop same as the LRT, so the difference between a full and empty bus would be nearly moot.

[MasterG]

Originally Posted by Full Mountain

I agree, additionally I would suggest:

- Moving the BRT to dedicated infrastructure at key points this would significantly help it become a proper part of a rapid transit network.

-With the implementation of real time data, moving to a frequency based system rather than a time based one would help to, this way you know there will be a bus every x minutes rather than it coming at a specific time. The drivers would then aim to be x minutes behind the bus in front of them rather than aiming for a specific time at a specific stop. This would reduce the bunching that is seen now. This requires dedicated infrastructure though for proper implementation.

I agree, additionally I would suggest:

- Moving to a proof-of-pay system on major routes with all-door boarding. Most delays I have seen come from 30 people all fumbling for change or tickets at one stop. Delays the bus and compounds the problem of bus-bunching, with each additional stop now waiting longer, allowing more people to build up and creating the problem again and again. Offboard ticket machines at key stops, no more transfers handed by drivers, buttons on the doors to get in. My number one suggestion to get things moving, especially given CT's love affair with those bendies.

-Give greater direction to drivers that want to be nice to not be. Common problem: oh we can squeeze on 5 more people when we clearly cannot or don't need to because there is another bus bunched behind. Make a counter system tracked boardings with a laser or something and notify the driver to not stop to pick up once full load is reached. Takes the decision from his hands. Much more efficient and faster, even for the people waiting if it is implemented system-wide. This technology I am describing is a thing right?

[Full Mountain]

Originally Posted by MasterG

I agree, additionally I would suggest:

- Moving to a proof-of-pay system on major routes with all-door boarding. Most delays I have seen come from 30 people all fumbling for change or tickets at one stop. Delays the bus and compounds the problem of bus-bunching, with each additional stop now waiting longer, allowing more people to build up and creating the problem again and again. Offboard ticket machines at key stops, no more transfers handed by drivers, buttons on the doors to get in. My number one suggestion to get things moving, especially given CT's love affair with those bendies.

-Give greater direction to drivers that want to be nice to not be. Common problem: oh we can squeeze on 5 more people when we clearly cannot or don't need to because there is another bus bunched behind. Make a counter system tracked boardings with a laser or something and notify the driver to not stop to pick up once full load is reached. Takes the decision from his hands. Much more efficient and faster, even for the people waiting if it is implemented system-wide. This technology I am describing is a thing right?

That or utilizing the pressure sensors in the air suspension to estimate the weight on board and change the sign to 'Bus Full' and give the drivers direction to slow down but continue moving if they get the full indication.

[Fuzz]

If you are talking about something like the 301, those buses are full. You can't just stop boarding because you've been sitting at a stop for 30 seconds. The only thing worse than squishing on a full bus at -30°C is not getting on one. Now, if their is a bus behind, they can communicate. "Hey, I'm right behind you, move on" or even better, the bus behind skips the stop (because realistically, no one downtown is going from 6th st to 1st st) and hop forward a stop.

Most of the problems seem to occur because;
the bus driver's clock is totally off
they don't care
they are rushing to get to a timing point so they can have a longer break
they just aren't very intelligent.

Hopefully with a GPS system it can tell them when they are ahead or behind where they should be. The corollary to that is if it is rush hour and if they are full, for FS, just goddamn go. Don't stop at EVERY stop to squeeze one person on, leave 10 behind then stop at the next stop to try to get one more on!

[fusili]

Originally Posted by MasterG

I agree, additionally I would suggest:

- Moving to a proof-of-pay system on major routes with all-door boarding. Most delays I have seen come from 30 people all fumbling for change or tickets at one stop. Delays the bus and compounds the problem of bus-bunching, with each additional stop now waiting longer, allowing more people to build up and creating the problem again and again. Offboard ticket machines at key stops, no more transfers handed by drivers, buttons on the doors to get in. My number one suggestion to get things moving, especially given CT's love affair with those bendies.

Yes! Off-vehicle fare payment can massively speed up a bus system. I think we should seriously look at this for our more intensive "BRTs" especially the 301.

[milomilo]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

The only problem with that is that if the first bus gets backed up, others end up holding back. If the first bus is full, then you end up with people waiting for the next bus. In the old situation, it may be there in 1 minute. This system has it coming in 5 or 10.

AFAIK even in metro systems where there are 30+ TPH, there is still a timetable behind the scenes. When there are delays/screw ups they reassign/cancel trains to try to maintain the schedule.

[WaitWhat?]

Anyone go to the Tuscany Station opening celebration today? I'm interested to hear some reviews.

[MasterG]

Originally Posted by fusili

Yes! Off-vehicle fare payment can massively speed up a bus system. I think we should seriously look at this for our more intensive "BRTs" especially the 301.

To me it seems like the lowest cost / highest benefit of everything we could do. Downtown bus-lanes, Centre street BRT all would be incredible improvements, but if you cut the waiting time of every stop by 50% of busy routes for the price of a few ticket validation machines, surely that can be entertained at a fraction of the cost - financial and political - as taking the lanes / dedicated infrastructure. Once the ridership increases, as it would with such a boost, it would be an even easier ask for CT to get whatever lanes they need.

Are there reasons why we don't do this? I am seriously wondering what the thought in the culture of CT that has prevented this idea from being tried. It works in countless other cities.

[fusili]

Originally Posted by MasterG

To me it seems like the lowest cost / highest benefit of everything we could do. Downtown bus-lanes, Centre street BRT all would be incredible improvements, but if you cut the waiting time of every stop by 50% of busy routes for the price of a few ticket validation machines, surely that can be entertained at a fraction of the cost - financial and political - as taking the lanes / dedicated infrastructure. Once the ridership increases, as it would with such a boost, it would be an even easier ask for CT to get whatever lanes they need.

Are there reasons why we don't do this? I am seriously wondering what the thought in the culture of CT that has prevented this idea from being tried. It works in countless other cities.

Agreed. In my opinion, I see mode progression happening in the following way:

Limited stops - queue jumps and signal priority - off-vehicle fare payment - dedicated right of way - trains.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by MasterG

To me it seems like the lowest cost / highest benefit of everything we could do. Downtown bus-lanes, Centre street BRT all would be incredible improvements, but if you cut the waiting time of every stop by 50% of busy routes for the price of a few ticket validation machines, surely that can be entertained at a fraction of the cost - financial and political - as taking the lanes / dedicated infrastructure. Once the ridership increases, as it would with such a boost, it would be an even easier ask for CT to get whatever lanes they need.

Are there reasons why we don't do this? I am seriously wondering what the thought in the culture of CT that has prevented this idea from being tried. It works in countless other cities.

I think most of the delay is because of the screw ups and delays around the "new" electronic payment system. Hopefully when that is in place, they will have the freedom to get more creative.

As for why their aren't dedicated bus lanes through downtown? I have no fricken idea. Its ridiculous as it is. One day a politician may actually step foot on a bus and ride it across downtown in rush hour on a snow down and maybe, just maybe, realize the system we have is horribly broken. But then, maybe pigs will fly and the Calgary tower will get chromed top to bottom(a small dream of mine).

[TallisRH]

Here are some of my photos from the opening of Tuscany station:
 



 

 

 

 



 

 

 

 
More photos can be seen here.

I really like the station. It's obviously quite similar to Crowfoot in terms of the actual station design, but it has some nice differentiating design features: no escalators (more room inside), the platform loops around at the north end (no station building in the way, you can walk all the way around outside), and I think the Eamon's sign is a really great, unique landmark. I was also impressed with the landscaping in and around the bus terminals/park and ride lots -- although there's still much to be done.

[YYCguys]

Thanks for posting those awesome pictures! With currently funded extensions now complete, it's time to start focussing hardcore on the SE/NC line!

[Fuzz]

Thanks for the pics, well done. Really like the Eamon's sign. Agree with YYCguys, lets hit up the next line!

[joe498]

Ugh....

End of the line: After opening of Tuscany LRT, no immediate plans for further expansions:
http://www.calgaryherald.com/line+After+...s+further+expansions/10144150/story.html

"And a mayor won’t likely get to pilot a CTrain into another new station until the 2030s."

Meanwhile Calgary and area projected to hit 2.4 million by 2041:
http://www.calgaryherald.com/technology/...million+2041+Graphic/10015881/story.html

Ya no problem guys, we will just double the population in 25 years and the existing LRT system will still be adequate.

[Wooster]

Well we're trying to build the Green Line. City commited $520 million so far - building dedicated busways convertible to LRT (little sunk cost). We now need the Province and Feds to come through with funding that will allow us to move forward. Call your MLA and MP! We would break ground immediately if the other levels of government stepped up.

Originally Posted by joe498

Ugh....

End of the line: After opening of Tuscany LRT, no immediate plans for further expansions:
http://www.calgaryherald.com/line+After+...s+further+expansions/10144150/story.html

"And a mayor won’t likely get to pilot a CTrain into another new station until the 2030s."

Meanwhile Calgary and area projected to hit 2.4 million by 2041:
http://www.calgaryherald.com/technology/...million+2041+Graphic/10015881/story.html

Ya no problem guys, we will just double the population in 25 years and the existing LRT system will still be adequate.

[DizzyEdge]

Can someone explain the method of converting busway to LRT? Is the ROW wide enough to have bus lanes on one side and LRT on the other so the buses can keep running during construction?