Sports in Canadian culture

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Gerrard

Do you honestly think New York cares about some bumf*ck Kansas team or whatnot? They don't. I can't speak for London but having lived in NYC I can honestly tell you New Yorkers don't care one bit about maintaining some sort of national unity through sports or shared cultural institutions. They believe they are the USA period. Or something quite distinct and unconnected to it. You have heard the phrase "flyover" haven't you? It's not supposed to be flattering.

Torontonians don't treat the ROC with the same sort of pointed arrogance. We just don't think very much about it at all.

Except that CBS, NBC, ABS and ESPN, based in NYC but covering the entire country, would NEVER EVER lead their sportscasts with English Premier League soccer scores (assuming that was something New Yorkers were more interested in) on the day the NCAA had its college football bowl games.

Just giving one example...

[Gerrard]

Originally Posted by esquire

But you guys DO care deeply about sports or shared cultural institutions. We all know that Toronto loves to slobber all over its teams when the US media is paying attention.

The best possible thing that could happen to the Argos would be for the American media to start paying more attention to the CFL.

You know so much about Toronto, how long have you lived here?

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Gerrard

Wow you're a really sensitive guy if you think anything in my post above contained one regional insult.

List one please.

OK so maybe there really is a town called Bumfuck, Kansas.

I guess esquire should stand corrected then. Or is it elly?

[Gerrard]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Except that CBS, NBC, ABS and ESPN, based in NYC but covering the entire country, would NEVER EVER lead their sportscasts with English Premier League soccer scores (assuming that was something New Yorkers were more interested in) on the day the NCAA had its college football bowl games.

Just giving one example...

I'm pretty sure the CFL gets national coverage. What's your point?


And remember American networks have much heavier affiliate coverage nation wide. Even tiny towns of 50 thousand will sometimes have 4 networks located in town.

[Gerrard]

Originally Posted by Acajack

OK so maybe there really is a town called Bumfuck, Kansas.

I guess esquire should stand corrected then. Or is it elly?

You do know that's an expression don't you. And I wasn't tossing the insult around I was giving perspective on it. It's a little different than using the expression myself. Get it?

[esquire]

Hilarious.

[Gerrard]

Originally Posted by esquire

But you guys DO care deeply about sports or shared cultural institutions. We all know that Toronto loves to slobber all over its teams when the US media is paying attention.

The best possible thing that could happen to the Argos would be for the American media to start paying more attention to the CFL.

Or you know, maybe they still wouldn't care because Torontonians don't care about football. Even when it's wrapped in the stars and stripes and uses Kim Kartrashian as a mascot and comes with a life time membership to Papa Johns.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Gerrard

I'm pretty sure the CFL gets national coverage. What's your point?


And remember American networks have much heavier affiliate coverage nation wide. Even tiny towns of 50 thousand will sometimes have 4 networks located in town.

I don't get the point of this.

My point is that except for TSN (which own the broadcast rights so they play it up) coverage of the CFL seems often relegated to the backburner. Which makes no sense when you consider the TV ratings: the only league Canadians watch more than the CFL is the NHL.

Even just on the last page someone mentioned the CBC highlighting the British Open as opposed to the return of the Ottawa RedBlacks.

Also, CTV on its regular and sports networks as well as Global TV generally will go through the entire reel of NFL regular season highlights (something like a dozen games on a Sunday afternoon) before going to the CFL.

It's a bit odd when you consider the NFL doesn't have a single team based in Canada.

[Gerrard]

Originally Posted by esquire

Hilarious.

I suppose if Toronto loved football and the CFL you'd still have to find a reason to hate it because the only cure for obsessive insecurity is a .5 prescription for xanax.

[Gerrard]

Originally Posted by Acajack

I don't get the point of this.

My point is that except for TSN (which own the broadcast rights so they play it up) coverage of the CFL seems often relegated to the backburner. Which makes no sense when you consider the TV ratings: the only league Canadians watch more than the CFL is the NHL.

Even just on the last page someone mentioned the CBC highlighting the British Open as opposed to the return of the Ottawa RedBlacks.

Also, CTV on its regular and sports networks as well as Global TV generally will go through the entire reel of NFL regular season highlights (something like a dozen games on a Sunday afternoon) before going to the CFL.

It's a bit odd when you consider the NFL doesn't have a single team based in Canada.

I'm not sure what you mean by backburner? If you mean the world doesn't stop and it's not declared a national holiday with free beer than you're probably right.

If you mean they don't broadcast CFL games nationally when they are actually being played, then you're wrong.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Gerrard

Or you know, maybe they still wouldn't care because Torontonians don't care about football. Even when it's wrapped in the stars and stripes and uses Kim Kartrashian as a mascot and comes with a life time membership to Papa Johns.

The national anglo media based in that city seem to think that Torontonians and Canadians care about gridiron football - only they think it's the four-down variety they prefer.

National media profile in Canada for various pro sports leagues has the NHL far ahead at the top, then it's the NFL that is second (somewhat inexplicably). It should be probably be the CFL second, then the NFL and then probably a toss-up between NBA and MLB.

CHL also gets a ridiculously low media profile when you consider it has the highest attendance of any sports league in the country.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Gerrard

I'm not sure what you mean by backburner? If you mean the world doesn't stop and it's not declared a national holiday with free beer than you're probably right.

If you mean they don't broadcast CFL games nationally when they are actually being played, then you're wrong.

I mean that when you are watching a so-called Canadian national sportscast in mid-November on the day the Grey Cup finalists are being determined, that you shouldn't have to wait until 20 minutes into the program and have to go through the full highlights and post-game interviews from Indianapolis, Green Bay, Cleveland, Buffalo and Tampa, in order to find out who is playing in the Grey Cup.

[Gerrard]

Again you are projecting based on what you think you know, not what the reality is.

But we're used to that in Toronto. So continue to not surprise us.

Those are decisions made in the broadcast booth. We don't hold yearly meetings in Toronto to decide which sequence sports scores come in. And I really can't imagine *anyone* *anywhere* in reality caring what score comes first.

You'd have a point though if they completely ignored what the score was for a CFL game. Which doesn't happen. Ever.

[SHOFEAR]

Originally Posted by Acajack

The national anglo media based in that city seem to think that Torontonians and Canadians care about gridiron football - only they think it's the four-down variety they prefer.

National media profile in Canada for various pro sports leagues has the NHL far ahead at the top, then it's the NFL that is second (somewhat inexplicably). It should be probably be the CFL second, then the NFL and then probably a toss-up between NBA and MLB.

CHL also gets a ridiculously low media profile when you consider it has the highest attendance of any sports league in the country.

Unfortunately the distribution of what is covered by various channels is starting to reflect what sporting properties they have TV rights for. Is it a coincidence the Sportsnet will show Blue Jay highlights long before CFL?

Because MLSE is owned by both TSN and Rogers, apparently the TSN group very much wants to purchase the Argos...but the Rogers group does not want to.

[GlassCity]

Originally Posted by Berklon

I'm not sure why Toronto gets picked on when it appears Montreal and Vancouver have a similar issue. Those 2 cities aren't exactly packing the stands as I see the average attendance for both are about 20,000 and 24,000 respectively this year.

These are highly populated cities and their attendance isn't that much better than Torontos.
I think part of the problem is that with bigger cities there's a lot more to do than take in a sporting event, and when they do want to dedicate some of their time to sports - they'd rather just "go big or go home" (so to speak).

Vancouver's having a bit of a weird start to the season attendance wise, but the few years before that we've been averaging 28-29,000 people a game. Last year we had 37,000 come out again the Saskatchewan Roughriders. We don't get picked on because we don't have a problem. I was disappointed when I went to the home opener this year and it announced the attendance at 24,500. Toronto couldn't even fill up the Air Canada Centre with the crowds it's been having this year.

As far as stuff to do, that's an absolutely terrible, not to mention arrogant, argument. I mean I go to every Lions game, but the days they're not playing I go to the bar, or the movies or even just outside. And I consider Vancouver a big city with probably a big chunk of the amenities Toronto has. What can the average Roughrider fan not do that a person from Toronto can instead of going to a game?

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Gerrard

Those are decisions made in the broadcast booth. We don't hold yearly meetings in Toronto to decide which sequence sports scores come in. And I really can't imagine *anyone* *anywhere* in reality caring what score comes first.

.

Oh but such things do matter to people in high places in media and business, as they influence viewer and consumer behaviour by hammering home what's important and what's not.

[Gerrard]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Oh but such things do matter to people in high places in media and business, as they influence viewer and consumer behaviour by hammering home what's important and what's not.

If people care about sports, they go online for the scores. They don't wait until 6.

You guys just seem to be looking for some sort of contrition from Torontonians. You're not going to get it. So move on. Guilt works on children, so does scolding. Not on adults.

Toronto is NOT a great sports town. A lot of leagues survive here because the population and demographics can support them. Not because Toronto is sports mad. And it's definitely not football crazy.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Gerrard

If people care about sports, they go online for the scores. They don't wait until 6.

You guys just seem to be looking for some sort of contrition from Torontonians. You're not going to get it. So move on. Guilt works on children, so does scolding. Not on adults.

Toronto is NOT a great sports town. A lot of leagues survive here because the population and demographics can support them. Not because Toronto is sports mad. And it's definitely not football crazy.

Not sure. I'd say the NFL is more popular in Toronto today than MLB was before the Blue Jays arrived and the NBA before the Raptors arrived.

That's not bad for a league that doesn't even have a team in the city and no official plans to place one there.

[Berklon]

This whole argument seems pointless and kind of ridiculous.

What can't people just accept that people like what they like, for whatever reasons?
Why do people care that Toronto isn't interested in the CFL? Does it make you enjoy the CFL less?
Do you care if there's little interest in the NBA in Regina... or MLB in Winnipeg? If so, do you knock that city for not caring as well?

Not every city has the same preferences. It's not wrong to have difference interests, and it's certainly not enough to ridicule a city over.

[Gerrard]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Not sure. I'd say the NFL is more popular in Toronto today than MLB was before the Blue Jays arrived and the NBA before the Raptors arrived.

That's not bad for a league that doesn't even have a team in the city and no official plans to place one there.

The NFL is not popular. Gambling on the NFL is. People may watch the superbowl because it's spectacle and because they have money on it, not because they give one crap about who wins. And this isn't just a Toronto thing.

You could go to any city in Canada and ask a passive question whether they'd like an NFL team in their city and I venture to guess more than 50% of people would say yes. Because, "why not?, sure". It doesn't mean the stadium would be at capacity for every game beyond the first year novelty aspect of it.

I mean what do you want to hear? That we're American wannabes? Does that make you sleep better at night? If so, then here it is. Yeah we reject Canada, the whole lot of us Torontonians. We are only interested in American things we like shiny glossy American stuff not the matte Canada finish. And it's all because we hate the CFL!

Otherwise I really don't get what either your interest or anyone else's on here is in Toronto sports franchises.