Sports in Canadian culture - Page 94

Berklon · #**1861** Posted **Jul 31, 2014, 5:59 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrOilers

Off the top of my head:

Vince Ferragamo
Mark Gastineau
Dexter Manley
Ricky Williams
Andre Rison

Really?

Vince Ferragamo had troubles with interceptions and was a bust in the CFL after being decent in the NFL. But when he came back to the NFL he wasn't as good anyway.

The others were washed up ex-NFL stars when they came to the CFL. If they were still good, they would've still been playing in the NFL. A true comparison would be to bring a current star NFL player (ie. Aaron Rogers, Calvin Johnson, Adrian Peterson, etc) to the CFL to see how they fair. The problem is no CFL team can afford to pay what a star player would be willing to come over for.

I hope you're also not considering Chad Johnson a star player as well.

GlassCity · #**1862** Posted **Jul 31, 2014, 6:59 PM**

Wait, are you guys saying that there are people in Niagara that cheer for the Sabres? I would have thought absolutely everybody right to the border would be a Leafs fan.

suburbanite · #**1863** Posted **Jul 31, 2014, 7:06 PM**

As far as I know the Leaf's fanbase doesn't extend too far away from the GTA. My mom always said growing up in Sarnia that the Redwings were more popular anywhere west of London.

esquire · #**1864** Posted **Jul 31, 2014, 7:07 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by GlassCity

Wait, are you guys saying that there are people in Niagara that cheer for the Sabres? I would have thought absolutely everybody right to the border would be a Leafs fan.

I remember seeing ads for Sabres tickets in St. Catharines. The Sabres clearly market to the area east of Hamilton on the Niagara Peninsula.

It isn't exactly surprising considering a) that Buffalo is closer than Toronto, b) tickets are readily available for Sabres games, and c) the Sabres have been around for over 40 years so they have had time to develop a solid fanbase.

Acajack · #**1865** Posted **Jul 31, 2014, 7:13 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by suburbanite

As far as I know the Leaf's fanbase doesn't extend too far away from the GTA. My mom always said growing up in Sarnia that the Redwings were more popular anywhere west of London.

Depends in which direction you go.

North it extends pretty far, though many cities with large Franco-Ontarian populations are a mix of Leafs and Habs fans.

It also extends east to the fringes of Ottawa's zone of influence and even into the Senators' backyard in the Upper Ottawa Valley.

GlassCity · #**1866** Posted **Jul 31, 2014, 7:20 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by suburbanite

As far as I know the Leaf's fanbase doesn't extend too far away from the GTA. My mom always said growing up in Sarnia that the Redwings were more popular anywhere west of London.

Quote:

Originally Posted by esquire

I remember seeing ads for Sabres tickets in St. Catharines. The Sabres clearly market to the area east of Hamilton on the Niagara Peninsula.

It isn't exactly surprising considering a) that Buffalo is closer than Toronto, b) tickets are readily available for Sabres games, and c) the Sabres have been around for over 40 years so they have had time to develop a solid fanbase.

It's just surprising because the Sabres play in another country. To use a Vancouver example, while the Mariners definitely have a presence here, the Blue Jays are still much more popular, despite being way farther. People want to cheer for Canadian teams.

Acajack · #**1867** Posted **Jul 31, 2014, 7:25 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by GlassCity

It's just surprising because the Sabres play in another country. To use a Vancouver example, while the Mariners definitely have a presence here, the Blue Jays are still much more popular, despite being way farther. People want to cheer for Canadian teams.

Not all Canadians regard that place over there as being another country. At least not in the way "another country" is meant to most people around the world.

esquire · #**1868** Posted **Jul 31, 2014, 7:33 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by GlassCity

It's just surprising because the Sabres play in another country. To use a Vancouver example, while the Mariners definitely have a presence here, the Blue Jays are still much more popular, despite being way farther. People want to cheer for Canadian teams.

The regional pull can't be underestimated. I'd say that the most popular MLB team in Manitoba is basically whichever of the Twins or Blue Jays has been better over the past few years.

I'm actually surprised that there would be more Jays fans than Mariners fans in BC. If there was a MLB team a couple of hours away in North Dakota I'd probably be behind them 100%.

Besides, not everyone wants to cheer for a Canadian team... Toronto cheers for the Bills instead of their own football team

GlassCity · #**1869** Posted **Jul 31, 2014, 7:48 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acajack

Not all Canadians regard that place over there as being another country. At least not in the way "another country" is meant to most people around the world.

Yeah I guess it's not quite the same but it's just what I've found here. Most non bandwagoning basketball fans I know cheer for the Raptors, even when they were bad, despite the Trailblazers and earlier, the Supersonics being much closer. I think that's why it's hard for me to wrap my head around Niagara cheering for the Sabres. Every time it's been brought up that a Hamilton team would steal Buffalo's fan base I thought they were just talking nonsense, I was so sure nobody watched them in Ontario. I had no idea it'd be a number as high as 15% of their attendance.

Quote:

Originally Posted by esquire

The regional pull can't be underestimated. I'd say that the most popular MLB team in Manitoba is basically whichever of the Twins or Blue Jays has been better over the past few years.

I'm actually surprised that there would be more Jays fans than Mariners fans in BC. If there was a MLB team a couple of hours away in North Dakota I'd probably be behind them 100%.

Besides, not everyone wants to cheer for a Canadian team... Toronto cheers for the Bills instead of their own football team

I don't know, the fact that all the Blue Jays games are on TV probably has something to do with it, but I'd say that if you were talking to a baseball fan here, 9 times out of 10 they'll root for the Blue Jays.

MrOilers · #**1870** Posted **Jul 31, 2014, 7:53 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Berklon

The others were washed up ex-NFL stars when they came to the CFL. If they were still good, they would've still been playing in the NFL.

But if the NFL is such a better league talent-wise, even their "washed-up" players should roll over everyone in the CFL, right? Or even do decent?

The fact is, they don't and never have. They can't even cut it in the CFL. The talent level between the NFL and CFL is very close.

Ricky Williams was top rusher in the NFL the year before he joined the Argos. He was far from washed-up. Everyone said he would set all kinds of records, but he ended up being terrible in the CFL.

suburbanite · #**1871** Posted **Jul 31, 2014, 8:15 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrOilers

Ricky Williams was top rusher in the NFL the year before he joined the Argos. He was far from washed-up. Everyone said he would set all kinds of records, but he ended up being terrible in the CFL.

Uhh, you mean the guy who retired from the NFL after multiple failed drug tests and barely put up starter numbers in the season before joining the Argos? Also is 4.8 YPC considered terrible in the CFL?

esquire · #**1872** Posted **Jul 31, 2014, 8:35 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by suburbanite

Uhh, you mean the guy who retired from the NFL after multiple failed drug tests and barely put up starter numbers in the season before joining the Argos? Also is 4.8 YPC considered terrible in the CFL?

Those questions don't undermine his point, though... the conventional wisdom is that a NFL star would utterly dominate in the CFL. But Ricky Williams did not come close... being a merely competent player in the sense that it would make people say "Yeah, he's not terrible" is not exactly what I'd call being a standout player.

Prometheus · #**1873** Posted **Jul 31, 2014, 8:37 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Berklon

The others were washed up ex-NFL stars when they came to the CFL.

What do you actually know about the NFL?

When Ricky Williams came to the CFL he was one of the most talented running backs in the NFL and in his prime. He played in the CFL in 2006 because he was suspended from the NFL for one year for testing positive for marijuana. During one full season in the CFL, he had the lowest rushing yards of the eight starting running backs in the league. After his 2006 stint in the CFL, he played five more seasons in the NFL, rushing for 1,121 yards in 2008 for Miami.

suburbanite · #**1874** Posted **Jul 31, 2014, 8:47 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by esquire

Those questions don't undermine his point, though... the conventional wisdom is that a NFL star would utterly dominate in the CFL. But Ricky Williams did not come close... being a merely competent player in the sense that it would make people say "Yeah, he's not terrible" is not exactly what I'd call being a standout player.

I'm saying that a guy who couldn't stop blazing and puts up 700 yards after his retirement isn't a star.

I looked into my other point though, and even though it's early in the season, it looks like most CFL running backs put up 5+ YPC, so his numbers on the Argos would be below average.

Prometheus · #**1875** Posted **Jul 31, 2014, 8:49 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by suburbanite

Uhh, you mean the guy who retired from the NFL after multiple failed drug tests and barely put up starter numbers in the season before joining the Argos?

In the year before playing in the CFL, Ricky William played only 12 games yet ran for 743 yards in the NFL. That's 62 yards a game and a 4.4 yards per carry average, the 9th best of all the running backs in the NFL that season.

Yup, those are "barely starting numbers." LOL!

suburbanite · #**1876** Posted **Jul 31, 2014, 8:53 PM**

Puts him 22nd in yds/game in 2005.

Prometheus · #**1877** Posted **Jul 31, 2014, 9:13 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by suburbanite

Puts him 22nd in yds/game in 2005.

That's an amazing stat, since he was only 30th in the amount of times he was handed the ball in 2005. Doing so much with so few attempts is precisely what made him the 9th most productive rusher in the NFL in the season prior to coming to the CFL.

Your attempt to argue that Ricky Williams was anything less than a great NFL running back in his prime when he joined the CFL is utterly ludicrous. I can't understand why you are trying.

suburbanite · #**1878** Posted **Jul 31, 2014, 9:19 PM**

Don't worry I did catch your two edits. "That is one of the most productive averages in the league" is what I was responding to.

MrOilers · #**1879** Posted **Jul 31, 2014, 9:25 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by suburbanite

Also is 4.8 YPC considered terrible in the CFL?

When you were the 5th best rusher in a league that has only 8 teams you are below average.

suburbanite · #**1880** Posted **Jul 31, 2014, 9:29 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prometheus

4.4 yards per carry average, the 9th best of all the running backs in the NFL that season.

Yup, those are "barely starting numbers." LOL!

His running partner in Miami that year (meaning he wasn't a guaranteed starter) put up the exact same YPC and 300 more all-purpose yards, yet no one considers Ronnie Brown to be a star.