PHILADELPHIA | Highrise Development Thread IX

[Plokoon11]

Yikes!

[MSFHQ]

Originally Posted by summersm343

Anyone interested in some Center City occupancy rates?

2116 Chestnut- 89.4%
Riverloft- 99%
1825 Arch- 95%
One Franklintown- 95%
The Metropolitan- 97%
Edgewater- 95.5%
The Arch- 96.5%
777 South Broad- 95%
1500 Locust- 95.5%
The Sansom- 95%
2040 Market- 98%
Museum Towers- 94%
The Touraine- 98%
Lofts at Logan View- 97%
The St. James- 98%
Goldtex- 94%
Icon- 79%
Domus- 97%
Southstar Lofts- 82%
Tower Place- 97.5%
The Left Bank- 98.5%
Locust on the Park- 98%
The Granary- 83%

Wow,that is impressive. Any word on pre leasing for the new construction on 1900 Arch?

With all these buildings being leased to near capacity I cannot imagine the demand once the new Comcast and FMC is done. Even if only a fraction of the employees choose to live in CC that is still a good number of people.

[japmes]

Originally Posted by summersm343

Anyone interested in some Center City occupancy rates?

2116 Chestnut- 89.4%
Riverloft- 99%
1825 Arch- 95%
One Franklintown- 95%
The Metropolitan- 97%
Edgewater- 95.5%
The Arch- 96.5%
777 South Broad- 95%
1500 Locust- 95.5%
The Sansom- 95%
2040 Market- 98%
Museum Towers- 94%
The Touraine- 98%
Lofts at Logan View- 97%
The St. James- 98%
Goldtex- 94%
Icon- 79%
Domus- 97%
Southstar Lofts- 82%
Tower Place- 97.5%
The Left Bank- 98.5%
Locust on the Park- 98%
The Granary- 83%

How reliable are these figures? They seem unusually high. Is Goldtex really 94% rented?

[summersm343]

Originally Posted by japmes

How reliable are these figures? They seem unusually high. Is Goldtex really 94% rented?

I just did a market survey today. I called each individual place. So I will say they are as accurate as they say they are. 95% occupied is usually what each building shoots for. That's a good operating occupancy percentage. The rental market is doing extremely well in the core of the city, these numbers don't surprise me at all. There is a reason there is a lot of development coming down the pipeline.

[summersm343]

Originally Posted by MSFHQ

Wow,that is impressive. Any word on pre leasing for the new construction on 1900 Arch?

With all these buildings being leased to near capacity I cannot imagine the demand once the new Comcast and FMC is done. Even if only a fraction of the employees choose to live in CC that is still a good number of people.

1900 Arch hasn't released any numbers yet. I will say I know they have done a good job preleasing. Wouldn't be surprised if they're over 60% preleased.

[Londonee]

Originally Posted by Cro Burnham

Listen here, Nelson Mandela, Jr., congress may have outlawed racial discrimination 50 years ago, but I still retain my effin' right to be prejudiced against blue people, godammit. What more do you people want from us?!?

Can't you leave the blue people alone? Haven't they already endured enough?

[AbortedWalrus]

2116 Chestnut- 89.4%

I guess they are having trouble with that last ten percent seeing as how they're doing an open house this weekend to try to bring in more renters. Frankly, I think they are way overpriced, unless they dropped their rents since I looked. They want something like $2000 for a studio and $3500 for a two bedroom. Their amenities are just average too.

[sayitaintso]

Originally Posted by japmes

How reliable are these figures? They seem unusually high. Is Goldtex really 94% rented?

edit

[sayitaintso]

Originally Posted by summersm343

Anyone interested in some Center City occupancy rates?

2116 Chestnut- 89.4%
Riverloft- 99%
1825 Arch- 95%
One Franklintown- 95%
The Metropolitan- 97%
Edgewater- 95.5%
The Arch- 96.5%
777 South Broad- 95%
1500 Locust- 95.5%
The Sansom- 95%
2040 Market- 98%
Museum Towers- 94%
The Touraine- 98%
Lofts at Logan View- 97%
The St. James- 98%
Goldtex- 94%
Icon- 79%
Domus- 97%
Southstar Lofts- 82%
Tower Place- 97.5%
The Left Bank- 98.5%
Locust on the Park- 98%
The Granary- 83%

Gotta remember that the US vacancy rate is 4-5% so to be fair an impressive number is 2-3%. Granary and Chestnut could be in trouble considering how long they've been open. I think this might be the beginning of the slowdown. I would be worried if I'm a developer just getting the shovels in the ground for a project larger than 20 units. I would like to see Summers trends every quarter to see where the numbers are going.

Summer do you have the previous 2 or 3 quarters worth of vacancy data?

[summersm343]

Originally Posted by sayitaintso

Gotta remember that the US vacancy rate is 4-5% so to be fair an impressive number is 2-3%. Granary and Chestnut could be in trouble considering how long they've been open. I think this might be the beginning of the slowdown. I would be worried if I'm a developer just getting the shovels in the ground for a project larger than 20 units. I would like to see Summers trends every quarter to see where the numbers are going.

Summer do you have the previous 2 or 3 quarters worth of vacancy data?

John Buck expected lease up to take a year for 2116 Chestnut. When the building was open in June/July last year, the upper floors were still under construction. The full building wasn't complete inside until September. The top floors are the only floors with available units left. Granary has been really slow because it's insanely overpriced. Seriously.

These numbers are from April:

2116 Chestnut- 60%
Riverloft- 97%
1835 Arch- 95%
One Franklintown- 96%
Metropolitan- 99%
Edgewater- 95.5%
The Arch- 95%
777 South Broad- 94%
1500 Locust- 92%
The Sansom- 97%
2040 Market- 98%
Museum Towers- 95%
The Touraine- 98%
Lofts at Logan View- 98%
The St. James- 98%
Goldtex- 89%
Icon- 69%
Domus- 97%
Southstar Lofts- 40%
Tower Place- 97%
The Left Bank- 98.5%
Locust on the Park- 97%
The Granary- 71%

I don't think much has changed with the older towers. The newer towers have leased up more (about 10%) since April. Makes sense.

[PhiLaw]

Originally Posted by AbortedWalrus

I guess they are having trouble with that last ten percent seeing as how they're doing an open house this weekend to try to bring in more renters. Frankly, I think they are way overpriced, unless they dropped their rents since I looked. They want something like $2000 for a studio and $3500 for a two bedroom. Their amenities are just average too.

I was told on Saturday that the Southstar building is 50% leased, 25% moved in. The Granary numbers seem to be accurate. I was also told that the Goldtext building was around 80% leased. Take a look on craigslist at all of the adds for this site, it's taking up the whole page. This isn't necessarily a bad thing, remember this just completed construction and people are usually skeptical about signing leases until they can see the finished product.

[summersm343]

Originally Posted by PhiLaw

I was told on Saturday that the Southstar building is 50% leased, 25% moved in. The Granary numbers seem to be accurate. I was also told that the Goldtext building was around 80% leased. Take a look on craigslist at all of the adds for this site, it's taking up the whole page. This isn't necessarily a bad thing, remember this just completed construction and people are usually skeptical about signing leases until they can see the finished product.

I think my Southstar numbers are wrong. They were 40% in April so they're probably about 60% max now. It's always difficult to get accurate numbers out of Dranoff. They always try to give me the run around lol, but I admire them as a company. I wouldn't expect this one to take long though, they're priced well for the location and Dranoff wouldn't be breaking ground on another apartment building in the Fall if this was struggling to lease up. Larger buildings typically take longer to lease up. Every developer expects it.

I would say the only one struggling to lease up is probably Granary. It's one of the most expensive apartment buildings in the city, if not THE most expensive.

[Kidphilly]

Originally Posted by summersm343

I think my Southstar numbers are wrong. They were 40% in April so they're probably about 60% max now. It's always difficult to get accurate numbers out of Dranoff. They always try to give me the run around lol, but I admire them as a company. I wouldn't expect this one to take long though, they're priced well for the location and Dranoff wouldn't be breaking ground on another apartment building in the Fall if this was struggling to lease up. Larger buildings typically take longer to lease up. Every developer expects it.

I would say the only one struggling to lease up is probably Granary. It's one of the most expensive apartment buildings in the city, if not THE most expensive.

been in this building three times now in the past month - today is 20% occupied at best but is still under contruction - think will faster than the Granary (way over priced is very nice but small and for the money I personally would live elsewhere) or 2118 Chestnut honestly

[summersm343]

Originally Posted by Kidphilly

been in this building three times now in the past month - today is 20% occupied at best but is still under contruction - think will faster than the Granary (way over priced is very nice but small and for the money I personally would live elsewhere) or 2118 Chestnut honestly

Philaw claims 50% leased, 25% moved-in. I'm willing to believe that's correct.

In April it was 40% leased. Here is an article to verify that:

http://articles.philly.com/2014-04-28/bu...ntal-market-arts-building-spencer-yablon

[EastSideHBG]

Deal struck on rezoning University City High School site
Read more at http://www.philly.com/philly/news/Deal_r...igh_School_site.html#VFze4dUl1ol0jFb8.99

Philadelphia looks to attract tech buzz, entrepreneurs
http://www.timesherald.com/general-news/...looks-to-attract-tech-buzz-entrepreneurs

[AbortedWalrus]

Originally Posted by summersm343

I think my Southstar numbers are wrong. They were 40% in April so they're probably about 60% max now. It's always difficult to get accurate numbers out of Dranoff. They always try to give me the run around lol, but I admire them as a company. I wouldn't expect this one to take long though, they're priced well for the location and Dranoff wouldn't be breaking ground on another apartment building in the Fall if this was struggling to lease up. Larger buildings typically take longer to lease up. Every developer expects it.

I would say the only one struggling to lease up is probably Granary. It's one of the most expensive apartment buildings in the city, if not THE most expensive.

Yeah the Granary is crazy overpriced too. In my opinion Granary and 2116 were the most overpriced of all of them. Tower Place was a little bad, but it depended which unit, rather than overall.

[McBane]

Originally Posted by EastSideHBG

Deal struck on rezoning University City High School site
Read more at http://www.philly.com/philly/news/Deal_r...igh_School_site.html#VFze4dUl1ol0jFb8.99

I read that article last night with disgust. The city's approach to economic development is so — backwards! And then they wonder why they're always broke. I just can't figure out who's worse, Blackwell or Clarke.

[Insoluble]

I'm usually not that that guy that just quotes a post for the picture, but Dayum Volguus! That first shot is sheer beauty!

Originally Posted by volguus zildrohar

Originally Posted by McBane

I read that article last night with disgust. The city's approach to economic development is so — backwards! And then they wonder why they're always broke. I just can't figure out who's worse, Blackwell or Clarke.

Totally agree. There is at least on silver lining to this though:

Jones also said the agreement would limit the number of parking structures that could be built on the site and require that certain of them be wrapped in active uses.

As much as I wish Drexel didn't have to deal with all this — to get this development going, it sounds like the deal they struck at least has some positive aspects. (Please note that I am still vehemently against what Blackwell did!)

[Baconboy007]

^^^

It's the wallpaper on my phone and I've had plenty of people comment on what a great shot it is. Good work

[ILovePhilly]

I think people have made a lot of really great points about the apartment building rental rates. Let's not forget that Center City's overall vacancy rate for apartments is about 2%. I still have a hard time believing that 2116 Chestnut is that full given how many lights I see on in the building but at least this time when I looked online at what was available only 32 units came up... exactly 10% so I might believe the numbers after all.

But here's the thing. Even IF some of those buildings are not as rented as the survey says, even if some people think the 'apartment market is turning soft' and this is the beginning of the end... that's only a small subsection of the rental market in Center City: The crazy effing expensive market. The rest of the neighborhood you have to take an apartment the day you see it or it will be gone the next morning. The rest of the market in the neighborhood you can't negotiate price with a landlord because by the time they are done hanging up the phone somebody else will call to see it. I know the apartment market inside outside upside down from moving several times in the past few years: the market in Center City is NOT going soft. The "luxury" and $1900 a month market may be over supplied, but if you could bring a building on the market with 1-bedroom units at $1300 a month they'd be taken before the water was turned on. (which is why I REALLY want Brandywine to ditch the parking garage at 20th and Market and spread the cost savings across the apartments... it would reduce rents by up to $200 a month per unit! I don't want them to bring another $1900 a month building on the market when even $1700 a month is already in a different range. Ditch the "Italian marble" in the showers and bring it down to $1600 and brag about selling out your building faster than any other apartment building ever in Philadelphia)

There is a difference between what developers will call 'the market' and what the rest of us call apartment hunters will call the market. The developers are talking about 5-10% of the market but I promise you the rest of the market is doing FINE.