Salt Lake Transit News Thread

[justiny]

It's interesting... Uber and Lyft were served with cease and desist letters of operation here in Virginia a few months back. They just recently settled and both are now allowed to operate.

[downtownslcresident]

this was being mentioned over in the general thread and i wanted to make sure to post it here too.

UDOT is doing a study to make a tunnel from the 106th south interange on i-15 under 106th and continuing on north to 90th south. here is a story on fox 13 from may.

http://fox13now.com/2014/05/21/udot-proposes-alterations-to-interchange-at-10600-south/

[SLCdude]

Platform construction on both sides of Main Street at Courthouse Station. I have no Idea what purpose these serve. BRT? Traffic Calming?

[UTPlanner]

Those are temporary platforms. They were scooted over adjacent to the tracks since that picture was taken. They're working on the actual platform so it is now closed and people are exiting and entering the trains on the temporary platforms.

[jubguy3]

Originally Posted by UTPlanner

Those are temporary platforms. They were scooted over adjacent to the tracks since that picture was taken. They're working on the actual platform so it is now closed and people are exiting and entering the trains on the temporary platforms.

Great for me. I have a quick transfer somedays. Woohoo!

EDIT: oh, and is the ticket machine closure allowed by the FTA? That seems a little shady.

I'd personally like to see main blocked off between 5th and 6th and the tracks and platforms moved to create a public plaza. I know it will never happen.

[Hatman]

No matter how progressive Utah's transit system may make us appear, it will always be two steps forward and one step back. In the news today:

A critique of the S-Line streetcar project:
Sugar House Streetcar drawing business, not riders
Sugar House Streetcar drawing business, not riders

And this...
Utah County officials: We need more freeways
http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/politics/58301039-90/transportation-utah-county-mountain.html.csp

I'm not necessarily against freeways, and Utah County is far from being a transit hot-spot,
But I AM against overbuilding freeways when there is no attempt to balance out the alternatives. Besides, in 10-15 years autonomous cars will completely change traffic demand anyway. The freeway idea just seems like very expensive overkill to me.

[jubguy3]

Originally Posted by Hatman

No matter how progressive Utah's transit system may make us appear, it will always be two steps forward and one step back. In the news today:

A critique of the S-Line streetcar project:
Sugar House Streetcar drawing business, not riders
Sugar House Streetcar drawing business, not riders

And this...
Utah County officials: We need more freeways
http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/politics/58301039-90/transportation-utah-county-mountain.html.csp

I'm not necessarily against freeways, and Utah County is far from being a transit hot-spot,
But I AM against overbuilding freeways when there is no attempt to balance out the alternatives. Besides, in 10-15 years autonomous cars will completely change traffic demand anyway. The freeway idea just seems like very expensive overkill to me.

God damnit lehi, really? "Where did all of these cars come from? We couldn't have possible induced it with our incredibly unwalkable office parks, our congested, pedestrian nightmare highways, and our irresponsible development! Let's fix it with freeways! That will work for sure. LA has great traffic with its awful network!"

The key is not to build freeways. The key is to make responsible development on a grid system so that everyone can be a 15 minute walk on quiet roads to anything they need and everything they do. But noooooo build build build! Road road road! Office office office! The closest Utah valley should come to another freeway is an I -15 bypass through Provo from Spanish fork to a point somewhere just north of Orem. Even then, Provo has impressed SLC (we still hate you guys though #Crimson) with its attempts at building transit responsible and walkable developments serving the entire community affordably and effectively. Provo also has made attempts to bring high quality transit through their city so as to reduce congestion and increase walkability, traffic, and living standards. Lehi doesn't care that they have minimal bus routes. Lehi is also geographically constrained in a way that even small irresponsible developments go a long way in creating cross-POtM traffic and high congestion through the two major corridors between UTCo and SLCo. Based on the fact that a. Lehi wants to build freeways and build irresponsible car heavens, b. that most of the 1 million people to come will be centered around lehi, and c. That lehi is an irresponsible 🞵🞵🞵🞵🞵 🞵🞵 🞵🞵🞵🞵 trying to build freeways that will lead to lehi being the worst city in utah, all we can expect is more office buildings stolen from SLC and Provo (where they can make a difference and where they belong) and incredible congestion. I honestly think lehi needs to reevaluate how building jobs for 30000 people next to a freeway ramp and congested roads in a congested, narrow city, is a terrible idea. I've always hated lehi but this makes me hate them more.

[justiny]

I think we can all agree, the S-Line ridership will explode in the next 2-3 years. TOD's are golden tickets for any community... Hell, just look at the Washington Metro's Orange Line in Arlington before and after photos and stats. Even the new Silver Line through Tyson's Corner is experiencing massive development in that area.

I know the WMATA and UTA are very different agencies serving very different demographics, but the concept remains the same. In the late 80's, voters struck down light rail in the valley... Now cities are tripping over themselves to get TRAX stations.

[SLC Projects]

Sorry if I missed this, but what are they doing to the platform on main?

[jubguy3]

Originally Posted by SLC Projects

Sorry if I missed this, but what are they doing to the platform on main?

Concrete tactile strips are not very good, so they are being replaced. They have been doing it to the university line for a couple of months now, but the Main Street reconstruction is more rigorous. They are being replaced with plastic yellow strips; construction should last to courthouse until the 24th and then everything northwest to arena will also be rebuilt one at a time like courthouse. I don't know the schedule.

Road closures should be expected. The fact that closing Main Street is a no biggie shows to me that it would fare better with no auto traffic but just bus traffic.

[Comrade]

In 2050, the Wasatch Front will be just one, gigantic freeway.

[justiny]

Originally Posted by Comrade

In 2050, the Wasatch Front will be just one, gigantic freeway.

To be fair, it will have "spurs"... But I understand and agree.

I remember growing up when Ogden, SLC, and Provo were three separate cities... Now it's all meshed together.

Hence, the "Wasatch Front"... No going back.

[s.p.hansen]

Originally Posted by Hatman

No matter how progressive Utah's transit system may make us appear, it will always be two steps forward and one step back. In the news today:

A critique of the S-Line streetcar project:
Sugar House Streetcar drawing business, not riders
Sugar House Streetcar drawing business, not riders

And this...
Utah County officials: We need more freeways
http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/politics/58301039-90/transportation-utah-county-mountain.html.csp

I'm not necessarily against freeways, and Utah County is far from being a transit hot-spot,
But I AM against overbuilding freeways when there is no attempt to balance out the alternatives. Besides, in 10-15 years autonomous cars will completely change traffic demand anyway. The freeway idea just seems like very expensive overkill to me.

Here are my 2 cents regarding these stories:

Lehi has a Legitimate problem where the I-15 CORE Project ended. Right now the two locations with the worst structural bridges for I-15 are in the Lehi area and the South Davis area around North Salt Lake and Bountiful. Within a year the South Davis segment of I-15 will be rebuilt and widened for a new HOV lane. Lehi is still in limbo. What makes the Lehi situation so sensitive is that they need to replace these bridges, but, they also eventually need to make an interchange to link the Mountian View Corridor to I-15. So what Lehi is really gonna have to do is make a case to get extra money to just complete the small spaghetti bowel interchange now which will then awkwardly transition into these corridor protecting frontage roads. This would be interchange is gonna happen (they created the 🞵🞵🞵🞵🞵🞵🞵 corridor) and it's going to be at a hot spot to their suburban Silicon Valley project, and it's located near a bridge slated to get replaced, so it's just better we get that 🞵🞵🞵🞵 over with. We can't damn well replace the bridge in that segment without just buiding the interchange.

Now, the streetcar. UTA needs to spend the money to double track the existing streetcar corridor. The thing needs to be at least as convenient as the bus so no more 10 mph nonsense. Many streetcars do 25 mph. The pay off for the S Line will come with development but mostly when it actually has visibility in Sugar House and that is why we need phase II to happen as soon as possible. People need to actually be able to see the Streetcar and right now it is virtually invisible.

A lot is riding on the success of the S Line, if it seems less practical than the bus, it's gonna be hard to sell two more Streetcar lines downtown. UTA is already working to secure the funds for the double tracking of the existing line and to secure funds for the expansion. If all goes well in a couple of years we should see this thing doing a lot better for itself. It has to succeed if UTA has more streetcar ambitions elsewhere in the state.

[justiny]

Originally Posted by s.p.hansen

Now, the streetcar. UTA needs to spend the money to double track the existing streetcar corridor. The thing needs to be at least as convenient as the bus so no more 10 mph nonsense. Many streetcars do 25 mph. The pay off for the S Line will come with development but mostly when it actually has visibility in Sugar House and that is why we need phase II to happen as soon as possible. People need to actually be able to see the Streetcar and right now it is virtually invisible.

A lot is riding on the success of the S Line, if it seems less practical than the bus, it's gonna be hard to sell two more Streetcar lines downtown. UTA is already working to secure the funds for the double tracking of the existing line and to secure funds for the expansion. If all goes well in a couple of years we should see this thing doing a lot better for itself. It has to succeed if UTA has more streetcar ambitions elsewhere in the state.

This is where UTA failed in my book. If you're going to have light rail... Then have light rail.

A BRT could've done the job. But my guess is that Salt Lake City leaders and officials were banking on the "return" profit from an experiment gone not exactly as planned.

I'm not against the S-Line, I think it can succeed... I just think city planners and citizens should be patient. It's a long road ahead.

[i-215]

Originally Posted by s.p.hansen

Lehi has a Legitimate problem where the I-15 CORE Project ended. Right now the two locations with the worst structural bridges for I-15 are in the Lehi area and the South Davis area around North Salt Lake and Bountiful. Within a year the South Davis segment of I-15 will be rebuilt and widened for a new HOV lane. Lehi is still in limbo. What makes the Lehi situation so sensitive is that they need to replace these bridges, but, they also eventually need to make an interchange to link the Mountain View Corridor to I-15. So what Lehi is really gonna have to do is make a case to get extra money to just complete the small spaghetti bowel interchange now which will then awkwardly transition into these corridor protecting frontage roads. This would be interchange is gonna happen (they created the 🞵🞵🞵🞵🞵🞵🞵 corridor) and it's going to be at a hot spot to their suburban Silicon Valley project, and it's located near a bridge slated to get replaced, so it's just better we get that 🞵🞵🞵🞵 over with. We can't damn well replace the bridge in that segment without just buiding the interchange.

Well said. Maybe bond to build the freeway, and then charge new office complexes a transportation fee. It's still cheaper than expanding in California, while offering the amenities businesses want (freeway access).

[wrendog]

The Wasatch Front has way less freeways when compared to other cities it seems. Here in San Antonio, there are freeways upon freeways surrounded by freeways in the middle of freeways.

[jubguy3]

Originally Posted by wrendog

The Wasatch Front has way less freeways when compared to other cities it seems. Here in San Antonio, there are freeways upon freeways surrounded by freeways in the middle of freeways.

We had a much lower population expectation when our freeways were planned (215 and former 415, 15, 80, 21st Expwy (which I would like to see designated as I-180 along with other freeways receiving false interstate designations and no fed funding but I know I've been criticized for bringing up the idea in addition to renaming the honorary name... I really hate "mountain view corridor"... It adds no sense of place) and the only other freeway we are going to get is the MVC and the only recent freeway (ahem... Parkway) we've gotten is legacy which was severely stunted by the Sierra Club (which has been beneficial to the wetlands and some other stuff) and everyone uses one freeway (the 15) to get anywhere because everyone lives along it... There has been no need for expansion of either end of the 215 even though population is expanding around it and because no one lives west of redwood road and few people commute from echo and PC to slc, I-80 only had Olympic demand and people only use western I-80 to get to the airport. The 21st Expwy has also been somewhat ok at three lanes but since WVC is growing it's had some congestion issues.

[jubguy3]

In case anyone wanted to see how we can create a better sense of place on our freeways, I'll post my list of names we could adopt instead of the bland names we have now ( legacy parkway, belt route, 21st south Expwy). Please ignore the interstate designations if you do not like them. It's conceptual, and they are not meant for you this time. I know I've gotten 🞵🞵🞵🞵 for even mentioning this in the past.

Issues include: IOC rights for Olympic Expwy, the fact that we would have to maintain the veterans memorial freeway and Eisenhower freeway designation (can we please just move vets freeway to I-84, it's honestly much prettier and scenic than I-15), the fact that MVC runs miles away from the Oquirrh Bench, and if the east belt should be considered a spur because it never actually connects back to I-15 (I'm not knowledges learned smarts educationated on this)

MVC - I-415 Oquirrh Bench Expressway
21Exw - I-180 Washington Expressway (this has no sense of place... Suggestions for a better name?)
Legacy - I-615 Davis Expwy (post widening, north extension
East Belt - I-515 Olympic Expressway
West Belt - I-215 Jordan Expressway
Veteran Memorial - I-15 Valley Freeway
East Eisenhower - I-80 Canyon Freeway
West Eisenhower - I-80 South Bayshore Freeway

[SLCdude]

Originally Posted by s.p.hansen

Now, the streetcar. UTA needs to spend the money to double track the existing streetcar corridor. The thing needs to be at least as convenient as the bus so no more 10 mph nonsense. Many streetcars do 25 mph. The pay off for the S Line will come with development but mostly when it actually has visibility in Sugar House and that is why we need phase II to happen as soon as possible. People need to actually be able to see the Streetcar and right now it is virtually invisible.

Long time no see, S.P.

I agree 100% on corridor visibility. It peeves me so much how the S-Line ALMOST reaches 1100 East. I believed during construction (and still believe now) that reaching 1100 East is Crucial to the success of the streetcar. You could drive down 2100 S and 1100 and not see a single train.

[tygr]

Originally Posted by jubguy3

In case anyone wanted to see how we can create a better sense of place on our freeways, I'll post my list of names we could adopt instead of the bland names we have now ( legacy parkway, belt route, 21st south Expwy). Please ignore the interstate designations if you do not like them. It's conceptual, and they are not meant for you this time. I know I've gotten 🞵🞵🞵🞵 for even mentioning this in the past.

Issues include: IOC rights for Olympic Expwy, the fact that we would have to maintain the veterans memorial freeway and Eisenhower freeway designation (can we please just move vets freeway to I-84, it's honestly much prettier and scenic than I-15), the fact that MVC runs miles away from the Oquirrh Bench, and if the east belt should be considered a spur because it never actually connects back to I-15 (I'm not knowledges learned smarts educationated on this)

MVC - I-415 Oquirrh Bench Expressway
21Exw - I-180 Washington Expressway (this has no sense of place... Suggestions for a better name?)
Legacy - I-615 Davis Expwy (post widening, north extension
East Belt - I-515 Olympic Expressway
West Belt - I-215 Jordan Expressway
Veteran Memorial - I-15 Valley Freeway
East Eisenhower - I-80 Canyon Freeway
West Eisenhower - I-80 South Bayshore Freeway

I find little I can agree with of your designations. I really prefer the simpleness of the number designations and don't like giving them arbitrary "memorial/geographical names. Some of your names are not even tied to an existing geographical reference that the mass public would even understand (South Bayshore Freeway).

I-15 in California has countless different names and I feel that it only adds to confusion. In the San Diego area it is known as the Escondido Freeway, the Tuskegee Airmen Highway, then it's the Avocado Highway just south of Escondido while still designated as the Escondido Freeway... I could go on.

If we applied California's principles of designation to I-15 here...
I-15 would be

• Wasatch Front Expressway from Nephi to Brigham City (for obvious reasons)
• Peach Freeway in Box Elder County (for their delicious peaches)
• Fort Buenaventura Freeway in Weber County (for the first permanent [white] settlement in Ogden)
• Bedroom Community Freeway in Davis County (cause that's really what DC is filled with; I was raised there—CHS '93)
• Deedee Corradini Freeway in Salt Lake County (she was a major factor in being awarded the olympics and obtaining funding for the freeway's expansion in time for the olympics, and of course the capitol city's first female mayor)
• Happy Valley (or Prozac) Freeway in Utah County (no explanation needed).

If we are adding names, the only ones I can agree with would be

• "The 201"/SR 201/2100 South Freeway as the Magna Freeway (since that's really where it ends)
• SR 67/Legacy Highway really is a good name but if it were renamed, it should be the West Davis Freeway since that is it's geographical location
• SR 85/Mountain View Corridor sounds like a temporary name—could be renamed Oquirrh Hills Freeway
• SR 145/Pioneer Crossing could be renamed Pony Expressway since the Pony Express went through that general area and it looks like if it expands west and southwest then it will likely follow a similar route